Am I the only one who missed the election?

[inode0]

On Mon, Dec 10, 2012 at 12:18 PM, Michael Schwendt <mschwendt at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 10 Dec 2012 10:33:33 -0600, inode0 wrote:
>
>> >> Looks like it was sent to the devel list as well.
>> >>
>> >> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/devel/2012-December/174779.html
>> >
>> > 417 messages in December so far! Too easy to miss the announcement,
>> > if one doesn't pay attention to that list for some time. Even if it's just
>> > for a few days, the elections are not open long enough.
>>
>> Right and the sad truth is that busy people will miss announcements
>> even if they are sent to every single Fedora list.
>
> Well, that's not specific to announcement mails. Some people miss
> everything, ranging from incoming bugzilla reports, dist git commits,
> to personal mail.
>
> Perhaps you should return to the first post that started this thread.
>
> And there is no need to post to "every single Fedora list". Let's use the
> _low-traffic_ moderated lists more appropriately. *I* don't mind adjusting
> my subscription of "announce" list and adjusting the procmail recipe,
> even if subscribing devel-announce is mandatory for packagers. Hopefully
> it will be announced whether the next election announcement will move to
> even another list.

I wasn't suggesting announcements should go to every list. I was
pointing out that no matter where they are made some people will miss
them. It happens every election and I'm quite sure it will happen in
every future election.

>> > Well, could you *please* decide on a list (or a well-defined set of lists)
>> > where to announce _future_ elections for sure?
>>
>> Well, the main announce list seems safe doesn't it?
>
> Safe? In which way? It's opt-in. Unlike devel-announce, which is mandatory.
> What about all devel-announce subscribers, who expect to receive
> election announcements as before?

If you want one list to subscribe to to make sure you see the
announcement that one should be safe. Have elections ever not been
announced on that list? (I think devel-announce should be a subscriber
to announce which would cover both anyway.)

> Reminder: Voting has begun in Fedora Board, FAmSCo, and FESCo elections,
> ends June 7th
> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/devel-announce/2012-June/000937.html
>
> If announcement move to announce list, it would make sense to announce
> that on devel-announce. ;-)
>
>> I'm happy to try to improve it and I agree it would have been better
>> to have sent it to the other announce lists as well. But I do not
>> think that will prevent someone from missing it in the future.
>
> This thread (and my one on test list) are because we were expected
> to learn about the election by paying attention to devel-announce
> where previous elections have been announced.

Ok. As I said I would have preferred that it went to that list too.
I'm sure those involved in making announcements will create an SOP so
the announcement will go wherever people find it useful. But at the
same time I think we should also note that the election bits were
widely announced and for each of the last two elections, regardless of
the devel-announce list, we have heard from one person who didn't
notice them.

My recommendation at this point is to guarantee the announcement will
go to the main announce list. You can be sure you will get it if you
subscribe to that. We will also announce it all over the place as we
always do, on various mailing lists, blogs, social media outlets, etc.
in an attempt to catch the eye of anyone who happens to be watching.

John