<div dir="ltr">Err aren't these *fedora* lists. We show the grub menu.<div>*plonk*</div><div>Clive</div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 5:08 PM, Reindl Harald <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:h.reindl@thelounge.net" target="_blank">h.reindl@thelounge.net</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><br>
<br>
Am 22.09.2013 18:00, schrieb drago01:<br>
<div class="im">> On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 5:41 PM, Reindl Harald <<a href="mailto:h.reindl@thelounge.net">h.reindl@thelounge.net</a>> wrote:<br>
>> Am 22.09.2013 17:36, schrieb drago01:<br>
>>> On Sun, Sep 22, 2013 at 3:21 AM, Reindl Harald <<a href="mailto:h.reindl@thelounge.net">h.reindl@thelounge.net</a>> wrote:<br>
>>>> Am 22.09.2013 02:52, schrieb Ed Greshko:<br>
>>>>> On 09/22/13 08:39, Timothy Murphy wrote:<br>
>>>>>> Ed Greshko wrote:<br>
>>>>>><br>
>>>>>>>> I've been having a problem on my Thinkpad T61 for the last 2 days.<br>
>>>>>>>> In fact since "yum update" installed kernel-PAE-3.11.1-200.fc19.i686,<br>
>>>>>>>> though that is probably a coincidence.<br>
>>>>>>> Would it be possible to boot into the previous kernel to verify if it is a<br>
>>>>>>> coincidence?<br>
>>>>>> I'm afraid I'm not sure how to do that.<br>
>>>>>> I'd be happy to try if someone could suggest the way.<br>
>>>>><br>
>>>>> When you boot your system, don't you have a menu to select up to 3 kernels?<br>
>>>><br>
>>>> and that is why i cried on @devel about the idea to hide the GRUB menu as default<br>
>>><br>
>>> Err you know that we do *not* hide the grub menu in F19?<br>
>><br>
>> no - because i do not care about Fedora defaults in many cases for my machines<br>
><br>
> You seem to care enough to write mails about it.<br>
<br>
</div>yes, becuase i am not that asshole some think and care about others<br>
i wish the future users have the same chance to learn things as i had<br>
in the past<br>
<div class="im"><br>
>>> If anything you have just proven that just because the menu is shown<br>
>>> people will not automatically know what the options there mean.<br>
>><br>
>> no - it is proven that even if it is there it's hard to understand<br>
>> hide it does not make this better<br>
><br>
> Showing an option that people do not understand does not solve anything.<br>
<br>
</div>then *explain* the menu instead hide it<br>
<div class="im"><br>
>>> So can you stop "crying about the idea to hide the GRUB menu as(by)<br>
>>> default" now?<br>
>><br>
>> no, simply because if it is hard to move the cursor down in a<br>
>> already displayed menu for some users you can be sure that they<br>
>> never have a chance to learn about the existing older kernel<br>
>> by hide it<br>
><br>
> You should not have to learn what a kernel is to be able to use your computer<br>
<br>
</div>this makes no sense<br>
<br>
why do you have to learn it?<br>
because there is a menu giving you options?<br>
<br>
does this menu *force* someobody to learn?<br>
how would it be able to demand anything from a user?<br>
<div class="im"><br>
> I am pretty sure you disagree here but we should just agree to<br>
> disagree instead of having a useless "discussion".<br>
<br>
</div>if Fedora Core would have had the same attitude than today i would<br>
never have switched to Linux completly - this boot option where<br>
people say nobody needs to see it saved my first machine and a lot<br>
of time for me because it did not boot after a kernel update and<br>
so i took the only working thing: a menu at begin<br>
<br>
i agree in a perfect world you would not need it<br>
but this perfect world doe snot exist<br>
<br>
but you are not in the position than *anybody* else to guarantee<br>
that a kernel update will never have regresions, not now and not<br>
in the future<br>
<div class="im"><br>
>> if the affected machine is their only one they also have<br>
>> no chance to ask for help and are lost<br>
>><br>
>> P.S.:<br>
>> do not give thunderbird a negative karma because some extension<br>
>> is not updated / rebuilt, file a bugreport for the extension!<br>
><br>
> OT but no. If an update introduces broken deps it should not be pushed<br>
> until they are resolved.<br>
> Giving negative karma here is common practice<br>
<br>
</div>not common, bad practice at least in that case<br>
<br>
<br>--<br>
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Fedora Code of Conduct: <a href="http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct" target="_blank">http://fedoraproject.org/code-of-conduct</a><br></blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br>Clive<br> -- 077222971491
</div>