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<DIV><SPAN class=421242521-13032004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I
am 99% sure that last time I tried Lindows that it does not spew out all
the kernel booting messages. And it seems like some other distro's
(perhaps Lycoris, SuSE?) don't do it either. Perhaps you could look at
them and see how they do it?</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=421242521-13032004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=421242521-13032004><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Didn't
RedHat dumb down KDE for their distribution? It is certainly seems to
be different than it is on other distros/os'es.</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT face=Tahoma
size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B>
fedora-test-list-bounces@redhat.com
[mailto:fedora-test-list-bounces@redhat.com]<B>On Behalf Of </B>Wayne
Frazee<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, March 13, 2004 11:18 AM<BR><B>To:</B>
fedora-test-list@redhat.com<BR><B>Subject:</B> Mainstream
Usability<BR><BR></FONT></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I’m quite sure that I am far from
the first to suggest this but….<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">With the advent of KDE 3.2 and the
latest gnome, the x-based user interface system has reached a level of
usability that would be possible to use by the average user while still
maintaining access to the powerful Linux command line. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Further, improvements in the 2.6 kernel
make the Linux operating system more robust than ever, offering wide-ranging
support for hardware, platforms, and user-needs.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Still, Linux has not really gone
<SPAN class=GramE>mainstream</SPAN>.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">
</SPAN>The features are there, but the operating system is still
intimidating.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Besides the
traditional challenge posed by change, in and of itself, you start your
computer and are assailed by a hundred lines of gibberish (at least to the
average end user) from the kernel loading.<SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Fedora has certainly taken a stride in
the right direction, offering a GUI screen with a progress bar for those who
would like it.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Still, kernel
loading is accomplished by lines upon lines of intimidating text. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Further, not enough time has been put
into building good looking themes and so forth to be included with KDE,
leaving first time users with an impression that the GUI is bland,
etc.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">So what can be done about it?<SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Is it really worth addressing these
points?<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>While for the average
developer here, we just don’t care.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">
</SPAN>I use my fedora boxes more than I do my windows machines.<SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>At this point, I have worked with
Solaris, RHEL, FC1, FC2T1, and I don’t even notice anymore the lack of
polish.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Each time I start a
workstation-configured machine for a client demonstration on console, I am
harshly brought back to the realization that users aren’t used to this level
of output.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>They practically
recoil when they see the kernel load and it gives them a bad impression right
off the bat.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>An impression that
the operating system would be overly complicated to use, that employees would
have trouble training for it.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">
</SPAN>Once a first impression is made, <SPAN class=GramE>its</SPAN> rather
difficult to break as for most clients it tends to color their analysis of the
rest of the system.<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes">
</SPAN><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Please keep in mind that although
I do programming, I have virtually no experience working with the Linux kernel
besides loading modules and so forth. <SPAN
style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>How hard would it be to add perhaps a
parameter to grub as to whether or not to suppress that initial text pre-<SPAN
class=SpellE>gui</SPAN>?<SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Perhaps
offering two modes, one spitting out everything that it does now, the other
perhaps offering more simplified (5 or 8 lines instead of
100):<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">“Loading Fedora Core
1…”<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">“…Init Run Level
1”<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">“…Starting [big
subsystem]”<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">“…Starting [big
subsystem]”<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">“…Init Run Level
5<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Is this something that OSDL would
have to look at? <SPAN style="mso-spacerun: yes"> </SPAN>Certainly the
OS-related art content is not beyond the scope of the Fedora
Project.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-no-proof: yes">--===============--</SPAN></FONT><SPAN
style="mso-no-proof: yes"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-no-proof: yes">Wayne S.
Frazee</SPAN></FONT><SPAN style="mso-no-proof: yes"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial; mso-no-proof: yes">"If debugging
is the process of removing software bugs, then programming must be the process
of putting them in."</SPAN></FONT><SPAN
style="mso-no-proof: yes"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; mso-no-proof: yes"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>