New download pages, brainstorming

[Robert Mayr]

First of all, thank you for your detailled comment, I hoped to read
you in this topic because I know you often have good ideas and the
right views when it comes to apply some changes.

2013/8/29 Máirín Duffy <duffy at fedoraproject.org>:
> On 08/26/2013 09:52 AM, Robert Mayr wrote:
>> 1) Create a drop-down menu on our main page, where we can also add in
>> the next months other important changes (fedoramagazine, features,
>> etc), to help users to find their desired format or spin faster than
>> now. I'm adding a mockup for this here. [2]
>
> This is inconsistent with our website chrome and it blocks banner
> content so I'm not convinced it's the right call.

Ok, I see your concern, do we have other possibilities to make our
fedoraproject.org site really the center of all fedora websites?
If that's not the goal we can also keep it like it is now.

> Are there patterns from other websites you're using to inform this
> design? Or is it gut? I put the term 'screenshots' in 'Features &
> Screenshots' the nav bar because after reviewing dozens of app and OS
> websites, it's a really common thing to have in the primary nav. What
> problem are you trying to solve by pulling it out and putting it in a
> submenu?

Hey Máirín don't worry, all the menu links are only examples, and the
menu is pure CSS, it's rather easy to include it and the instructions
should be the same everywhere. No patterns, just a hide block and
display:block on mouse-over, that's it.

>> 2) Drop the get-fedora-all page completely!
>> This doesn't mean I don't want it's content. I'd think more of having
>> no more duplicates (some spins are available on 2 or more pages) and
>> complete our very nice get-fedora-options page with missing
>> informations.
>
> I don't think duplicate info is a problem. People come to sites with
> different needs in mind - for someone with need a, they might go to the
> one page, person with need b the other page, and the duplicate spins
> might help both.

Yes, all people have different needs, but isn't this the reason why we
should be as clear as possible when linking all the available download
links or architectures? Duplicating links on 3 different pages is not
really what I expect to find, as a new user I expect a download page
which guides me clearly through the various possibilities I have.

>> Finally I'd like to have all spins on spins.fp.o, which means we have
>> to include our spin page better in our main fedoraproject.org site to
>> have the same effect as now.
>
> What do you mean by this? Make it more visible, or integrate it? (I
> think the former is okay, but I don't think we should integrate it at
> all. They are not supported anywhere near the level of the main
> downloads promoted on get.fpo and listing them equally will give a false
> impression.)

Yes I mean more visible, because actually we don't have enough links
to spins.fpo, or better, they are not clearly promoted. I also don't
like having SoaS or Security or whatever on our fedoraproject.org
site. They should stay in spins.fp.o.
The only reason why KDE should remain on fp.o is that it's a main spin.

>> 3) Use the get-fedora page to promote all the shipping methods
>> The clearest method to do so IMHO would be to drop also the right
>> random banners we have on the sidebar (Desktop, 2nd-arches, Cloud,
>> Spins) and to put them into the get-fedora page. See a mockup here
>> [3], althoough it's not complete (obviously I don't want to have the
>> 2nd-arches banner alone there and will make them nicer when writing
>> the code). The banners should link to the tabs in get-fedora-options
>> or to our spins page and give users a clear idea of what is available.
>
> Why would you call out desktop specifically when the desktop edition is
> already there on the page? Why would someone click on 'desktop'? Who are
> you thinking would be looking for that?

That0s the point, you got it. And actually it isn't so much better, we
have Formats and Desktop on one hand, and a unique Desktop Edition on
the other hand. It's already confusing a bit IMHO, but I can also be
wrong of course.

> I can see promoting cloud here, or even giving cloud a box like the
> 'Fedora 19 Desktop Edition' that says 'Fedora 19 Cloud Edition' or
> whatnot. I don't like promoting spins with just a button that says spins
> because people new to fedora have no idea what spins are. I could see
> promoting the arm builds here since arm is pretty relevant and a lot of
> people are talking about it and using it for various devices, but I'm
> not quite sure s390 and ppc builds are really anywhere near as
> interesting or useful to folks browsing this page.

That's a nice idea, we should work on this :)

>> Same for get-pre-release:we can continue to promote it easily on the
>> get-fedora page and we could also advertise it better on our main page
>> (drop down menu).
>
> Who do we want using pre-releases? The site was originally designed with
> the intent of being more of a showroom for users new to or considering
> Fedora. Testers know how to get pre-releases and don't need so much
> guidance.

If we want to have more people testing our pre-releases we have to
make it more visible, perhaps with a red exclamation mark, but we
should have them visible.

>> 4) Sidebar: if we want to go ahead with this kind of restyling we can
>> drop a lot of stuff on our sidebar, like the rotating banners and the
>> events.
>
> Why would we want to drop that content? What problems would that solve?

It's related to the banners on get.fpo, if we put them on get.fpo we
don't need duplicates (again), if not they will stay where they are
now ;)

>> Instead of it why not use something nicer? Badges or social networks
>> for example? Look at this mockup [4], I'd love it.
>
> Do we actually have social media presences in all those venues? (I don't
> think we do) We could put little icons like that for the social media
> presences we do have though and have just one row.

No we don't, it's another example. But we are present in some of them.

> I don't know if the sidebar is a good place for general fedora stuff
> advertising - that is what we have the sliders on the front page for,
> isn't it?

Not really, perhaps badges, but social media in the slider?

>> I have created a dedicated branch (web-dl-redesign) to work on and try
>> to have it all running and ready for production within F20 GA Release.
>>
>> Please let me know your thoughts, your ideas and improvements, I'd be
>> also happy if someone wants to help me with this part of work. Kévin
>> (shaiton) will do the background scripting part (thx) to have our
>> variables running the right way also for a completely new download
>> pages management.
>> And thanks to Maria (tatica) for her drop down menu mockup ;)
>
> Thanks for kicking this off, it's clear we need some kind of change. I
> think we need to talk a bit more about the problems we're trying to
> solve first though.

Yes, I agree. I just put together a few things, would be great if we
can start to discuss if and what we want to change.
Our pages are the same for the last 3 years I think, it's time to make
some changes. And not only from the layout, we need some major changes
also on the content (how manu years do we have the photo-booth with
the green face on our main page?). And for content we'd need some help
;)

>> [3] http://paste.opensuse.org/94023207
>
> With this design in particular, I worry that this design says "nobody
> could make up their mind what is important, so they put everything up
> front."
>
> I don't think this is the right approach.

Agree :)

> We need direction from FESCO or the Board (or both) as to what we should
> be primarily promoting. We cannot promote all 20*n potential downlaods
> we have available equally.

Ok, that's a good point. We could ask to have some statistics and
match them with what we expect in the next years, for example cloud
will have a low percentage but it's potentially a must.

>
> ~m

Again, thanks a lot for your reply, I appreciate it very much.

-- 
Robert Mayr
(robyduck)