F23 Release Documentation

[Keerthana Krishnan]

Hey CommOpsers!

As you know, the Fedora 23 release is almost here. We in Commops are doing
our bit to help with the release notes. And so, please give all your
valuble suggestions for things we should include in them.

Mailga's been working on a version here :
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Mailga

and jflory's got some cool suggestions here :
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announ...

And the beta release announcement is here :
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announ...


to getsome perspective. Please do give us feedback and suggestions to
improve and make the next one better, thanks! :)

keekri
-- 
Keerthana Krishnan
B.Tech Computer Science (2012-16)
Govt. Model Engineering College
Email : contactkeerthana(a)gmail.com
IEEE CS Student Member
Blogger : https://cutencrazyindie.wordpress.com/

[Neville A. Cross]

On Wed, 2015-10-28 at 08:08 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  Hey CommOpsers!
>  
>  As you know, the Fedora 23 release is almost here. We in Commops are
>  doing our bit to help with the release notes. And so, please give all
>  your valuble suggestions for things we should include in them. 
>  
>  Mailga's been working on a version here : 
>  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Mailga
>  
>  and jflory's got some cool suggestions here : https://fedoraproject.o
>  rg/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  
>  And the beta release announcement is here : https://fedoraproject.org
>  /wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  
>  
>  to getsome perspective. Please do give us feedback and suggestions to
>  improve and make the next one better, thanks! :)
>   

I am side tracking here, sorry. But at Flock there was a interesting
talk between wiki team and docs team, which I started by a dumb
question that I made. Which is wiki team objective? This goes back that
we have some how-to in the wiki that should go to docs and some scratch
pads that should go to "what_ever_scratch_collaborative_tool_is_good".
The reason is that there was a lot of work needed in wiki gardening and
maybe we should not piling up more stuff that later will fall into wiki
gardening (old pages, pages that need love, pages that has no links,
and so on...).

This lead to the idea of a wiki tagging effort of good how-to pages
that should become a part of docs. But leaved the idea of scratch-pad
holding without any answer.
 
Thinking from the other side, when a person from outside fedora comes
to wiki landscape finds some info about proposal of software that will
be included at some version with tips at that time, but no follow upfor
new versions. He or she will find also some internal fedora procedures.
So, wiki is a complex mix between wonderful info, cross-reference,
historical facts and random stuff. 

I wonder, it is a task for commops to find a better way to direct our
efforts to put things in the right place, so public can find them more
easily? What should go to wiki? What should go to a scratch-pad? What
should go to calendar?

Neville

[Keerthana Krishnan]

Hi Neville,

Truth to be said, I'd never even thought of some of the things you've said.
But I believe that instead of finding the "right place"
for some information to be held, we could just think about why a person
would want to visit a particular wiki or website and make the experience
the user has with the wiki as entertaining as possible. For example,
I was going through the release statements of previous fedora versions and
I loved the effort put in into F17 : here
<https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F17_release_announcement>
while compared to that of F22 : here
<https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F22_release_announcement> because it's much
more fun. So hopefully, this time, we ca make the release announcement
awesome AND entertaining. :D
keekri

On 28 October 2015 at 22:26, Neville A. Cross <yn1v(a)taygon.com&gt; wrote:

>  On Wed, 2015-10-28 at 08:08 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  > Hey CommOpsers!
>  >
>  > As you know, the Fedora 23 release is almost here. We in Commops are
>  > doing our bit to help with the release notes. And so, please give all
>  > your valuble suggestions for things we should include in them.
>  >
>  > Mailga's been working on a version here :
>  > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Mailga
>  >
>  > and jflory's got some cool suggestions here : https://fedoraproject.o
>  > rg/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  >
>  > And the beta release announcement is here : https://fedoraproject.org
>  > /wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  >
>  >
>  > to getsome perspective. Please do give us feedback and suggestions to
>  > improve and make the next one better, thanks! :)
>  >
>
>
>  I am side tracking here, sorry. But at Flock there was a interesting
>  talk between wiki team and docs team, which I started by a dumb
>  question that I made. Which is wiki team objective? This goes back that
>  we have some how-to in the wiki that should go to docs and some scratch
>  pads that should go to "what_ever_scratch_collaborative_tool_is_good".
>  The reason is that there was a lot of work needed in wiki gardening and
>  maybe we should not piling up more stuff that later will fall into wiki
>  gardening (old pages, pages that need love, pages that has no links,
>  and so on...).
>
>  This lead to the idea of a wiki tagging effort of good how-to pages
>  that should become a part of docs. But leaved the idea of scratch-pad
>  holding without any answer.
>
>  Thinking from the other side, when a person from outside fedora comes
>  to wiki landscape finds some info about proposal of software that will
>  be included at some version with tips at that time, but no follow upfor
>  new versions. He or she will find also some internal fedora procedures.
>  So, wiki is a complex mix between wonderful info, cross-reference,
>  historical facts and random stuff.
>
>  I wonder, it is a task for commops to find a better way to direct our
>  efforts to put things in the right place, so public can find them more
>  easily? What should go to wiki? What should go to a scratch-pad? What
>  should go to calendar?
>
>  Neville
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  commops mailing list
>  commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops
>  


-- 
Keerthana Krishnan
B.Tech Computer Science (2012-16)
Govt. Model Engineering College
Email : contactkeerthana(a)gmail.com
IEEE CS Student Member
Blogger : https://cutencrazyindie.wordpress.com/

[Neville A. Cross]

On Thu, 2015-10-29 at 08:58 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  Hi Neville,
>  
>  Truth to be said, I'd never even thought of some of the things you've
>  said. But I believe that instead of finding the "right place"
>  for some information to be held, we could just think about why a
>  person would want to visit a particular wiki or website and make the
>  experience the user has with the wiki as entertaining as possible.
>  For example,
>  I was going through the release statements of previous fedora
>  versions and I loved the effort put in into F17 : here
>  while compared to that of F22 : here because it's much more fun. So
>  hopefully, this time, we ca make the release announcement awesome AND
>  entertaining. :D
>  keekri
>   
Yes, yes, yes ... when people work systematically we can get amazing
histories from the wiki. It is wonderful and I love that.

Maybe this conversation needs another subject. I am not close minded.
Sometimes for one thing to be in the right place is to be clearly
labeled or clearly mapped. So you can find it easily. We can work in
making using our wiki a better experience for everyone. There is a lot
of wiki gardening to do.

My actual experience is that I ask people for links in the wiki,
because I can not find what I am looking for. And of course, I also
have been ask for some wiki links that I know to share. So, there are
things easy to find and things not that easy to find. 

I am afraid that our beloved wiki is growing as fast as the project,
and every time will be more difficult to find the great info within the
wiki. One of the questions at flock 2015 was about a better search tool
plugin from wikimedia that is not available due some packaging issues
(not sure if it was bundled libraries or a library that has no a
clearly stated license). Practically it is better to do a google search
using the words "fedora" and "wiki" on the search string that
searching
inside the wiki.


So, I will get back to my corner, work on the local release parties
happening on my city. I bring this issue back when is more likely that
we can flesh out what is good and what is not that good, and how we can
improve what is not that good. 

Best regards

Neville




>  On 28 October 2015 at 22:26, Neville A. Cross
> <yn1v(a)taygon.com&gt;
>  wrote:
>  > On Wed, 2015-10-28 at 08:08 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  > > Hey CommOpsers!
>  > >
>  > > As you know, the Fedora 23 release is almost here. We in Commops
>  > are
>  > > doing our bit to help with the release notes. And so, please give
>  > all
>  > > your valuble suggestions for things we should include in them.
>  > >
>  > > Mailga's been working on a version here :
>  > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Mailga
>  > >
>  > > and jflory's got some cool suggestions here : 
>  > https://fedoraproject.o
>  > > rg/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  > >
>  > > And the beta release announcement is here : 
>  > https://fedoraproject.org
>  > > /wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > to getsome perspective. Please do give us feedback and
>  > suggestions to
>  > > improve and make the next one better, thanks! :)
>  > >
>  > 
>  > 
>  > I am side tracking here, sorry. But at Flock there was a
>  > interesting
>  > talk between wiki team and docs team, which I started by a dumb
>  > question that I made. Which is wiki team objective? This goes back
>  > that
>  > we have some how-to in the wiki that should go to docs and some
>  > scratch
>  > pads that should go to
>  > "what_ever_scratch_collaborative_tool_is_good".
>  > The reason is that there was a lot of work needed in wiki gardening
>  > and
>  > maybe we should not piling up more stuff that later will fall into
>  > wiki
>  > gardening (old pages, pages that need love, pages that has no
>  > links,
>  > and so on...).
>  > 
>  > This lead to the idea of a wiki tagging effort of good how-to pages
>  > that should become a part of docs. But leaved the idea of scratch
>  > -pad
>  > holding without any answer.
>  > 
>  > Thinking from the other side, when a person from outside fedora
>  > comes
>  > to wiki landscape finds some info about proposal of software that
>  > will
>  > be included at some version with tips at that time, but no follow
>  > upfor
>  > new versions. He or she will find also some internal fedora
>  > procedures.
>  > So, wiki is a complex mix between wonderful info, cross-reference,
>  > historical facts and random stuff.
>  > 
>  > I wonder, it is a task for commops to find a better way to direct
>  > our
>  > efforts to put things in the right place, so public can find them
>  > more
>  > easily? What should go to wiki? What should go to a scratch-pad?
>  > What
>  > should go to calendar?
>  > 
>  > Neville
>  > 
>  > _______________________________________________
>  > commops mailing list
>  > commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops
>  > 
>  
>  
>  -- 
>  Keerthana Krishnan
>  B.Tech Computer Science (2012-16)
>  Govt. Model Engineering College
>  Email : contactkeerthana(a)gmail.com
>  IEEE CS Student Member
>  Blogger : https://cutencrazyindie.wordpress.com/
>  _______________________________________________
>  commops mailing list
>  commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops

[Keerthana Krishnan]

Hey,

I totally understand where you're coming from. I'm a bit busy this this
week (end) but that should be over by Monday. After that I'll email you
back in this thread. So then, if you could show me instances in the wiki
you feel should be changed( / updated /  made better in any way) I'll do my
best with it as a prideful Commops member :D

I just joined here this week so I'm still somewhat new to this, and you're
probably a lot more experienced, but this place is chock full of waay too
many passionate people that I can't help but try my best too. So I hope
you'll help me and together we can change the world, err.. wiki!! 😁
Regards,
keekri


On 29 October 2015 at 22:29, Neville A. Cross <yn1v(a)taygon.com&gt; wrote:

>  On Thu, 2015-10-29 at 08:58 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  > Hi Neville,
>  >
>  > Truth to be said, I'd never even thought of some of the things you've
>  > said. But I believe that instead of finding the "right place"
>  > for some information to be held, we could just think about why a
>  > person would want to visit a particular wiki or website and make the
>  > experience the user has with the wiki as entertaining as possible.
>  > For example,
>  > I was going through the release statements of previous fedora
>  > versions and I loved the effort put in into F17 : here
>  > while compared to that of F22 : here because it's much more fun. So
>  > hopefully, this time, we ca make the release announcement awesome AND
>  > entertaining. :D
>  > keekri
>  >
>
>  Yes, yes, yes ... when people work systematically we can get amazing
>  histories from the wiki. It is wonderful and I love that.
>
>  Maybe this conversation needs another subject. I am not close minded.
>  Sometimes for one thing to be in the right place is to be clearly
>  labeled or clearly mapped. So you can find it easily. We can work in
>  making using our wiki a better experience for everyone. There is a lot
>  of wiki gardening to do.
>
>  My actual experience is that I ask people for links in the wiki,
>  because I can not find what I am looking for. And of course, I also
>  have been ask for some wiki links that I know to share. So, there are
>  things easy to find and things not that easy to find.
>
>  I am afraid that our beloved wiki is growing as fast as the project,
>  and every time will be more difficult to find the great info within the
>  wiki. One of the questions at flock 2015 was about a better search tool
>  plugin from wikimedia that is not available due some packaging issues
>  (not sure if it was bundled libraries or a library that has no a
>  clearly stated license). Practically it is better to do a google search
>  using the words "fedora" and "wiki" on the search string that
> searching
>  inside the wiki.
>
>
>  So, I will get back to my corner, work on the local release parties
>  happening on my city. I bring this issue back when is more likely that
>  we can flesh out what is good and what is not that good, and how we can
>  improve what is not that good.
>
>  Best regards
>
>  Neville
>
>
>
>
>  > On 28 October 2015 at 22:26, Neville A. Cross <yn1v(a)taygon.com&gt;
>  > wrote:
>  > > On Wed, 2015-10-28 at 08:08 +0530, Keerthana Krishnan wrote:
>  > > > Hey CommOpsers!
>  > > >
>  > > > As you know, the Fedora 23 release is almost here. We in Commops
>  > > are
>  > > > doing our bit to help with the release notes. And so, please give
>  > > all
>  > > > your valuble suggestions for things we should include in them.
>  > > >
>  > > > Mailga's been working on a version here :
>  > > > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User_talk:Mailga
>  > > >
>  > > > and jflory's got some cool suggestions here :
>  > > https://fedoraproject.o
>  > > > rg/wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  > > >
>  > > > And the beta release announcement is here :
>  > > https://fedoraproject.org
>  > > > /wiki/User:Jflory7/Scratchpad/F23_Release_Announcement
>  > > >
>  > > >
>  > > > to getsome perspective. Please do give us feedback and
>  > > suggestions to
>  > > > improve and make the next one better, thanks! :)
>  > > >
>  > >
>  > >
>  > > I am side tracking here, sorry. But at Flock there was a
>  > > interesting
>  > > talk between wiki team and docs team, which I started by a dumb
>  > > question that I made. Which is wiki team objective? This goes back
>  > > that
>  > > we have some how-to in the wiki that should go to docs and some
>  > > scratch
>  > > pads that should go to
>  > > "what_ever_scratch_collaborative_tool_is_good".
>  > > The reason is that there was a lot of work needed in wiki gardening
>  > > and
>  > > maybe we should not piling up more stuff that later will fall into
>  > > wiki
>  > > gardening (old pages, pages that need love, pages that has no
>  > > links,
>  > > and so on...).
>  > >
>  > > This lead to the idea of a wiki tagging effort of good how-to pages
>  > > that should become a part of docs. But leaved the idea of scratch
>  > > -pad
>  > > holding without any answer.
>  > >
>  > > Thinking from the other side, when a person from outside fedora
>  > > comes
>  > > to wiki landscape finds some info about proposal of software that
>  > > will
>  > > be included at some version with tips at that time, but no follow
>  > > upfor
>  > > new versions. He or she will find also some internal fedora
>  > > procedures.
>  > > So, wiki is a complex mix between wonderful info, cross-reference,
>  > > historical facts and random stuff.
>  > >
>  > > I wonder, it is a task for commops to find a better way to direct
>  > > our
>  > > efforts to put things in the right place, so public can find them
>  > > more
>  > > easily? What should go to wiki? What should go to a scratch-pad?
>  > > What
>  > > should go to calendar?
>  > >
>  > > Neville
>  > >
>  > > _______________________________________________
>  > > commops mailing list
>  > > commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops
>  > >
>  >
>  >
>  > --
>  > Keerthana Krishnan
>  > B.Tech Computer Science (2012-16)
>  > Govt. Model Engineering College
>  > Email : contactkeerthana(a)gmail.com
>  > IEEE CS Student Member
>  > Blogger : https://cutencrazyindie.wordpress.com/
>  > _______________________________________________
>  > commops mailing list
>  > commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops
>  _______________________________________________
>  commops mailing list
>  commops(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/commops
>  


-- 
Keerthana Krishnan
B.Tech Computer Science (2012-16)
Govt. Model Engineering College
Email : contactkeerthana(a)gmail.com
IEEE CS Student Member
Blogger : https://cutencrazyindie.wordpress.com/

[Justin W. Flory]

>  I wonder, it is a task for commops to find a better way to direct
> our
>  efforts to put things in the right place, so public can find them more
>  easily? What should go to wiki? What should go to a scratch-pad? What
>  should go to calendar? 
Looking at this, I think it is one of the outreaching goals of the
CommOps team to make information easier to access and manage,
particularly regarding the wiki and internal communications. Part of
internal communications is rethinking of how we as Fedorans actually
communicate (i.e. the act of communicating, not just the tools). In
another sense, the tools are still an important part of this.

So, in short - yes, I do believe it is an objective of ours to work on
centralizing and information and put everything in its right place. This
might be an objective for us to discuss after the rush of the F23
release. If Remy objects to anything I've said, hopefully he can chime
in to correct me.


Cheers,
------------

Justin W. Flory
jflory7(a)gmail.com