About nuancier

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

Hi all,

I have started to work a little more on nuancier.
With the changes that are in the current git, users may log in (via FAS), upload
their wallpaper with a corresponding name, license and author (in case the
author is not the submitter).
When they upload, I restrict the content using the filename (extension), the
mime type of the file and I check for a minimal width (1600px) and height
(1200px).

Admins can then moderate all the candidates and they must justify when they deny
a candidate.
Maybe we could trigger the badge at this stage, when the wallpaper gets
accepted.

The elections are now time-based (so no-one needs to stay awake until the middle
of the night to press the toggle button).

Questions:
- What more is needed when uploading a picture?
- Other ideas in general?
- Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg, jpg, png,
  svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
- Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that we would
  accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
'image/png')

Finally, I have the same restrictions for contributing (uploading a wallpaper)
and for voting. These are: having an account on FAS, have signed the CLA, being
in at least one more group than CLA.
I realize that this is already a change from the current procedure, but I find
it unfair that people that submit a wallpaper cannot vote for themselves. So I
would either stick with these restrictions or open the votes to people that are
in no other group than CLA.

Thoughts on all this?

Cheers,
Pierre

[S.Kemter]

Hi,


2013/12/4 Pierre-Yves Chibon <pingou(a)pingoured.fr&gt;

>  Hi all,
>
>  I have started to work a little more on nuancier.
>  With the changes that are in the current git, users may log in (via FAS),
>  upload
>  their wallpaper with a corresponding name, license and author (in case the
>  author is not the submitter).
>  When they upload, I restrict the content using the filename (extension),
>  the
>  mime type of the file and I check for a minimal width (1600px) and height
>  (1200px).
>  
upload should be possible without FAS, we had because of that a discussion
on F18. Its just that, we need a valid mail address



>  Admins can then moderate all the candidates and they must justify when
>  they deny
>  a candidate.
>  Maybe we could trigger the badge at this stage, when the wallpaper gets
>  accepted.
>  

yes badge should only awarded when the submission is taken, we had this
time a lot of submissions with low quality, think that came as they wanted
a badge :(


>  The elections are now time-based (so no-one needs to stay awake until the
>  middle
>  of the night to press the toggle button).
>  

yeah

>  Questions:
>  - What more is needed when uploading a picture?
>  - Other ideas in general?
>  - Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg, jpg,
>  png,
>    svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
>  - Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that we
>  would
>    accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
> 'image/png')
>
>  Finally, I have the same restrictions for contributing (uploading a
>  wallpaper)
>  and for voting. These are: having an account on FAS, have signed the CLA,
>  being
>  in at least one more group than CLA.
>  I realize that this is already a change from the current procedure, but I
>  find
>  it unfair that people that submit a wallpaper cannot vote for themselves.
>  So I
>  would either stick with these restrictions or open the votes to people
>  that are
>  in no other group than CLA.
>  
now, we want to prevent that people just signing up for this vote. I could
live with an extra group where submitters end up an can vote but open it
totally to the public I think is not a good idea. We already made the
process more open


br gnokii

>  Thoughts on all this?
>
>  Cheers,
>  Pierre
>  _______________________________________________
>  design-team mailing list
>  design-team(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team 



-- 
make me rich, buy my Inkscape book http://is.gd/yq5OD0 ;)

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Thu, Dec 05, 2013 at 02:09:53AM +0100, S.Kemter wrote:
>     Hi,
>  
>     2013/12/4 Pierre-Yves Chibon <pingou(a)pingoured.fr&gt;
>  
>       Hi all,
>  
>       I have started to work a little more on nuancier.
>       With the changes that are in the current git, users may log in (via
>       FAS), upload
>       their wallpaper with a corresponding name, license and author (in case
>       the
>       author is not the submitter).
>       When they upload, I restrict the content using the filename (extension),
>       the
>       mime type of the file and I check for a minimal width (1600px) and
>       height
>       (1200px).
>  
>     upload should be possible without FAS, we had because of that a discussion
>     on F18. Its just that, we need a valid mail address 
We could make it so that you provide an email address on upload and receive a
link to validate the address by email.
But that's quite a larger change.

The wiki page does not say only a valid email address but also having signed CLA
and that I will not emulate on nuancier.

>       Admins can then moderate all the candidates and they must
> justify when
>       they deny
>       a candidate.
>       Maybe we could trigger the badge at this stage, when the wallpaper gets
>       accepted.
>  
>     yes badge should only awarded when the submission is taken, we had this
>     time a lot of submissions with low quality, think that came as they wanted
>     a badge :( 
My problem with this statement is what do you define low quality? The image size
is now automatically checked, is left all the trademark, subject and composition
aspects, but two of these three are likely quite subjectives criteria...
Anyway, I think providing the badges on approved candidates is what makes the
most sense.

>       Questions:
>       - What more is needed when uploading a picture?
>       - Other ideas in general?
>       - Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg,
>       jpg, png,
>         svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
>       - Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that
>       we would
>         accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
> 'image/png')
>  
>       Finally, I have the same restrictions for contributing (uploading a
>       wallpaper)
>       and for voting. These are: having an account on FAS, have signed the
>       CLA, being
>       in at least one more group than CLA.
>       I realize that this is already a change from the current procedure, but
>       I find
>       it unfair that people that submit a wallpaper cannot vote for
>       themselves. So I
>       would either stick with these restrictions or open the votes to people
>       that are
>       in no other group than CLA.
>  
>     now, we want to prevent that people just signing up for this vote. I could
>     live with an extra group where submitters end up an can vote but open it
>     totally to the public I think is not a good idea. We already made the
>     process more open 
Is that really a problem? Do we really expect a jump in participation?
I mean 128 person voted on the last one, do we care if we get 200 next time
because we did not impose CLA+1?
To be honest, I am not sure I mind and I would find it fair that the people that
submit their artwork can vote on it, that, at least, you are sure your submission
get at least one vote!

Pierre

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Wed, Dec 04, 2013 at 05:36:06PM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  I have started to work a little more on nuancier. 
[...]
>  Questions:
>  - What more is needed when uploading a picture?
>  - Other ideas in general?
>  - Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg, jpg, png,
>    svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
>  - Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that we would
>    accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
> 'image/png') 
The new code is running at: http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/
Please poke at it and report any issues, I do expect you will run into some
things related to the last two points mentionned above.


Looking forward for your feedbacks,

Pierre

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Mon, Dec 09, 2013 at 11:03:21AM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  On Wed, Dec 04, 2013 at 05:36:06PM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  > I have started to work a little more on nuancier.
>  [...]
>  > Questions:
>  > - What more is needed when uploading a picture?
>  > - Other ideas in general?
>  > - Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg, jpg, png,
>  >   svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
>  > - Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that we would
>  >   accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
> 'image/png')
>  
>  The new code is running at: http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/
>  Please poke at it and report any issues, I do expect you will run into some
>  things related to the last two points mentionned above.
>  
>  
>  Looking forward for your feedbacks, 
Seeing the bugs I fixed today, I guess there has been too much testing, but they
are fixed or are they? can you find them again? ;-)


Cheers,
Pierre

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Mon, Dec 09, 2013 at 11:03:21AM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  On Wed, Dec 04, 2013 at 05:36:06PM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  > I have started to work a little more on nuancier.
>  [...]
>  > Questions:
>  > - What more is needed when uploading a picture?
>  > - Other ideas in general?
>  > - Could we come up with a list of extensions accepted? (I have jpeg, jpg, png,
>  >   svg atm and I check them lower case, so JPEG will pass)
>  > - Similarly could we come up with a list of MIME types for images that we would
>  >   accept? (Atm I have only: 'image/jpeg', 'image/jpg',
> 'image/png')
>  
>  The new code is running at: http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/
>  Please poke at it and report any issues, I do expect you will run into some
>  things related to the last two points mentionned above. 
Just a small annoucement, I renamed the nuancier-lite project into nuancier
after having merged the commits from Jen.

Let me know what you think of the new version :)


Cheers,
Pierre

[Kirk Bridger]

Hi Pierre,

I tried uploading an image but nothing seems to be active (the upload 
just seemed to finish quietly and nothing happened).  Am I missing how 
to add a new election or is that not a permission I have, or am I just 
blind?  ;)

Kirk


On 12/17/2013 03:15 AM, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  Just a small annoucement, I renamed the nuancier-lite project into
> nuancier
>  after having merged the commits from Jen.
>
>  Let me know what you think of the new version :)
>

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 09:04:17AM -0800, Kirk Bridger wrote:
>  Hi Pierre,
>  
>  I tried uploading an image but nothing seems to be active (the
>  upload just seemed to finish quietly and nothing happened).  Am I
>  missing how to add a new election or is that not a permission I
>  have, or am I just blind?  ;) 
Hi Kirk,

Thanks for looking at it.

You probably do not have the rights to create a new election, but you should be
able to contribute/participate into the existing one:
http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/contribute/ (see the link at the bottom)

If the upload finishes quietly w/o any output then we probably have a problem.
The information message/error normally appear at the top, just under the menu
bar.

I don't see anything in the logs, so I don't know if anything went wrong.

Cheers,
Pierre

[Kirk Bridger]

I tried earlier uploading to the existing election.  I tried using ~4MB 
jpg.  It failed silently as far as I could see.

So I tried just now with a small image ~0.5MB jpg.  I saw a bullet point 
appear at the top of the page saying the image was below minimum width.  
Two things:

1 - Could that error text be made more obvious?  Coloured? Highlighted?
2 - Could image minimums be provided on the upload page so I know ahead 
of time when choosing the image?

I tried again with the same image as the first time, noting that last 
time I did not give it a name (assuming the fields are all optional as 
no indication as to what is required on the form).  This time I gave it 
a name 'test'.  After waiting for it to upload I see a red bullet at the 
top telling me the name 'test' has already been used.  Good that it is 
visible as an error message.  Suggestions:

3 - Could that kind of uniqueness be checked prior to upload rather than 
waiting 1 minute and then having it fail?  Or does the filename even 
matter?  If so how - not clear on the page.  Could we randomly append 
some characters if it doesn't matter?
4 - After seeing that error I just changed the name and clicked submit.  
Problem was the image file was lost on the form and I didn't know I had 
to re-choose the image to upload.  Is it possible to just allow them to 
change the name and re-submit?  If not could it be made more obvious 
that the file must be re-selected and re-uploaded?
5 - Could the filename be on the left of the browse button?  I think web 
patterns for uploading are that the object is on the left and the action 
on the right.  If no file is selected perhaps some simple text to 
indicate that e.g. "Please select the file you wish to upload." or 
something.
6 - Can the page allow multiple files to be picked?  Or is that a future 
feature?

I added some random characters to the name and re-submitted the image.  
This time it seems to have worked, as I am taken to another page with a 
bullet item thanking me for the submission (looks like it took me to 
Home and added the bullet item to the top). Suggestions:

7 - Can it be made more obvious that the upload was a success?

It looks like the first time I tried, the lack of a filename made it 
fail silently.  So I think it is really important that the requiredness 
of each field is indicated and enforced prior to uploading.

Finally the license is a text field - does it make sense to have it be a 
dropdown of acceptable licenses?  Or is it just the one option?  In 
either case a link to the license descriptions seems helpful.  If it is 
just the one option then disable the text box to make it more obvious 
the user has no choice (or just make it text with a link to more info).

I hope this is helpful Pierre, before I dive any deeper I'll pause to 
see if this is useful feedback or not.  We can also take this off-list 
into IRC or something if I'm being too verbose here or I'm being unclear.

Thanks for the chance to look at it - really like how it is coming 
together so quickly!

Kirk



On 12/17/2013 09:58 AM, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 09:04:17AM -0800, Kirk Bridger wrote:
> > Hi Pierre,
> >
> > I tried uploading an image but nothing seems to be active (the
> > upload just seemed to finish quietly and nothing happened).  Am I
> > missing how to add a new election or is that not a permission I
> > have, or am I just blind?  ;)
>  Hi Kirk,
>
>  Thanks for looking at it.
>
>  You probably do not have the rights to create a new election, but you should be
>  able to contribute/participate into the existing one:
>  http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/contribute/ (see the link at the bottom)
>
>  If the upload finishes quietly w/o any output then we probably have a problem.
>  The information message/error normally appear at the top, just under the menu
>  bar.
>
>  I don't see anything in the logs, so I don't know if anything went wrong.
>
>  Cheers,
>  Pierre
>  _______________________________________________
>  design-team mailing list
>  design-team(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

Hi Kirk,

So I'm gonna start by the end, this is really good testing and feed-backs,
thanks a lot!

Now let's dive in :)

On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 10:43:30AM -0800, Kirk Bridger wrote:
>  So I tried just now with a small image ~0.5MB jpg.  I saw a bullet
>  point appear at the top of the page saying the image was below
>  minimum width.  Two things:
>  
>  1 - Could that error text be made more obvious?  Coloured? Highlighted? 
There were inconsistencies in the css class used, now all the errors appear in
red.

>  2 - Could image minimums be provided on the upload page so I know
>  ahead of time when choosing the image? 
This is present in the contribute page:
http://209.132.184.188/nuancier/contribute/
See section 'Technical requirements'. I'm not sure yet about repeating the
info
on the submission page a second time, I'll think more about it.
One of the issues being of course that if we change the requirements that's two
places to update instead of one, another is that people might skip the longer
list of requirements because we also provide a shorter one.

>  I tried again with the same image as the first time, noting that
>  last time I did not give it a name (assuming the fields are all
>  optional as no indication as to what is required on the form). 
Ok, I had done something wrong in the forms, now it will tell you if one of the
mandatory field is missing.

>  3 - Could that kind of uniqueness be checked prior to upload rather
>  than waiting 1 minute and then having it fail? 
Unfortunately not really, you submit the whole form at once.

>  Or does the filename
>  even matter?  If so how - not clear on the page.  Could we randomly
>  append some characters if it doesn't matter? 
The name is in fact the title of the image.
If you hover over the images on the actual page, that's what you'll see:
https://apps.fedoraproject.org/nuancier/election/1/

Maybe renaming the field from 'Name' to 'Title' would help.

>  4 - After seeing that error I just changed the name and clicked
>  submit.  Problem was the image file was lost on the form and I
>  didn't know I had to re-choose the image to upload.  Is it possible
>  to just allow them to change the name and re-submit?  If not could
>  it be made more obvious that the file must be re-selected and
>  re-uploaded? 
Here again, with the form now fixed, if one field is missing it will let you
know.

>  5 - Could the filename be on the left of the browse button?  I think
>  web patterns for uploading are that the object is on the left and
>  the action on the right.  If no file is selected perhaps some simple
>  text to indicate that e.g. "Please select the file you wish to
>  upload." or something. 
I can look into switching the places sure.

>  6 - Can the page allow multiple files to be picked?  Or is that a
>  future feature? 
I do not think this will come, at least clearly not for the next release.

>  I added some random characters to the name and re-submitted the
>  image.  This time it seems to have worked, as I am taken to another
>  page with a bullet item thanking me for the submission (looks like
>  it took me to Home and added the bullet item to the top).
>  Suggestions:
>  
>  7 - Can it be made more obvious that the upload was a success? 
Normal (as in not warning nor error) information message are now displayed in
green.

>  Finally the license is a text field - does it make sense to have it
>  be a dropdown of acceptable licenses?  Or is it just the one option?
>  In either case a link to the license descriptions seems helpful.  If
>  it is just the one option then disable the text box to make it more
>  obvious the user has no choice (or just make it text with a link to
>  more info). 
If we can come up with the list of all the acceptable licenses, I'll be glad to
change this text field into a drop-down list.
In the meanwhile, CC-BY-SA is the default license but we let the contributor
change it to whatever license they prefer and the admin will be able to
allow/reject submission also based on the license used.

I'll try to fix the 'Browse' <-> 'file name' position and push
the changes to
the server as well.


Thanks again for the feedbacks,
Pierre

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 09:35:19AM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  > 5 - Could the filename be on the left of the browse button?  I
> think
>  > web patterns for uploading are that the object is on the left and
>  > the action on the right.  If no file is selected perhaps some simple
>  > text to indicate that e.g. "Please select the file you wish to
>  > upload." or something.
>  
>  I can look into switching the places sure. 
Ok, after looking more closely into this, I cannot change it.
The html itself is just:
  <input id="candidate_file" name="candidate_file"
type="file">
So it's all automatically converted by your browser to render it the way it is
now.

So, sorry but for that one, it's a "no can't do" :)

Cheers,
Pierre

[S.Kemter]

Hi,

First of all, I am still not convinced to get the pressure back to have an
FAS account for an submission, we agreed for F19 that that would be not
necessary but we had no way arround as you need one for the wiki. So there
was only two who used the way to send me something and I submitted it to
the wiki.

How would be that way, submitter can be do both without FAS and with, if he
does with an account we could create a fas group for the submitters so they
would be automatic end in in and had in this way the necessary group for
vote. In that way we would ensure that everybody can submit and that the
voting becomes a little bit more free.

for "home"

* can we show last election winners there? Looks better to me

for the rules:

* comfortaa is bad to read
* I fear that kind of presentation of them frightened the people, can we
find another way for it?

for the submision:

* name != author, we have submitters who submit work of others so its an
bad idea, to autofill the author field from the FAS, so for that case we
need some more fields
* it's unclear that the name for the submission is meant with that
* tried to upload a file with the name "test" took endless long and failed,
can we rename them with "name-by-author-size.*" that is what has do be done
anyway
* the upload takes way to long, fear we have to do the test after the
upload otherwise, somebody with a lot of submissions will break up after a
few

as the question for the licenses already came up

CC0
CC-BY
CC-BY-SA
DSL
Free Art

but here please no autofill! So when dropdown, with an empty field and that
should not allowed, so that the submitter has to choose!


Review:

* for what purpose is the text field on the end?
* if I deny to take it will it generate a mail? Would be cool then to give
the submitter why I had to disqualify it
* notices would be also cool, so have to make the decission not on one day
and can communicate


should be all for now


br gnokii



2013/12/18 Pierre-Yves Chibon <pingou(a)pingoured.fr&gt;

>  On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 09:35:19AM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  > > 5 - Could the filename be on the left of the browse button?  I think
>  > > web patterns for uploading are that the object is on the left and
>  > > the action on the right.  If no file is selected perhaps some simple
>  > > text to indicate that e.g. "Please select the file you wish to
>  > > upload." or something.
>  >
>  > I can look into switching the places sure.
>
>  Ok, after looking more closely into this, I cannot change it.
>  The html itself is just:
>    <input id="candidate_file" name="candidate_file"
> type="file">
>  So it's all automatically converted by your browser to render it the way
>  it is
>  now.
>
>  So, sorry but for that one, it's a "no can't do" :)
>
>  Cheers,
>  Pierre
>  _______________________________________________
>  design-team mailing list
>  design-team(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team
>  


-- 
make me rich, buy my Inkscape book http://is.gd/yq5OD0 ;)

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 01:40:44PM +0100, S.Kemter wrote:
>     First of all, I am still not convinced to get the pressure back to
> have an
>     FAS account for an submission, we agreed for F19 that that would be not
>     necessary but we had no way arround as you need one for the wiki. So there
>     was only two who used the way to send me something and I submitted it to
>     the wiki. 
Well you can still submit the file in the name of someone else.

>     How would be that way, submitter can be do both without FAS and
> with, if
>     he does with an account we could create a fas group for the submitters so
>     they would be automatic end in in and had in this way the necessary group
>     for vote. In that way we would ensure that everybody can submit and that
>     the voting becomes a little bit more free. 


>     for "home"
>  
>     * can we show last election winners there? Looks better to me 
Some sort of slide show I guess?

>     for the rules:
>     * comfortaa is bad to read 
I used it because it was on the mockups, I am fine with using the standard
fonts.

>     * I fear that kind of presentation of them frightened the people,
> can we
>     find another way for it? 
Suggestions/patches/mockup welcome

>     for the submision:
>     * name != author, we have submitters who submit work of others so its an
>     bad idea, to autofill the author field from the FAS, so for that case we
>     need some more fields 
Author is intended to be the actual author of the artwork, the submitter is the
person that actually submits the file. Both should be on the review page and I
see now they are not, let me fix this.

>     * it's unclear that the name for the submission is meant with
> that 
Would 'Title' be better? (see previous discussion with Kirk)

>     * tried to upload a file with the name "test" took
> endless long and
>     failed, can we rename them with "name-by-author-size.*" that is what has
>     do be done anyway 
See above.
Otherwise, I can think of 2 options:
1) we can split the submission onto two pages but I don't think that this is nice.
2) I add a 'test submission' button that checks if the title is unique and
inform the user if it is not.

>     * the upload takes way to long, fear we have to do the test after
> the
>     upload otherwise, somebody with a lot of submissions will break up after a
>     few 
See above.
The file is uploaded as part of the form, so I cannot check before if the data
submitted is valid or not.

>     as the question for the licenses already came up
>  
>     CC0
>     CC-BY
>     CC-BY-SA
>     DSL
>     Free Art 
No other licenses are accepted?

>     but here please no autofill! So when dropdown, with an empty field
> and
>     that should not allowed, so that the submitter has to choose! 
Well CC-BY-SA will be the default (first) option.

>     Review:
>  
>     * for what purpose is the text field on the end? 
Explain why a candidate is rejected

>     * if I deny to take it will it generate a mail? Would be cool then
> to give
>     the submitter why I had to disqualify it 
Can be done, but then I need an email, which comes back to the discussion of who
is allowed to submit/vote.

>     * notices would be also cool, so have to make the decission not on
> one day
>     and can communicate 
notices? I am not sure I understand your idea here, could you explain a little
more?


Thanks for the feedback, I'm gonna fix the recording of the 'submitter' right
now.

Pierre

[Pierre-Yves Chibon]

On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 02:14:01PM +0100, Pierre-Yves Chibon wrote:
>  On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 01:40:44PM +0100, S.Kemter wrote:
>  Author is intended to be the actual author of the artwork, the submitter is the
>  person that actually submits the file. Both should be on the review page and I
>  see now they are not, let me fix this.
>  
>  >    * it's unclear that the name for the submission is meant with that 
This is now fixed.


Pierre