At flock, a few people talked about a new web application for voting on wallpapers. Jenneh produced some mockups and we discussed how we might go about implementing them in time to do wallpaper voting for F20 or F21 in the new app.
For those new or returning to this, I'm posting this as a short summary of where various bits are and what's currently done and (/me crosses fingers) hopefully achievable:
One idea at flock was to have something based on the mockups deployable in time for the wallpaper voting. At flock we talked about whether we could create something that just implemented the parts that made the ballot and voting smooth for people using the application and worrying about the rest of the app (notably, the admin interface and submitting the wallpapers) until later so that we could get it out in time for the next election. This would be somewhat tight scheduling but pingou's been working on some code and he thinks we can hit that deadline.
After the initial rush is off, we would want to try to finish the other parts of the interface and release all of that as nuancier. We would also start to think about how to share code between nuancier and the new elections application that fchiulli has been working on at this time -- whether that would be to merge the two together or to move some code into a library that either application could access... We're not sure precisely whether tight or lose coupling of the two is the best plan but there's definitely room to share some of the implementation.
We currently have two repos of direct concern to the application:
* https://github.com/fedora-infra/nuancier * https://github.com/fedora-infra/nuancier-lite
The nuancier repo has the mockups. I think we're eventually going to want to merge everything into this repo.
The nuancier-lite repo has pingou's work to implement the minimal interface that we'll need if we're going to deploy in time for F20 voting.
There's also the new elections code (rewritten from TurboGears1 to flask) if anyone wants to consider sharing code/theming/etc -- but that's a little ways off yet (we won't be merging anything in time for F20's wallpaper election). It lives here:
* https://github.com/fedora-infra/elections
-Toshio
Pingou has created a dev instance to demo nuancier-lite:
http://209.132.184.207/nuancier/
It should be complete enough to host the F20 wallpaper elections at this point. Feedback, patches, and requests for enhancements to be done in time for that election are welcomed :-)
-Toshio
/me simply loves it!
I think maybe the selection check box could be styled so is more obvious that you need to click there (or simply adding a text next to the checkbox that says "hey, click here to vote" ) or something less elaborated.
Besides that, I think it's completely fantastic!
2013/9/4 Toshio Kuratomi a.badger@gmail.com
Pingou has created a dev instance to demo nuancier-lite:
http://209.132.184.207/nuancier/
It should be complete enough to host the F20 wallpaper elections at this point. Feedback, patches, and requests for enhancements to be done in time for that election are welcomed :-)
-Toshio _______________________________________________ design-team mailing list design-team@lists.fedoraproject.org https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team
Hi,
First of all, pingou that's an amazing work, well done.
Now there are some voices, that say doing a second page if you have selected to much isnt the best way. Well I am more in favor of it as I can do in this way sorting first out all the stuff that isnt really good and then select the ones I really think that are the best. Thinking thats the best way with a huge amount of submissions, we will have this time I think something around 100 submissions but with Nuancier running for the next one, I think the submissions will definitely increase as a lot of people have no problems anymore with submitting to the wiki and need no account anymore.
Now, we could try to do something most of us can agree or we can use what we have now and try what the users think about and change it later as we concentrate right now only on the voting and all the others things will be written later.
So what you think sticking with it like it is now or try to improve it?
br gnokii
2013/9/5 María Leandro tatica@fedoraproject.org
/me simply loves it!
I think maybe the selection check box could be styled so is more obvious that you need to click there (or simply adding a text next to the checkbox that says "hey, click here to vote" ) or something less elaborated.
Besides that, I think it's completely fantastic!
2013/9/4 Toshio Kuratomi a.badger@gmail.com
Pingou has created a dev instance to demo nuancier-lite:
http://209.132.184.207/nuancier/
It should be complete enough to host the F20 wallpaper elections at this point. Feedback, patches, and requests for enhancements to be done in time for that election are welcomed :-)
-Toshio _______________________________________________ design-team mailing list design-team@lists.fedoraproject.org https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team
-- tatica Maria Gracia Leandro http://www.tatica.org http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:tatica LinuxUser= 440285 GPG Public Key: E1CDCC56
design-team mailing list design-team@lists.fedoraproject.org https://lists.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/design-team
On Sat 07 Sep 2013 11:53:00 AM EDT, S.Kemter wrote:
Now there are some voices, that say doing a second page if you have selected to much isnt the best way.
Jenneh and I talked about this in IRC a couple of weeks ago and I had thought we were in agreement that the two-step process is really not the best way. The core problem with the two-step method is that you're setting the user up to enter into an error condition. The max number of votes is not enforced in the selection mechanism, so you're setting a trap for the user to select more wallpapers than you allow, and then basically telling them on the second screen that they are wrong. Avoiding placing the user into an error condition is one of those key heuristics of interface design you don't ever want to violate.
Plus, having a 'vote' button on the first screen makes it seem as if you're entering in your final vote. Some people might hit vote, then go somewhere else, and not realize until their session has timed out that their vote didn't actually go through. (You could probably address this by relabeling the button, "Review Selections" or something like this. But that's confusing too. I made my selections, why are you forcing me to review them?
Having a selection preview in the same page as your voting eliminates this extraneous step and also visually makes clear the user's state (votes left, no votes left).
Having the second step is also inconsistent in that if you select exactly 16 wallpapers, you'll never hit that screen, right? If the point is to give people a place to further refine over their selections, that needs to be advertised much better otherwise there are users who will never hit it and get that benefit. (This would then re-spin the 'error condition' into being a 'feature')
Well I am more in favor of it as I can do in this way sorting first out all the stuff that isnt really good and then select the ones I really think that are the best. Thinking thats the best way with a huge amount of submissions, we will have this time I think something around 100 submissions but with Nuancier running for the next one, I think the submissions will definitely increase as a lot of people have no problems anymore with submitting to the wiki and need no account anymore.
Now, we could try to do something most of us can agree or we can use what we have now and try what the users think about and change it later as we concentrate right now only on the voting and all the others things will be written later.
So what you think sticking with it like it is now or try to improve it?
I think no matter which design we ultimately choose, the state it's in now definitely needs refinement.
At the very least, if it's to stay using the same two-step model, I think:
- The "Vote" button on the first screen needs to be relabeled. I suggest "Finalize Selections" or "Finalize Vote." Or even "Step 2: Refine Selections"
- The first page should say something like, "Click on as many of the wallpapers as you like below. You'll finalize your selections in the next step." And if the user happens to pick 16 exactly, how would you treat step 2? I don't even know... because then they're putting in a real vote, not finalizing their selection. Maybe the text of the button changes depending on the state? So if you pick exactly 16 it says "Vote" but if you pick more than 16 it says "Refine Selections" ?? But buttons changing labels is confusing too...
It seems like the problem you're wanting to be solved is: within a massive number of images, how can you pick within your limit when you like more wallpapers than the limit allows and you're not sure which should make it?
The thing is, the mockup Ryan did solves this problem - your selections are always viewable on the screen. If they aren't when you scroll, they should be - the pane should be fixed. It's basically like having the second page viewable on the first page.
The other thing in Ryan's design which makes the selection task easier is that he mocked it up with only 5 selections allowed. Limiting the wallpaper selection to 5 means people are only going to pick those wallpapers they are the very most excited about, and it's going to be easier for them to pick them because they don't have as many slots to worry about. You might worry that letting people pick 5 means we won't have enough wallpapers voted for to make 16 for the package, but if we have > 100 wallpapers to choose from, the probability that our users would pick the same 5 over and over is really low. The more wallpapers, the lower the probability. 16 selections is a pretty high cognitive load.
~m
I agree with Máirín's comments - well stated! It feels like there is a feature here that hasn't been defined as such: the ability for me to choose any number of images as "Maybe's" and then have a second round of choosing/narrowing down. I think it could be a compelling feature but it is not needed to get a first version out.
I support the focus on having a single round of choosing/voting with a visual tray where my votes appear while I'm voting. Keep the choices on the screen while I'm reviewing so I can remove something if I find something I like more. Máirín understates it when she says 16 is a "high" cognitive load. People can struggle with remembering 4 or 5 items. Screen real estate for 16 images is fairly large if they are sized so I can see the thumbnails adequately. I'd support the idea of reducing the vote count, but maybe that could be made configurable in the system (in a later release)?
Kirk
On 09/07/2013 07:59 PM, Máirín Duffy wrote:
Jenneh and I talked about this in IRC a couple of weeks ago and I had thought we were in agreement that the two-step process is really not the best way.
<snip>
The other thing in Ryan's design which makes the selection task easier is that he mocked it up with only 5 selections allowed. Limiting the wallpaper selection to 5 means people are only going to pick those wallpapers they are the very most excited about, and it's going to be easier for them to pick them because they don't have as many slots to worry about. You might worry that letting people pick 5 means we won't have enough wallpapers voted for to make 16 for the package, but if we have > 100 wallpapers to choose from, the probability that our users would pick the same 5 over and over is really low. The more wallpapers, the lower the probability. 16 selections is a pretty high cognitive load.
~m
design-team@lists.fedoraproject.org
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Kirk Bridger -
María Leandro -
Máirín Duffy -
S.Kemter -
Toshio Kuratomi