June 2015 - desktop - Fedora mailing-lists

In Fedora22, GCC not enabled the -fstack-protector by default, why?
by 乱雪 29 Jun '15

29 Jun '15

Such as: // x.c #include <stdio.h> int main(void) { char x[] = "abc"; printf("%s\n", x); return 0; } and using GCC compile it: ➜ gcc x.c -v ...... /usr/libexec/gcc/x86_64-redhat-linux/5.1.1/cc1 -quiet -v x.c -quiet -dumpbase x.c -mtune=generic -march=x86-64 -auxbase x -version -o /tmp/ccqowh4f.s ...... as you see, GCC not enabled the -fstack-protector by default. And in Ubuntu: ➜ gcc x.c -v /usr/lib/gcc/x86_64-linux-gnu/4.6/cc1 -quiet -v -imultilib . -imultiarch x86_64-linux-gnu x.c -quiet -dumpbase x.c -mtune=generic -march=x86-64 -auxbase x -version -fstack-protector -o /tmp/cc0aswkw.s the enabled the -fstack-protector by default. why?

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Fwd: Submission deadline for Changes of Fedora 23
by Paul W. Frields 26 Jun '15

26 Jun '15

Do we have system wide changes still to file for F23? ISTM we have a few contenders that are not yet listed in the proposed changes[1] list: * Integrating distro upgrade * D-Bus activation in gnome-session? (does this affect non-GNOME?) * Boxes import OVF/OVA (iff. this affects Fedora deliverables, either new requirements, or which can be dropped) * Live USB changes -- since this affects e.g. docs/websites, possibly a marketing angle [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/23/ChangeSet -- Paul ----- Forwarded message from Jan Kurik <jkurik(a)redhat.com> ----- Date: Tue, 16 Jun 2015 08:39:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Jan Kurik <jkurik(a)redhat.com> To: devel-announce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org Subject: Submission deadline for Changes of Fedora 23 X-Mailer: Zimbra 8.0.6_GA_5922 (ZimbraWebClient - FF38 (Linux)/8.0.6_GA_5922) X-BeenThere: devel-announce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org Hi everyone! Changes submission deadline for Fedora 23 [1] is coming pretty soon - in one week on June 23rd. With Alpha release in August. Please, submit your System Wide Changes by this deadline, earlier better. As the deadline mainly applies for System Wide changes it is always good to have most of Self Contained Changes proposed as well. In case you'll need any help with your Change proposals, feel free to contact me. Best Regards, Jan [1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/23/Schedule -- Jan Kuřík _______________________________________________ devel-announce mailing list devel-announce(a)lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/devel-announce ----- End forwarded message -----

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Re: Do not disturb mode in F22/Gnome 3.16
by Norman L Smith 23 Jun '15

23 Jun '15

I have written a simple extension to provide a Do Not Disturb Button. I have cc'ed Ankur Sinha and Heiko Adams. I ask they test the extension to insure it is adequate for their needs. If I receive a positive response I will upload it to the ego site. The following instructions should be all that is needed to test. I suspect they may be a bit pedantic but here goes... $ git clone https://github.com/nls1729/acme-code.git $ cd acme-code/donotdisturb-button@nls1729 $ make zip-file The file donotdisturb-button(a)nls1729.zip should be found in the current directory. Execute the gnome-tweak-tool (Tweak Tool). Extensions -> Install Shell Extension Navigate to directory containing donotdisturb-button(a)nls1729.zip. Open Log out and log in. Execute the gnome-tweak-tool (Tweak Tool). Extensions Find "Do not disturb button" Set to ON A new button should appear on the left top panel. The button can be toggled with the mouse or keyboard. The extension should function with the Screen Shield and Screen Lock. If the button is set to busy and notifications are received. Toggling the button to available will display the queued notifications. If notifications are received during Screen Lock or Screen Shield the queued notifications can be displayed on the Notification Section of the Calendar. Please let known what you think. Norman

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Workstation WG Recap 2015-June-22
by Michael Catanzaro 22 Jun '15

22 Jun '15

We wound up leaving early since the only people present were myself, Kalev, and Jens. Please folks, set your calendars, alarms, and roosters as needed. We're not going to make any grand decisions with the Great Leader^W^W Paul on vacation, but we should still be able to have a quorum and an effective meeting. Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06 -22/workstation.2015-06-22-13.02.html Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06 -22/workstation.2015-06-22-13.02.txt Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06 -22/workstation.2015-06-22-13.02.log.html =============================== #fedora-meeting: Workstation WG =============================== Meeting started by mcatanzaro at 13:02:33 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06 -22/workstation.2015-06-22-13.02.log.html . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call! (mcatanzaro, 13:02:49) * xdg-app (mcatanzaro, 13:08:35) * We need more folks present to discuss whether or how Fedora will integrate xdg-app. Defer until the next meeting. (mcatanzaro, 13:14:57) Meeting ended at 13:15:10 UTC. Action Items ------------ Action Items, by person ----------------------- * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * mcatanzaro (16) * zodbot (4) * kalev (4) * juhp_ (3) * Corey84 (2) * rdieter (0) * juhp (0) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot

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Call for agenda for Workstation WG meeting 2015-Jun-22
by Michael Catanzaro 20 Jun '15

20 Jun '15

Next meeting is Monday, 2015-June-22 at 1300 UTC/9:00am US-EDT. Agenda additions are welcome. * xdg-app discussion

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Fedora runtime and apps (again)
by Alexander Larsson 19 Jun '15

19 Jun '15

Hi, it's me again. I've been doing some more work on a fedora-based runtime and apps for xdg-app. First of all I've cleaned up the runtime itself. It is now consists of a new rpm, "fedora-runtime"[1], which has a bunch of requires for all the packages which are supposed to be in the runtime, as well as some special configuration (ld.so, fontconfig) needed in the runtime. There is also a fedora-sdk rpm which pulls in fedora-runtime + dnf and a few development tools. I've built these rpms in the copr here: https://copr.fedoraproject.org/coprs/alexl/fedora-runtime/ This means that the rpm-ostree json file[2] which describes the runtime is super-trivial, as it just has the f22 repo and the copr repo, and lists just the fedora-runtime package. See If you have rpm-ostree-2015.6-2.fc22 installed (in koji for f22) all you have to do is check out https://github.com/alexlarsson/fedora-runtime and run "make" (or something like "make PROXY="--proxy=http://127.0.0.1:8123" if you have a http proxy set up). If you just want to test this i've updated the repo at http://people.redhat.com/~alexl/repo/ You should be able to test it (and the evince demo app i built) by installing xdg-app 0.3.1 (in updates-testing) and doing: xdg-app add-remote --no-gpg-verify --user fedora http://people.redhat.com/~alexl/repo/ xdg-app install-runtime --user fedora org.fedoraproject.Platform 22 xdg-app install-app --user fedora org.gnome.evince xdg-app run org.gnome.evince I've also done various kinds of experiments with creating applications from existing fedora packages. In the end I realized that the only sane way to make it work is to rebuild the packages with a custom rpm setup that has %{_prefix} as "/app" and some other stuff. So, i set up a mock configuration[3] that lets you easily rebuild packages in /app. It mostly sets rpm macros and environment variables so that things build, although I had to make changes to some packages (rpm to make brp -compress compress inside /app, and check-rpaths to make rpaths in /app/lib* ok, and pkg-config to be able to override .pc variables[4]). These packages are in the copr above, so the mock config will automatically pick them up. There are also some simple scripts running mock in the git repo, so you can easily rebuild an app from srpms. Here is how I built the evince app: for srpm in ghostscript-9.16-2.fc22.src.rpm ghostscript-fonts-5.50-33.fc21.src.rpm poppler-data-0.4.7-3.fc22.src.rpm poppler-0.30.0-3.fc22.src.rpm libspectre-0.2.7-5.fc22.src.rpm libgxps-0.2.2-11.fc22.src.rpm gnome-desktop3-3.16.2-1.fc22.src.rpm evince-3.16.1-1.fc22.src.rpm; do ./build-srpm.sh srpms/$srpm done xdg-app build-init evincedir org.gnome.evince org.fedoraproject.Sdk org.fedoraproject.Platform 22 ./build-app.sh evince evincedir xdg-app build-finish --command=evince --socket=x11 --filesystem=host evincedir xdg-app build-export /some/repo evincedir All the srpms I rebuilt for evince worked as-is when rebuilt in /app, but I'm pretty sure some specfiles may need minor tweaks to fully support building in a different prefix, and we still need to rename the desktop files to the app-ids for the exports to work. Is this work something we as a project are interested in doing? [1] https://github.com/alexlarsson/fedora-runtime/blob/master/specfiles/fedora-… [2] https://github.com/alexlarsson/fedora-runtime/blob/master/fedora-runtime.js… [3] https://github.com/alexlarsson/fedora-runtime/blob/master/fedora-app-22-x86… [4] https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=90917 -- =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Alexander Larsson Red Hat, Inc alexl(a)redhat.com alexander.larsson(a)gmail.com He's an ungodly devious dog-catcher searching for his wife's true killer. She's a transdimensional renegade schoolgirl in the wrong place at the wrong time. They fight crime!

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RFC: Fedora 22 workstation flyer
by Ankur Sinha 17 Jun '15

17 Jun '15

Hello, I've updated the workstation flyer for Fedora 22. Could you folks please have a look at it and suggest improvements and things? A "notumble" version so you can read the text easily: https://ankursinha.fedorapeople.org/fedora-flyer-workstation/fedora -flyer-workstation-notumble.pdf This is how it'll actually look: https://ankursinha.fedorapeople.org/fedora-flyer-workstation/fedora -flyer-workstation-tumble.pdf -- Thanks, Regards, Ankur Sinha "FranciscoD" http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha

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Do not disturb mode in F22/Gnome 3.16
by Ankur Sinha 17 Jun '15

17 Jun '15

Hi, I just realised this - the "busy"/"do not disturb mode" isn't in Gnome 3.16. Before, when notifications were still at the bottom, there was a button that let the user set the notifications on silent. It was really convenient, and if I remember correctly, it even set the empathy status to "busy". Any chance this could be added, or any chance it's there and I just haven't found it? At the moment, the only way I can find of emulating this behaviour is to go to notifications in settings and turn off "notification banners". -- Thanks, Regards, Ankur Sinha "FranciscoD" http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha

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Chair needed for next two WG meetings
by Paul W. Frields 16 Jun '15

16 Jun '15

The WG is scheduled for the following upcoming meetings: 13:00 UTC Monday 2015-Jun-22 13:00 UTC Monday 2015-Jul-06 I'll be on vacation and unavailable for these meetings, so we need someone to chair each. It needn't be the same person. Volunteers? -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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automount of a volume has wrong permissions, can't open files
by Chris Murphy 16 Jun '15

16 Jun '15

I have files on an HFS+ volume that were created on OS X. When I'm in Fedora 22, applications give me permissions errors when trying to open them. I have to go to the CLI to fix this, there's no way to do it in the GUI. Obviously this shouldn't happen, so it's a bug. But, I can't figure out which component's bug. What actually instigates automount in GNOME, and does it tell udisks2 what permissions to use when automounting? That determines if it's some GNOME component or if it's udisks2 or maybe something else. # journalctl Jun 15 21:18:15 f22m.localdomain udisksd[1272]: Mounted /dev/sda5 at /run/media/chris/temphfs on behalf of uid 1000 # mount /dev/sda5 on /run/media/chris/temphfs type hfsplus (rw,nosuid,nodev,relatime,umask=22,uid=0,gid=0,nls=utf8,uhelper=udisks2) [chris@f22m temphfs]$ ls -lhd /run/media/chris/temphfs/ drwxr-xr-x. 1 root root 9 Jun 15 20:12 /run/media/chris/temphfs/ [chris@f22m temphfs]$ getfacl /run/media/chris/temphfs/ getfacl: Removing leading '/' from absolute path names # file: run/media/chris/temphfs/ # owner: root # group: root user::rwx group::r-x other::r-x Thanks, -- Chris Murphy

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F23 changes and the workstation
by Matthias Clasen 14 Jun '15

14 Jun '15

I haven't been following the F23 change proposals very closely, so I was a little surprised when I found that the 'default local dns resolver' feature as currently implemented will affect the workstation quite a bit, despite what the Change page claims ("It is not something a user would notice"). I think we should take a look at other changes that are in the queue for F23 with an eye towards unexpected surprises like that.

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concern over fedora's meeting videos
by kendell clark 12 Jun '15

12 Jun '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 hi all The subject is kind of vague, so I'll try to clarify. In order to participate in video meetings with fedora's council or anyone else that uses it, you currently have to use google hangouts. I'm not averse to this even though it's closed source software, but there's still a rather concerning issue. Currently, I believe, I don't know for sure, but I think the only way to do this is by installing either google chrome or chromium. This wouldn't be a problem, except that chrome and chromium provide no accessibility support. That is, orca, the main linux screen reader, cannot get at the contents of web pages to read them. This can be fixed by installing an addon to chrome/chromium called chromevox, which is a screen reader specifically designed for chrome. This isn't a major problem, except that until this is done, a blind person cannot use chrome. The procedure for doing this isn't at all intuitive. You have to go to the chrome app store, type in chromevox, and install it. After this, chrome will be accessible. This isn't easy to do in fedora, largely because fedora doesn't feature chromium, and I object to chrome's license. I'm not writing in to complain, but just to ask if there are any plans in place to migrate away from something that requires a specific web browser to participate in? If this were doable in firefox or any derivitives, this would not be an issue, because firefox and it's spinoffs are accessible to orca. Thanks Kendell clark -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJVeM1DAAoJEGYgJ5/kqBTdCsgQAJ3DwNNEHMO6FiSxGWejwZTV sfR1JoqGfPPoH/sWhMiQHfkSdCsvDpn4M0t5/5v2iZnYbThU1drqVra6PF5PvMde LyPt++RMnvW1KH6eybV0lYaEPRs9PCG8bp0ugwmeXgE+oh4W7bvgGxuUR2cjFirY EkzCSHUIZBjX9QTPCU9ACf8156CLxfhcvTAt9cumjJTeJBrygHrEusCCx6cFfJ7z jqPJ2WLx/4B6viiadewRlAzH1+3oG664QaGG5YjZQA49PBpZzHSKO0SKDDNXF+eV MR8kPcWPnsGbzmUzubXfhCHgc/lr7tsMWcJKnHgTYtE5PfRmKlP9OB/6lWaXYYHH 4kL7lTIZIcjLOIgH41H5mpx3Z90LBgBVqOPJOFE7HY2UfWwnp8DGbqB5IVfIpoll dVaUE6Z2aqw1jNNDQfCRYuuilQzavvG9XNFN1A8lTQfJGihIxXypk+Ye+ybFug6E LTpvtcU06eG41NOEbr4xlFfprXf/r67gCsRYZinmGbm3uuq+ad1iI7zx2GwDbpX5 HUDdyq6oeVrORy4Yq3LqU61AVMhzNVVuccLHhf0ndTSxgUIBp6hvhwogN3EMh4kt 1KwzKZPMCJgt4JoY6kfBMPSa51iSijPFjGSvzo0Ldil8qb/Ea0YVjYoZACMfcf6W 3R/okAoJqu/2us+xkYQh =YgLi -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Council report
by Paul W. Frields 11 Jun '15

11 Jun '15

I produced the following supplementary wiki page to go with the small PRD refresh. Because the PRD is not changing drastically, and was written with a fairly long horizon in mind, some work has been done, other work still remains. The Council report here adds a bit of detail, hopefully without going to the point of duplicating too much of our release points: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation/2015_report_to_Council -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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Patent-free software where it makes sense
by Alex Puchades 11 Jun '15

11 Jun '15

Hi, my name is Alex and I've been a Fedora user for a long time. Also, I'm quite new to this list. I know a lot of people (myself included) that agree with Fedora not integrating propietary software into the system, as Ubuntu does in many different ways, especially in the installer. To put things clear, I'd never advocate for that. However, there's one issue I think deserves a little more consideration. There is another kind of software that is perfectly fine free software but is also excluded from a default Fedora install. That is, patent encumbered software. As you know, there are some patents that are not valid outside USA (ie: subpixel rendering, MP3). That software is provided in third-party repositories like RPMFusion in the form of "-freetype" packages. The lack-by-default of these packages presents a clear usability issue for non-quite-that-technical users and it greatly hurts the user experience for everyone. So, is there any way that Fedora could enforce this patent-free position where it makes sense (the USA), but includes it (or at least gives the user the option at installation time) if allowed by local laws? -- Álex Puchades

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LAS F22 review - summary
by Ankur Sinha 10 Jun '15

10 Jun '15

Hi, The LAS reviewed F22 recently (the F22 review starts at about 1:07:00)[1]. They had quite a few good things to say and some suggestions on the issue that they ran into. Just forwarding them here FYI :) Positives: - Ease of setting up on-line accounts etc - Notifications that tell you what you need but don't disturb you - Network captive portal that comes up automatically - Gnome software and the work done to make apps available in it - Focus that the rings approach brings - DNF works well - Improvements to anaconda - FedUp redesign works well (although I've read that fedup will be dropped from F23) - Server product defaults to XFS Issues: - After login on the captive portal, no indication that you've been connected (he said his wife would've gotten stuck there, for example, since she'd assume the captive portal is the browser itself). Suggestion was that the captive portal closes once the user has logged in and connection to the internet established. - GDM Wayland on some Nvidia cards didn't work - documented on the common bugs page, though, with a workaround. - Global dark themes seem incomplete - text and text boxes are both black, so text can't be read easily - needs the user to tweak to fix. [1] http://www.jupiterbroadcasting.com/83032/fedora-22-review-las-367/ -- Thanks, Regards, Ankur Sinha "FranciscoD" http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/User:Ankursinha

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Font rendering, 2015
by Matthew Miller 10 Jun '15

10 Jun '15

Okay, so, here we go again with this... well, actually, hoping *not* to, but one specific thing keeps coming up. As far as I know, the patents affecting freetype expired, and the "freetype-freeworld" package from third party repositories no longer has any special sauce. Yet, I still see people swearing up and down that this makes a big difference, it's included in "making fonts in Fedora look good" guides everywhere — even though that patent expiration was now long ago. And I see that in RPMFusion, the "freetype-freeworld" package still exists and is regularly updated. So, what's going on with this? My uneducated guess is that the "freeworld" package simply enables autohinting that we have off by default and does not contain any magic sauce. Is this correct? (On the other hand "Infinality" is a set of patches to Freetype, and appears specifically tuned for various sets of non-free fonts.) -- Matthew Miller <mattdm(a)fedoraproject.org> Fedora Project Leader

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Fedora.next PRD refresh
by Stephen Gallagher 09 Jun '15

09 Jun '15

== Overview == Back at the beginning of the Fedora.next initiative when we created the working groups, we tasked them with creating "Product Requirement Documents" (PRDs) to guide the development of each of these core groups. * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation/Workstation_PRD * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Env_and_Stacks/Product_Requirements_Doc ument * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Cloud/Cloud_PRD?rd=Cloud_PRD * https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Server/Product_Requirements_Document More than a year has passed and the Fedora Council feels that it's a good time to give another pass at these documents and re-align them, both with the current reality and the next phase of this process. Additionally, the Council feels that it would be good to perform such a re-alignment and update each year. This year, we have set an admittedly short deadline: the PRDs need to be updated and ready for review on June 12th (11 days from now). In the future, this will be scheduled further in advance and with more time to address it (see below). == What do we have to do? == There are two things that should be done during a PRD refresh exercise (though their implementation is left as an exercise to the Working Groups). 1) Review the PRD for plans that are outdated. Some examples: * Support for CPU architectures that no longer make sense * Features that have been de-prioritized or indefinitely deferred * References to technology that has been replaced or obsoleted 2) Add new plans and requirements for the evolving technology. Some possible examples: * Fedora Cloud commits to producing an implementation of the Nulecule Container Specification * Fedora Server commits to producing Server Roles that can be migrated to a Fedora Atomic deployment * Fedora Workstation integrates seamlessly with a self- or publicly -hosted ownCloud deployment. (Optional): The PRD review period may be an excellent time for those WGs with persistent membership to evaluate whether it is time to refresh the WG membership as well. == Future PRD Refreshes == Starting at Flock 2016 (yes, *next* calendar year), each working group will have a workshop scheduled at Flock to go over its PRD and plan for the following year. Note: because Flock generally falls between Alpha and Beta of a Fedora release, all PRD planning is presumed to be a directive for Fedora N+1 and N+2 at that time, not retroactively applied to the current release. The workshops are expected to cover the majority of the update, and then they will be brought back to the respective mailing lists for further review before being due to the Council one month after Flock concludes.

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Workstation WG Recap 2015-Jun-08
by Paul W. Frields 08 Jun '15

08 Jun '15

Minutes: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06-08/workstation.2015… Minutes (text): http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06-08/workstation.2015… Log: http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06-08/workstation.2015… * * * =============================== #fedora-meeting: Workstation WG =============================== Meeting started by stickster at 13:00:01 UTC. The full logs are available at http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2015-06-08/workstation.2015… . Meeting summary --------------- * Roll call! (stickster, 13:00:09) * PRD refresh (stickster, 13:04:02) * LINK: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/pipermail/desktop/2015-June/012419.html (juhp_, 13:09:47) * IDEA: Future discussion: How to make developer software/tools/docs more discoverable at first login (stickster, 13:20:11) * IDEA: Add to PRD: A set of important third party apps are installable -- (tested/verified before Beta) (stickster, 13:23:45) * LINK: http://pkgs.fedoraproject.org/cgit/intellij-idea.git/ -- retired. (stickster, 13:24:40) * IDEA: work xdg-app into technical specification or relevant roadmap document (stickster, 13:46:07) * LINK: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Workstation/2015_report_to_Council (stickster, 13:49:28) * Contributions to that page will be gratefully accepted (stickster, 13:50:53) * ACTION: stickster Make changes to Workstation PRD page based on mcatanzaro contributions (stickster, 13:51:32) * ACTION: stickster Start assembling Council report at above link, and note to list for WG member contributions (stickster, 13:57:11) Meeting ended at 13:57:51 UTC. Action Items ------------ * stickster Make changes to Workstation PRD page based on mcatanzaro contributions * stickster Start assembling Council report at above link, and note to list for WG member contributions Action Items, by person ----------------------- * mcatanzaro * stickster Make changes to Workstation PRD page based on mcatanzaro contributions * stickster * stickster Make changes to Workstation PRD page based on mcatanzaro contributions * stickster Start assembling Council report at above link, and note to list for WG member contributions * **UNASSIGNED** * (none) People Present (lines said) --------------------------- * stickster (68) * mclasen_ (23) * mcatanzaro (18) * kalev (15) * cschalle (11) * juhp_ (6) * zodbot (5) * rdieter (4) Generated by `MeetBot`_ 0.1.4 .. _`MeetBot`: http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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alsa-firmware missing from major desktop spins
by Enrico Tagliavini 07 Jun '15

07 Jun '15

Hi there, I've just done a fresh install of Fedora 22 KDE spin on a Dell Alienware 15 and stumbled upon a very weird issue: audio works, but volume control is broken. This is due to alsa-firmware being missing from the default installation group. Had a quick chat with Rex Dieter (rdieter) in #fedora-kde and he told me: <rdieter_work> commit 320e6ccc3b524a5146daafe7717cdc18598d97e6 Author: Peter Robinson <pbrobinson(a)gmail.com> Date: Sat May 31 21:02:43 2014 +0100 <rdieter_work> make alsa-firmware optional. It supports a tiny collection of specialist devices and adds reasonable size to minimal images but I wonder if this is still the case. Currently it seems there are root@alientux ~ # rpm -ql alsa-firmware | grep '^/lib/firmware' | awk -F / '{print $4}' | uniq | wc -l 19 drivers and about root@alientux ~ # rpm -ql alsa-firmware | grep '^/lib/firmware' | grep '\..\+$' | wc -l 100 firmware files. I can agree that most of them might not be very common, but it doesn't sound very good not to give people with such hardware a sub-optimal out of the box experience. My specific case: root@alientux ~ # lspci | grep Audio 00:03.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation Xeon E3-1200 v3/4th Gen Core Processor HD Audio Controller (rev 06) 00:1b.0 Audio device: Intel Corporation 8 Series/C220 Series Chipset High Definition Audio Controller (rev 05) which means snd_hda_intel with creative chip. The driver requires firmware file ctefx.bin to work correctly. The minimal image size argument is still very valid in my opinion. People using this kind of minimal images are unlikely to have this hardware. However people installing Workstation or KDE spins are 1. interested in having a good out of the box hardware support 2. possibly are not expert enough to know about dmesg or firmware packages (not I'm a professional SysAdmin, and still this turned out not to be trivial mostly due to cluttered dmesg because of the wireless driver ath10k having massive problems with firmware) 3. size matter less for these images. They are over 1 GB already and the entire alsa-firmware package is 11 MB on disk. I would like to ask for your opinion and possibly bring alsa-firmware back by default for the proper use cases (mainly desktop spins). Best regards. Enrico Tagliavini

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proposal: provide more complete freedesktop sound theme support compatibility in gnome
by kendell clark 06 Jun '15

06 Jun '15

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA512 hi all I've been thinking on this for a while, and I think this is something gnome should do well. Gnome's support for the freedesktop sound theme standard is a little incomplete. The sounds that currently play are, desktop-login, hardware-added, hardware-removed, power-plug, power-unplug, terminal-bell for when you've reached the end of a line or end of a list. It's possible that the chat sounds play, but in my experience they only work if the application you're using supports sounds, and then it uses it's own. Incoming and outgoing call might also work, I've never gotten a call that triggered any sounds. New mail sounds also work. I've verified this by installing a different sound theme, known as fresh and clean, which has lots more sounds than the basic freedesktop one does. Incidentally, I really hope that gnome can add back the ability to choose a different sound theme in the sound control panel. Taking it out was a bad idea. I'd be happy to help anyone who is interested in improving this, I know a little bit about the freedesktop sound theme spec. These are just suggestions, But I can start working on it if anyone is interested. I'm not exactly sure what component needs changing, perhapse the libgsound library? I think this fits into gnome's goal of being a user friendly desktop, especially since sounds are useful for the visually impaired. Thoughts, suggestions? Thanks Kendell clark -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v2 iQIcBAEBCgAGBQJVcjrdAAoJEGYgJ5/kqBTdpbsQAII7L0nban0FuIf0liWZYiqX Wok+U1nD3nMZpA32dE5u+lWoOxJMia+BmZSmt9isvcmlGQHGpCIZmPiAITgjC8oY +kJPgchzTGiMhA01rB0lU5XyYFWBp5mOYa6tyQp+MgIoN9A1Ho4LWYCQBujJVl6s kno1Ph4lN3WW9HL/dyk0Vo4S0uDGW4FCgOPO6rwNON65rsXEZCxz9ToHnEG7PMai G38MNUHJhG5zyNgMCz3q0m0T/t0fT/YJlEZwO0qXv0PmwlpwCl+JZu1q4cMq6ct2 eUCYSJz4CyYAP9eanxdXyQt/rePxH0Y1HHfWWeQpyBrJHRbWutV+dRvmIiALzgUw B6PLCxedhiA803U5frt8gR9xS9Wr6z2+4gjGj/ykA0y2GEuo25P7BVyKJopBm5MH O8A7RXwl5b2UQnIDuPJTKQOqA9nv+uHwyeKisJYI2QNL7XBmUQNgecmlRLctrrfz jDyG+fyg46KJp9Y0zvAaMw3wwOJf0KluyswZfkvfZ85W1R3WRsgPSQYxgYj4VtGm PZ3Z1LYajI2WiG/+E5/icrfKBE99RYoycpaXGLz/zO2CPkZR9NuFRHRud47WqYli o4LEXh6G9JdN/kfqrGOPVTQRUJvOnLyIPjdi05plmjXfgzxKXBzV3dMS/vU9fZSx KT9z6GxuqdyddFhrsne3 =1f+s -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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Call for agenda for Workstation WG meeting 2015-Jun-07
by Paul W. Frields 05 Jun '15

05 Jun '15

Next meeting is Monday, 2015-June-07 at 1300 UTC/9:00am US-EDT. PRD changes/Council report (due 12th!) * See mcatanzaro proposals on list for PRD changes * Do we have any other changes? * Status of existing efforts (mclasen) Mcatanzaro also made a number of good points for technical work toward F23/24. However, I think we need to break those apart here on list and figure out which we (and/or upstream) are pursuing and how. I think doing that in a meeting isn't super-productive, until we have a specific question we need to answer. But still accepting other agenda suggestions here. -- Paul W. Frields http://paul.frields.org/ gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233 5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717 http://redhat.com/ - - - - http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/ The open source story continues to grow: http://opensource.com

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Feedback KDE Spin
by Stefano Di Martino 05 Jun '15

05 Jun '15

Hi everyone, I would like to give you some Feedback to the KDE Spin of Fedora. First, I experienced the KDE spin always as worst KDE integration of all Linux distributions. Not only because of the visual experience, but also because of bugs which I didn't experience in other distributions. I installed KDE 5 on Fedora 21 from a foreign repository. It was a vanilla KDE. It run smoothly and well and it was beautiful. After I downloaded the KDE spin of Fedora 22, I not only experienced a visually ugly KDE with Fedora theme, but bugs, too. I couldn't resize the window to a custom size. There was no mouse cursor indicating, that I could resize the window when I moved the mouse cursor the the corner of the window. After playing a bit, Fedora just freezed. I thought, I could give Fedora a try by upgrading it to version 22, but I am experiencing now a slower KDE start (not boot time) and after hibernate and resuming, I experienced a freeze again which I hadn't with Fedora 21 and KDE 5.3 from the foreign repository. Now my request: Couldn't you just install a vanilla KDE without any patches which makes it worse?! That would be great and you would have less work! :) Best regards, Stefano

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Re: Fedora.next PRD refresh
by cxpcman 04 Jun '15

04 Jun '15

Enviado desde Samsung Mobile de Telcel -------- Original message -------- From: Michael Catanzaro <mcatanzaro(a)gnome.org> Date: 04/06/2015 7:41 AM (GMT-08:00) To: desktop(a)lists.fedoraproject.org Subject: Re: Fedora.next PRD refresh Proposed changes: Under Target Audience, General, after "Desktop apps should be sufficient to make this system the user's only computer," insert a new paragraph: "Developers are not expected to be familiar with the terminal. Users should not be required to use the terminal for essential tasks, including software development." Under Target Audience, Other users, replace the first sentence with "While our focus is on creating a top-class developer workstation, our developer focus will not compromise the aforementioned goal to be a polished and user friendly system that can appeal to a wide general audience." Replace the final sentence with "We will welcome feedback and requests from all our users and will consider accommodating it when possible." Under Develop application guidelines and designs, replace the entire section with "Fedora Workstation follows the GNOME Human Interface Guidelines. These guidelines are mandatory for applications that are installed by default. Third-party software developers are encouraged to follow them too." Under Delivery Mechanism, replace the final sentence with "The product will be offered for installation via either live or netinstall ISO images." Under Packaging for the Workstation", remove the sentence "No software will be blocked from being packaged as long as it doesn't break any part of the core workstation system upon install," or remove the packaging committee that enforces our quality standards. :) Comments on other sections: Robust Upgrades: "Upgrading the system multiple times through the upgrade process should give a result that is the same as an original install of Fedora Workstation. Upgrade should be a safe and process that never leaves the system needing manual intervention." We violated this rule quite badly for the upgrade from F21 to F22. For example, the default font on ttys is different for fresh installs than for upgrades, and fresh installs use xorg-x11-drv-libinput whereas upgrades do not. I still agree with Owen that this is a desirable goal, so maybe we can keep it as-is and just accept that we haven't made progress on it yet. Better upgrade/rollback control: We haven't really made progress on this, either. I want to add a section specifying that regular updates should follow similar QA policies as releases (we can clump the updates together into monthly updates packs), but I guess that might be controversial. I'm not sure about the Work Model section. It doesn't seem to accurately reflect how we operate. "The working group will also regularly meet with a designated representative of Red Hat to discuss how Red Hats product and development plans will affect the Fedora product development and resource allocation." I guess we don't need to remove this per se, since Christian kind of fills that role, but it also doesn't seem to accurately reflect how we operate. -- desktop mailing list desktop(a)lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/desktop

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Anaconda wishlist
by Michael Catanzaro 04 Jun '15

04 Jun '15

Hi, I put together a desired installation experience wishlist. Let's discuss and consider forwarding this to the Anaconda developers as a request. * Remove the timezone selection spoke. This spoke is redundant with gnome-initial-setup. * Remove or simplify the network configuration spoke. In the live installer, this spoke allows setting only the system hostname, but it follows different rules for setting the hostname than GNOME/systemd. The spoke should either follow hostnamed's rules for pretty hostnames (i.e. allows capital letters, spaces, etc. without any complaint), or the spoke should be removed. If we keep it, it should allow the user to set a "computer name" (avoiding technical terminology like "hostname") and should not include the phrase "network configuration." * Remove root password configuration. It's confusing how this is different from the user's admin account password. Advanced users can set a root password after installation if desired. * Remove user account creation. This is redundant with gnome-initial -setup. * Remove hub and spokes: simply go straight to keyboard layout selection after language selection, then from there to disk layout, optionally from there to the hostname panel, and then to the installation progress panel. This last panel will need a bit of a redesign, since it will be pretty empty otherwise. Clearly this is mostly a list of things to remove, rather than things to add. The goal is to make installation as simple and easy as possible. Changes to gnome-initial-setup: Skip language and keyboard layout selection in user creation mode. These panels cannot reasonably be removed from Anaconda, so we should use them only in existing user mode (when a new user account is created after installation). They're redundant in user creation mode. This proposal leaves the disk layout spoke untouched, which is the most confusing portion of the installation experience, but it's more than enough changes for one release already. Thoughts?

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Significant drop in ABRT reports in F22
by Jiri Eischmann 02 Jun '15

02 Jun '15

Hi, I regularly go through most frequent problems reported to ABRT retrace server because it helps me prioritize bugs in Fedora that are assigned to my team. I've noticed a significant drop in number of reports in Fedora 22. It's just two weeks before the final release when many early adopters are already running F22, but the difference in number of reports from F21 and F22 is huge: 64373:904. 12 days before F21 was released, we collected 16081 reports from this version. That's almost 18x more. I don't think we're experiencing such a huge drop in adoption, so I investigated more. I found out several things which I think are a cause of this: 1) I upgraded my machine, and the new Problem Reporting in Privacy Settings is set not to do automatic reporting, completely ignoring my settings in ABRT from F21. 2) I checked settings in ABRT and automatic settings was enabled, so I thought something was broken because my crashes were not reported automatically. Then (with the help of Jakub Filak) I found out that this had been overridden by the new settings in Privacy. 3) Users are no longer asked if they want to enable automatic reporting when the first crash happens. So unless despite complete lack of any hints they find their way into Privacy settings their crashes are not reported. I can no longer even make ureports manually by clicking on Report in notifications. To report it, I need to do the full BZ report. With such a decrease in number of reports, ABRT is much less useful to developers and I think we should fix it: * privacy settings should reflect my settings from ABRT after upgrade. * settings in ABRT and Control Center should be in sync, I understand that the Privacy is master settings overriding app's settings, but there is only one app reporting and it's very confusing for users. * users should be asked if they want to enable automatic reporting after the first crash like in the last. Jiri

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