Looks like GNOME 40 won't be just another number — there's a significant update to the Overview, with in particular workspaces moved from vertical to horizontal. And it looks like the dash goes at the bottom now?
The changes look well-thought through and sensible, but it's also the most significant change to the GNOME 3 UI in a long time.
The GNOME blog here https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/ is a good start, but I think we should plan to have some Fedora Magazine articles about this as well.
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 12:02 PM Matthew Miller mattdm@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Looks like GNOME 40 won't be just another number — there's a significant update to the Overview, with in particular workspaces moved from vertical to horizontal. And it looks like the dash goes at the bottom now?
The changes look well-thought through and sensible, but it's also the most significant change to the GNOME 3 UI in a long time.
That's what was said when GNOME 3 UI was in development...
The GNOME blog here https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/ is a good start, but I think we should plan to have some Fedora Magazine articles about this as well.
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
*sighs*
-- 真実はいつも一つ!/ Always, there's only one truth!
On Sat, Dec 19, 2020 at 12:08:49PM -0500, Neal Gompa wrote:
Looks like GNOME 40 won't be just another number — there's a significant update to the Overview, with in particular workspaces moved from vertical to horizontal. And it looks like the dash goes at the bottom now? The changes look well-thought through and sensible, but it's also the most significant change to the GNOME 3 UI in a long time.
That's what was said when GNOME 3 UI was in development...
Well, this is clearly less of a shift than that. But, yeah: we've got a good thing going.
Matthew Miller mattdm@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Looks like GNOME 40 won't be just another number — there's a significant update to the Overview, with in particular workspaces moved from vertical to horizontal. And it looks like the dash goes at the bottom now?
The changes look well-thought through and sensible, but it's also the most significant change to the GNOME 3 UI in a long time.
The GNOME blog here https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/ is a good start, but I think we should plan to have some Fedora Magazine articles about this as well.
I'm happy to help with this, and with coordination in general. Just let me know if there's anyone I should be speaking to.
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
Bit too early for that, really - nothing's landed in master yet.
Allan
On Tue, 2020-12-22 at 11:20 +0000, Allan Day wrote:
Matthew Miller mattdm@fedoraproject.org wrote:
[SNIP]
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
Bit too early for that, really - nothing's landed in master yet.
True, it is too early to answer the specific question. The answer to the more general question, whether there are plans (and resources) to create such an extension (or option), might still be interesting though.
Benjamin
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Benjamin Berg bberg@redhat.com wrote: ...
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
Bit too early for that, really - nothing's landed in master yet.
True, it is too early to answer the specific question. The answer to the more general question, whether there are plans (and resources) to create such an extension (or option), might still be interesting though.
True. To be honest, I doubt that the core team that's working on this will have time to be implementing an extension (or extensions) of that nature. In place of that, I wouldn't be surprised if we get community efforts to do some of this, and that's something we could try to promote.
However, undoing the new design probably won't be easy. I'm assuming that changing the orientation of the workspaces to be vertical would likely be hard, since that's deeply tied into how the overview is organised. Likewise, moving the dash back to its position on the left gets awkward when you consider that the workspaces pan horizontally. The new design is nice in that everything fits together nicely, including the shortcuts and gestures, but that results in less wiggle room.
When it comes to extensions my personal priority is to ensure that we have a functional dash to dock extension ready for the next release.
Allan
On Tue, Dec 22, 2020 at 2:05 pm, Allan Day aday@redhat.com wrote:
When it comes to extensions my personal priority is to ensure that we have a functional dash to dock extension ready for the next release.
Why? If it's actually important, then surely it should become a setting that doesn't require an extension. And if it's not important, why do we care?
Michael Catanzaro mcatanzaro@gnome.org wrote:
On Tue, Dec 22, 2020 at 2:05 pm, Allan Day aday@redhat.com wrote:
When it comes to extensions my personal priority is to ensure that we have a functional dash to dock extension ready for the next release.
Why?
Because a lot of people rely on it (hard to get precise numbers but it's a significant minority). Also, some Red Hat customers use it.
If it's actually important, then surely it should become a setting that doesn't require an extension. And if it's not important, why do we care?
I'm actually interested in making dash to dock an option in the future, but whether it's an extension or not seems like a different question from whether it's important or not? I mean, there are plenty of options which are important but which exist as extensions, classic mode and friends being the obvious examples.
Allan
On Tue, Dec 22, 2020 at 3:55 pm, Allan Day aday@redhat.com wrote:
I'm actually interested in making dash to dock an option in the future
OK then, well if everything is going to be redesigned, now seems like as good a time as any for it. And I suspect Ubuntu will thank you!
but whether it's an extension or not seems like a different question from whether it's important or not? I mean, there are plenty of options which are important but which exist as extensions, classic mode and friends being the obvious examples.
Eh... classic mode is a little special in that it is a supported, upstream option that we install by default in Workstation. The fact that it's implemented with extensions is just an implementation detail.
Michael Catanzaro mcatanzaro@gnome.org wrote: ...
I'm actually interested in making dash to dock an option in the future
OK then, well if everything is going to be redesigned, now seems like as good a time as any for it. And I suspect Ubuntu will thank you!
It's not just up to me, and it could be a big discussion. I was planning on coming back to that after we'd got this release out of the way.
but whether it's an extension or not seems like a different question from whether it's important or not? I mean, there are plenty of options which are important but which exist as extensions, classic mode and friends being the obvious examples.
Eh... classic mode is a little special in that it is a supported, upstream option that we install by default in Workstation. The fact that it's implemented with extensions is just an implementation detail.
Alright.
Allan
Hi,
Just out of curiosity. How do we do Gnome's usability testing? i.e. Whenever new changes are implemented. I remember during Devconf.CZ 2016 or 2017, few volunteers were carrying out Gnome's usability testing.
Best Regards, Pravin Satpute
On Sat, 19 Dec 2020 at 22:32, Matthew Miller mattdm@fedoraproject.org wrote:
Looks like GNOME 40 won't be just another number — there's a significant update to the Overview, with in particular workspaces moved from vertical to horizontal. And it looks like the dash goes at the bottom now?
The changes look well-thought through and sensible, but it's also the most significant change to the GNOME 3 UI in a long time.
The GNOME blog here https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/ is a good start, but I think we should plan to have some Fedora Magazine articles about this as well.
Also, is there an extension which brings back the old layout for people who want to stay the way it is?
-- Matthew Miller mattdm@fedoraproject.org Fedora Project Leader _______________________________________________ desktop mailing list -- desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to desktop-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/desktop@lists.fedoraproject.or...
pravin.d.s@gmail.com pravin.d.s@gmail.com wrote: ...
Just out of curiosity. How do we do Gnome's usability testing? i.e. Whenever new changes are implemented. I remember during Devconf.CZ 2016 or 2017, few volunteers were carrying out Gnome's usability testing.
I think the best thing to do would be to coordinate with upstream in advance of any tests, to ensure that the things you run tests on are going to receive attention. No point in testing a UI that's unlikely to get touched! Ideally we'd be able to integrate testing into the design and development process itself, so we're testing prototypes or development versions, maybe even in some kind of iterative test/redesign/retest pattern.
Just let me know if you want to pursue this - I can help.
Allan
On Tue, 22 Dec 2020 at 23:02, Allan Day aday@redhat.com wrote:
pravin.d.s@gmail.com pravin.d.s@gmail.com wrote: ...
Just out of curiosity. How do we do Gnome's usability testing? i.e.
Whenever new changes are implemented.
I remember during Devconf.CZ 2016 or 2017, few volunteers were
carrying out Gnome's usability testing.
I think the best thing to do would be to coordinate with upstream in advance of any tests, to ensure that the things you run tests on are going to receive attention. No point in testing a UI that's unlikely to get touched! Ideally we'd be able to integrate testing into the design and development process itself, so we're testing prototypes or development versions, maybe even in some kind of iterative test/redesign/retest pattern.
Agree with you, it should be part of the Upstream process itself.
Just let me know if you want to pursue this - I can help.
As of now, no plans. But I will definitely reach out to you, in case any plans around it.
Thanks, Pravin
Allan _______________________________________________ desktop mailing list -- desktop@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to desktop-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org Fedora Code of Conduct: https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/ List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines List Archives: https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/desktop@lists.fedoraproject.or...
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