On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 02:22:32PM +0000, Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 02:52:02PM +0100, Kamil Dudka wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 23, 2022 10:22:00 AM CET Dmitry Belyavskiy wrote:
> > Dear Kamil,
> > On Wed, Feb 23, 2022 at 8:51 AM Kamil Dudka <kdudka(a)redhat.com> wrote:
> > > On Tuesday, February 22, 2022 10:50:06 PM CET Chris Adams wrote:
> > > > Once upon a time, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
> > > > > Yes. But how many domains using idn are there? I worked on idn
> > > > > in systemd, but when preparing the description of this change I
> > >
> > > realized
> > >
> > > > > that I have _never_ once used an idn domain outside of testing.
> > > > >
> > > > > And note that this is not about user-facing programs like
> > > > > I assume that there might be _some_ use of idn in firefox. But
> > > > > command-line tools like curl this seems even less likely.
> > > >
> > > > I'm pretty sure use of IDN domains is a regional thing. I live
> > > > US and don't see IDN domains in my normal use. But dropping
> > > > them from a core utility would be bad for those that live in regions
> > > > where IDN domains may be more common.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Chris Adams <linux(a)cmadams.net>
> > >
> > > If this appears to be a real problem, it is easy for us to re-enable IDN
> > > in libcurl-minimal, even in an update of a stable Fedora release. So I
> > > not think we need to enable it proactively.
> > >
> > > Being from Russia and having several years of interacting with Universal
> > Acceptance, I'd say IDN is a must nowadays.
> To be clear, I am not completely against including IDN in libcurl-minimal.
> On the other hand, we removed IDN from libcurl in ubi9 images in September
> and nobody has complained about it so far:
Is that really a good metric to evaluate against though ? All the
minimal containers have generally thrown out anything related to
i18n/l10n, leaving only support for the most basic C locale, in the
name of saving image size. IOW loss of anything related to helping
non-English/Western users is (unfortunately) accepted collatoral
damage with containers, and IDN was just one cut of many in that
I don't think it follows that it is OK to sacrifice IDN by default
for all Fedora deliverables, because many others do still care
about providing good i18n support to users.
"sacrifice" and "all Fedora deliverables" are not good terms here.
This change has no impact on e.g. browsers. And even without changing
how curl is built, e.g. we can always add "Enhances: langpacks-uk,
langpacks-ru, langpacks-be" to libcurl if we determine that Ukrainian,
Russian, and Bellarussian users are particularly likely to use idn.
Apart from Dmitry, I don't think there were any opinions from folks
who would be directly impacted.
P.S. I checked statistics for .pl, and the number of IDN domains under .pl
has fallen from a high of 65k in 2012 to 29k in 2021, out of 2500k total
in 2021 .