On 23 January 2014 11:48, Josh Boyer <jwboyer@fedoraproject.org> wrote:
On Thu, Jan 23, 2014 at 1:38 PM, Tom Hughes <tom@compton.nu> wrote:

> Personally I think a lot of it has to do with the way the whole thing seemed
> to be a fait accompli such that there seemed to be little point doing
> anything other than sitting back and seeing what happened.
> You know, the way one minute it was just a suggestion from one member of the
> community and the next minute it was all decided and people were busy
> forming working groups to sort out the details. Apparently that miraculous
> transition happened at Flock, but for anybody that wasn't there it was as if
> it was a god given edict that had been handed down on tablets of stone that
> Fedora.next was happening and we should all just be good little children and
> get on with it.

There _was_ a lot that was discussed and presented at Flock.  It's
kind of the purpose of Flock (and FUDCon before that).  Get people
together to have big discussions in a high bandwith fashion.  And yes,
that can mean that those not in attendance are left to catch up a bit
(though at least with Flock we tried to stream all the sessions to
help with that).

However, it wasn't decided at Flock.  It was presented after Flock to
FESCo, in the normal, online FESCo meetings.  It went further from
there to the Board via the usual channels.  All of this was done as
any other proposal would normally be handled.  Perhaps the only
unusual thing was the relative lack of debate and delay.

My view of the matter was pretty much the same as Tom's and I was at FLOCK. The language at the sessions I attended was not one of "We would like to do this" but that it was a done thing. I realize a lot of that is the 'get shit done because we are all together' mentality which comes from conferences but by the time I left FLOCK I was pretty sure this was all done and either get in the boat or get out. I wasn't even aware of the FESCO items until this email as I figured it had been done and decided at FLOCK.

Fedora.NEXT became irrelevant to me when I realized the committees were mostly hand-chosen versus elected like FESCO. I realize that was to get stuff done versus having a bunch of bureaucratci elections, but it snuffed whatever 'joy' I was going to have to participate in as a 'non-voting' member of a committee. The best way for me to allow the people to get work they wanted to get done was to get out of the way, and so I have. Now that I am asked why I am not enthused, I am explaining.

Stephen J Smoogen.