Self Introduction: Sébastien Le Roux

[Sébastien Le Roux]

Dear all,
my name is Sébastien Le Roux, I just join the mailing list today.
I am a computational material scientist,
my work can be separated in two parts: studying the physico-chemical 
properties
of materials using computational/theoretical methods, and developing 
tools to help
scientists in this field of expertise.
I am the author of several open source programs, so far none being packaged
by Fedora, but I recently released a new software named 'Atomes' and I 
would
like to propose Atomes for packaging, and then providing that it can be 
packaged
maintain it.

Atomes is a Free (Open Source) cross-platform toolbox developed to analyze,
to visualize and to create/edit three-dimensional atomistic models.
Among the possibilities offered by Atomes:

  * Analysis of 3D atomistic model: neutron and x-rays diffraction,
    rings statistics, chain statistics, bond order, MSD ...
  * Visualization: measures, coordination polyhedras, advanced coloring,
    advanced design
  * Edition: molecular library, crystal builder, cell edition, surface
    creation and passivation ...
  * Molecular Dynamics input preparation systems:
      o Classical MD: DLPOLY
        <https://www.scd.stfc.ac.uk/Pages/DL_POLY.aspx> and LAMMPS
        <https://lammps.sandia.gov/>
      o ab-initio MD: CPMD <http://www.cpmd.org> and CP2K
        <http://cp2k.berlios.de>
      o QM-MM MD: CPMD <http://www.cpmd.org> and CP2K
        <http://cp2k.berlios.de>


More info about me here: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
More information about Atomes here: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/

So hello world ;-)

Best regards.

Sébastien Le Roux

PS: using Fedora since FC2

-- 
===========================================================
Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS	
Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
Département des Matériaux Organiques
23, rue du Loess
BP 43
F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
E-mail:[e-mail]
Webpage:https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
ATOMES project:https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
RINGS project:http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
ISAACS project:http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
Fax:   [phone]
Phone: [phone]
===========================================================

[Erol Keskin]

Welcome Sébastien :)

On Wed, 28 Sept 2022 at 18:30, Sébastien Le Roux <
sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr&gt; wrote:

>  Dear all,
>  my name is Sébastien Le Roux, I just join the mailing list today.
>  I am a computational material scientist,
>  my work can be separated in two parts: studying the physico-chemical
>  properties
>  of materials using computational/theoretical methods, and developing tools
>  to help
>  scientists in this field of expertise.
>  I am the author of several open source programs, so far none being
>  packaged
>  by Fedora, but I recently released a new software named 'Atomes' and I
>  would
>  like to propose Atomes for packaging, and then providing that it can be
>  packaged
>  maintain it.
>
>  Atomes is a Free (Open Source) cross-platform toolbox developed to
>  analyze,
>  to visualize and to create/edit three-dimensional atomistic models.
>  Among the possibilities offered by Atomes:
>
>     - Analysis of 3D atomistic model: neutron and x-rays diffraction,
>     rings statistics, chain statistics, bond order, MSD ...
>     - Visualization: measures, coordination polyhedras, advanced coloring,
>     advanced design
>     - Edition: molecular library, crystal builder, cell edition, surface
>     creation and passivation ...
>     - Molecular Dynamics input preparation systems:
>        - Classical MD: DLPOLY
>        <https://www.scd.stfc.ac.uk/Pages/DL_POLY.aspx> and LAMMPS
>        <https://lammps.sandia.gov/>
>        - ab-initio MD: CPMD <http://www.cpmd.org> and CP2K
>        <http://cp2k.berlios.de>
>        - QM-MM MD: CPMD <http://www.cpmd.org> and CP2K
>        <http://cp2k.berlios.de>
>
>
>  More info about me here: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
>  More information about Atomes here: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
>
>  So hello world ;-)
>
>  Best regards.
>
>  Sébastien Le Roux
>
>  PS: using Fedora since FC2
>
>  --
>  ===========================================================
>  Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
>  Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS	
>  Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
>  Département des Matériaux Organiques
>  23, rue du Loess
>  BP 43
>  F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
>  E-mail: sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr
>  Webpage: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
>  ATOMES project: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
>  RINGS project: http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
>  ISAACS project: http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
>  Fax:   [phone]
>  Phone: [phone]
>  ===========================================================
>
>  _______________________________________________
>  devel mailing list -- devel(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  Fedora Code of Conduct:
>  https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
>  List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
>  List Archives:
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/[e-mail]
>  Do not reply to spam, report it:
>  https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue
>

[Renich Bon Ćirić]

On Wed, 2022-09-28 at 17:29 +0200, Sébastien Le Roux wrote:
>  Dear all,
>  my name is Sébastien Le Roux, I just join the mailing list today.
>  I am a computational material scientist, 
Hello! 0/

Welcome to Fedora's Devel ;D

>  I am the author of several open source programs, so far none being
> packaged
>  by Fedora, but I recently released a new software named 'Atomes' and I 
>  would like to propose Atomes for packaging, and then providing that it can be 
>  packaged maintain it. 
Seems pretty cool. The video rocks. Couldn't find build instructions though... 

I noticed the makefile and ran make. Here's what I got (after installing OpenMP)

...
gfortran  -DOPENMP -fopenmp  -Isrc/ -Isrc/lic/ -Isrc/gui/ -Isrc/workspace/ -
Isrc/project/ -Isrc/project/readers/ -Isrc/calc/ -Isrc/calc/dl_poly/ -
Isrc/calc/lammps/ -Isrc/calc/force_fields/ -Isrc/calc/cpmd/ -Isrc/calc/cp2k/ -
Isrc/curve/ -Isrc/opengl/win/ -Isrc/opengl/edit/ -Isrc/opengl/draw/ -
Isrc/opengl/ -I. -c src/fortran/pdb.F90 -o obj/pdb.o
gfortran  -DOPENMP -fopenmp  -Isrc/ -Isrc/lic/ -Isrc/gui/ -Isrc/workspace/ -
Isrc/project/ -Isrc/project/readers/ -Isrc/calc/ -Isrc/calc/dl_poly/ -
Isrc/calc/lammps/ -Isrc/calc/force_fields/ -Isrc/calc/cpmd/ -Isrc/calc/cp2k/ -
Isrc/curve/ -Isrc/opengl/win/ -Isrc/opengl/edit/ -Isrc/opengl/draw/ -
Isrc/opengl/ -I. -c src/fortran/prepdata.F90 -o obj/prepdata.o
src/fortran/prepdata.F90:322:91:

  322 |                          "If this is a bug please report it
to"//CHAR(0), PACKAGE_BUGREPORT//CHAR(0))
      |                                                                        
1
Error: Symbol ‘package_bugreport’ at (1) has no IMPLICIT type
make: *** [Makefile:591: obj/prepdata.o] Error 1

Any ideas?

Thanks. 

-- 
Renich Bon Ćirić <renich(a)woralelandia.com&gt;

[Sébastien Le Roux]

Le 28/09/2022 à 19:32, Renich Bon Ćirić a écrit :
>  On Wed, 2022-09-28 at 17:29 +0200, Sébastien Le Roux wrote:
> > Dear all,
> > my name is Sébastien Le Roux, I just join the mailing list today.
> > I am a computational material scientist,
>  Hello! 0/
>
>  Welcome to Fedora's Devel ;D
>
> > I am the author of several open source programs, so far none being packaged
> > by Fedora, but I recently released a new software named 'Atomes' and I
> > would like to propose Atomes for packaging, and then providing that it can be
> > packaged maintain it.
>  Seems pretty cool. The video rocks. Couldn't find build instructions though...
Hello,
and thank you all for the welcome ;-)

Not sure what you did to build it, did you download the sources from the 
website ?
If you download the sources here: https://github.com/Slookeur/Atomes
then the Makefile is a home cooked file,  and make can take two targets:

'make atomes' -> normal version
'make debug' -> all kind of debug flags

And I will provide build instructions on the Github repo.

With the sources used to build the RPMs:

https://github.com/Slookeur/Atomes-rpm-build/raw/main/atomes-1.1.5.tar.gz

then './configure' followed by 'make' works just fine.

I will be happy to help if you provide a little bit more info ;-)

Sébastien

-- 
===========================================================
Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS
Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
Département des Matériaux Organiques
23, rue du Loess
BP 43
F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
E-mail: sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr
Webpage: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
ATOMES project: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
RINGS project: http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
ISAACS project: http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
Fax:   [phone]
Phone: [phone]
===========================================================

[Renich Bon Ćirić]

On Wed, 2022-09-28 at 20:01 +0200, Sébastien Le Roux wrote:
>  Hello,
>  and thank you all for the welcome ;-)
>  
>  Not sure what you did to build it, did you download the sources from the 
>  website ? 
From github; as you menton next. 

>  If you download the sources here: https://github.com/Slookeur/Atomes
>  then the Makefile is a home cooked file,  and make can take two targets:
>  
>  'make atomes' -> normal version
>  'make debug' -> all kind of debug flags
>  
>  And I will provide build instructions on the Github repo.
>  
>  With the sources used to build the RPMs:
>  SRPMS/atomes-1.1.5-1.src.rpm
>  https://github.com/Slookeur/Atomes-rpm-build/raw/main/atomes-1.1.5.tar.gz
>  
>  then './configure' followed by 'make' works just fine. 
Just noticed you posted an SRPM and a SPEC file in bugzilla. 

One thing, though, the SRPM doesn't build because the SPEC file is different. I
had to:

spectool -Rag SPEC/atomes-fedora.spec
rpmbuild -bs SPEC/atomes-fedora.spec
mock --rebuild SRPMS/atomes-1.1.5-1.src.rpm

... in order for it to successfully build. 

You should update the SRPM in github. ;D

[Alexander Ploumistos]

Hello Sébastien,

Bienvenue !
Have you taken a look at these documents? They should help you get started.
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Joining_the_Pack...
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/New_Package_Proc...

Eventually, you might be interested in joining the Sci-Tech SIG, it's
more than likely that we maintain some package you might be using and
more hands are always welcome:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:SciTech_SIG

Feel free to ask for help with anything.
I'm looking forward to a 'dnf install atomes'!


Best regards


On Wed, Sep 28, 2022 at 5:30 PM Sébastien Le Roux
<sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr&gt; wrote:
>
> Dear all,
> my name is Sébastien Le Roux, I just join the mailing list today.
> I am a computational material scientist,
> my work can be separated in two parts: studying the physico-chemical properties
> of materials using computational/theoretical methods, and developing tools to help
> scientists in this field of expertise.
> I am the author of several open source programs, so far none being packaged
> by Fedora, but I recently released a new software named 'Atomes' and I would
> like to propose Atomes for packaging, and then providing that it can be packaged
> maintain it.
>
> Atomes is a Free (Open Source) cross-platform toolbox developed to analyze,
> to visualize and to create/edit three-dimensional atomistic models.
> Among the possibilities offered by Atomes:
>
> Analysis of 3D atomistic model: neutron and x-rays diffraction, rings statistics,
chain statistics, bond order, MSD ...
> Visualization: measures, coordination polyhedras, advanced coloring, advanced design
> Edition: molecular library, crystal builder, cell edition, surface creation and
passivation ...
> Molecular Dynamics input preparation systems:
>
> Classical MD: DLPOLY and LAMMPS
> ab-initio MD: CPMD and CP2K
> QM-MM MD: CPMD and CP2K
>
>
> More info about me here: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
> More information about Atomes here: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
>
> So hello world ;-)
>
> Best regards.
>
> Sébastien Le Roux
>
> PS: using Fedora since FC2
>
> --
> ===========================================================
> Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
> Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS
> Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
> Département des Matériaux Organiques
> 23, rue du Loess
> BP 43
> F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
> E-mail: sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr
> Webpage: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
> ATOMES project: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
> RINGS project: http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
> ISAACS project: http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
> Fax:   [phone]
> Phone: [phone]
> ===========================================================
>
> _______________________________________________
> devel mailing list -- devel(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe send an email to devel-leave(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> Fedora Code of Conduct:
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/project/code-of-conduct/
> List Guidelines: https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
> List Archives:
https://lists.fedoraproject.org/archives/list/[e-mail]
> Do not reply to spam, report it: https://pagure.io/fedora-infrastructure/new_issue

[Sébastien Le Roux]

Le 28/09/2022 à 20:13, Alexander Ploumistos a écrit :
>  Hello Sébastien,
>
>  Bienvenue !
>  Have you taken a look at these documents? They should help you get started.
>
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Joining_the_Pack...
>
> https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/New_Package_Proc...
Merci !
Yes I did look into this documents today, followed the procedure, and 
submitted the bugzilla:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2130607

Hopefully this is not too bad for a start ;-)
About what I understand the first thing is to find a sponsor, and I hope 
what I provided is enough,
please let me know if you think that I missed something, I would correct 
it ASAP.
However I wasn't able to understand how to provide a 'koji' build,
I can build the package using 'fedpkg' (local) but not sure how both 
relate ...
I even watch a youtube video about 'koji' but it gives an overall idea 
of what it is
and no concrete example ... try to read the doc ... really confusing for 
a beginner.
But it pointed me towards 'copr' that I somehow completely missed before 
today,
so I could at least prepare a repo for atomes:

https://copr.fedorainfracloud.org/coprs/slook/Atomes/

>  Eventually, you might be interested in joining the Sci-Tech SIG, it's
>  more than likely that we maintain some package you might be using and
>  more hands are always welcome:
>  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:SciTech_SIG 
Sure, but I would need a proper training before that ;-)
>  Feel free to ask for help with anything.
>  I'm looking forward to a 'dnf install atomes'! 
So nice to read, and you
have no idea how forward I look to it my-self !

All the best.

-- 
===========================================================
Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS
Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
Département des Matériaux Organiques
23, rue du Loess
BP 43
F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
E-mail: sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr
Webpage: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
ATOMES project: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
RINGS project: http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
ISAACS project: http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
Fax:   [phone]
Phone: [phone]
===========================================================

[Alexander Ploumistos]

On Wed, Sep 28, 2022 at 8:35 PM Sébastien Le Roux
<sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr&gt; wrote:
>  Le 28/09/2022 à 20:13, Alexander Ploumistos a écrit :
>  >
>  Yes I did look into this documents today, followed the procedure, and
>  submitted the bugzilla:
>
>  https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=2130607 
I'm preparing for an interview with the CNRS these days, but if nobody
else turns up, I will do the review.


>  About what I understand the first thing is to find a sponsor, and I
> hope
>  what I provided is enough,
>  please let me know if you think that I missed something, I would correct
>  it ASAP. 
I've set the FE-NEEDSPONSOR flag to your review request, it should
help with that.

In the meantime, you could add this to your reading list:
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/fesco/Packager_sponsor_policy/
It could give you some pointers as to what you could do to get
sponsored, e.g. unofficial reviews.


>  However I wasn't able to understand how to provide a
> 'koji' build,
>  I can build the package using 'fedpkg' (local) but not sure how both
>  relate ... 
It's in the "Scratch Builds" section of this document (they're quickly
piling up, I know…):
https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Using_the_Koji_B...
Essentially, you do a scratch build of your package in Rawhide and if
it is successful, you post the link to your review request.


>  > Eventually, you might be interested in joining the Sci-Tech SIG,
> it's
>  > more than likely that we maintain some package you might be using and
>  > more hands are always welcome:
>  > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Category:SciTech_SIG
>
>  Sure, but I would need a proper training before that ;-) 
There are quite a few chemistry-related packages that could use more
love. I think you are more than qualified to lend a hand in many of
them, should the need occur.

[Otto Liljalaakso]

Alexander Ploumistos kirjoitti 28.9.2022 klo 22.13:
>  On Wed, Sep 28, 2022 at 8:35 PM Sébastien Le Roux
>  <sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr&gt; wrote:
> >
> > However I wasn't able to understand how to provide a 'koji' build,
> > I can build the package using 'fedpkg' (local) but not sure how both
> > relate ...
>  
>  It's in the "Scratch Builds" section of this document (they're quickly
>  piling up, I know…):
>  https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Using_the_Koji_B...
>  Essentially, you do a scratch build of your package in Rawhide and if
>  it is successful, you post the link to your review request. 
Hello Sébastien, and welcome to Fedora!
If you can point to some particular problems in the join documentation,
please let me know.
I would like to fix any issues there,
so that people coming after you would have easier time.
Even a general perception of the current docs is welcome,
it can be difficult to understand what newcomers really would need.

I already create a pull request that adds Koji scratch builds to the GNU 
Hello tutorial [1].

[1]: https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/package-maintainer-docs/pull-request/94

Propositions to improve the documentation

[Sébastien Le Roux]

Dear All,
I joined the packaging team recently, or should I say I joined the 
mailing list, since for the rest I am
still looking for a sponsor and all that ... anyway I want to share few 
ideas with you ...
In my first messages I highlighted that the documentation might need 
some updates / improvements,
for the newbie that I am parts of it were / are still confusing.
Otto Liljalaasko offered me to suggest modifications in the doc ... here 
I go ... again keep in mind
that I am new to all this ;-)

About 
"https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Using_the_Koji_Build_System/"

This doc, talks about "Koji" build,  however the first command lines on 
that page that introduces "Koji"
referred to "fedpkg" and the relationship between both are somewhat 
unclear, a diagram would really help.
I could try to make one but again considering that I do not understand 
thing properly I would likely mess it up.
If I understand the doc properly the paragraph "Building with fedpkg 
targets" should not be located
at the beginning (that confused me really) but latter on introducing a 
somewhat simpler, easier way
to use "Koji" ... or if I tackle this in the wrong direction then the 
page should be renamed "Using fedpkg to build RPMs"
and could provide extra information to understand that "Koji" is 
actually the command that works in the background
and how to use "Koji".

About "https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/"

I am still walking through this big doc, but my first comment is that it 
does not point towards practical example(s),
why not add a link to  "https://src.fedoraproject.org/" (that was 
pointed out to me by  Alexander Ploumistos, thanks again)
that would really help, to understand how things are done.
Or maybe even better a basic, yet complete example, to build a RPM for 
Fedora, some kind of a simple template to follow to do things properly.
Beginning with the easiest, most simple example, yet complete, and the 
rest of the doc would detail modifications that can
be made to this example for advanced/app/package/Fedora ... specific 
requirements.
With the actual format of the doc, and if you have no idea how to build 
a spec file, well I simply think that you cannot do it,
also because tt seems to me that several commands that are required for 
a proper spec file to work are simply not introduced:

-Group:, ex: Group: Productivity/Scientific/Physics
Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec 
file, if required this should be introduced,
as well as the different groups available if Fedora.

-License:, ex License: AGPL-3.0-or-later (not even sure what keyword to 
put here)
Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec 
file, if required this should be introduced,
as well as the different keywoards to be used for packaging for Fedora.

- %autosetup and %setup: in the doc %autosetup refers to %setup + patch, 
%setup is not introduced,
basically I know that it must be used  but I have no idea what it does 
... what are the normal setup task ?

Sure I could keep going, now with the example I think should be 
provided, then it will be mandatory to introduce
any required commands so that beginners could understand what is going 
on, and when you are a newbie,
this simple basic help really does matter.
Now if such an example is somehow provided already, well, I, all newbie 
that I am, missed it, and that might be an issue
because I was really looking for it.
Again these are just ideas, and I have knowledge to build this clean / 
simple / complete example ;-)

If anything else comes to mind while I study how to prepare and 
maintained RPMs I will let you know.

On another note, I want to thank you all for the warm welcome I received 
when I joined the list,
this really was nice, I had a somewhat bad experience few years ago in 
an other open source community
and was not sure what to expect here ...  well the feeling is really 
nice, thank you !

Hope this helps.
Best regards.

Sébastien

-- 
===========================================================
Dr. Sébastien Le Roux
Ingénieur de Recherche CNRS
Institut de Physique et Chimie des Matériaux de Strasbourg
Département des Matériaux Organiques
23, rue du Loess
BP 43
F-67034 Strasbourg Cedex 2, France
E-mail: sebastien.leroux(a)ipcms.unistra.fr
Webpage: https://www.ipcms.fr/sebastien-le-roux/
ATOMES project: https://atomes.ipcms.fr/
RINGS project: http://rings-code.sourceforge.net/
ISAACS project: http://isaacs.sourceforge.net/
Fax:   [phone]
Phone: [phone]
===========================================================

Propositions to improve the documentation

[Benson Muite]

On 10/12/22 13:03, Sébastien Le Roux wrote:
>  Dear All,
>  I joined the packaging team recently, or should I say I joined the 
>  mailing list, since for the rest I am
>  still looking for a sponsor and all that ... anyway I want to share few 
>  ideas with you ...
>  In my first messages I highlighted that the documentation might need 
>  some updates / improvements,
>  for the newbie that I am parts of it were / are still confusing. 
There is some
documentation scattered online. Quite a lot of discussion 
is on mailing lists also. Maybe the following tutorial will be helpful:
https://jamezone.org/pleasure/software/Fedora/packager/


>  
>  If anything else comes to mind while I study how to prepare and 
>  maintained RPMs I will let you know. 
That would be great.
>  
>  On another note, I want to thank you all for the warm welcome I received 
>  when I joined the list,
>  this really was nice, I had a somewhat bad experience few years ago in 
>  an other open source community
>  and was not sure what to expect here ...  well the feeling is really 
>  nice, thank you ! 
Communicating with potentially everybody on the internet is
tough. 
Conventions of welcoming behaviour differ quite considerably, but most 
of the time, intentions are good.
>  
>  Hope this helps.
>  Best regards.
>  
>  Sébastien
>

Propositions to improve the documentation

[Miroslav Suchý]

Dne 12. 10. 22 v 12:03 Sébastien Le Roux napsal(a):
>  Dear All,
>  I joined the packaging team recently, or should I say I joined the mailing list, since
> for the rest I am
>  still looking for a sponsor and all that ... anyway I want to share few ideas with you
> ...
>  In my first messages I highlighted that the documentation might need some updates /
> improvements,
>  for the newbie that I am parts of it were / are still confusing.
>  Otto Liljalaasko offered me to suggest modifications in the doc ... here I go ... again
> keep in mind
>  that I am new to all this ;-)
>
>  About
> "https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Using_the_Koji_Build_System/"
You can even propose pull request. Just see the litle pencil (edit) button in upper right
corner. In this case it will 
navigate you to

https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/package-maintainer-docs/blob/main/f/modules...


>  This doc, talks about "Koji" build,  however the first
> command lines on that page that introduces "Koji"
>  referred to "fedpkg" and the relationship between both are somewhat unclear, a
> diagram would really help. 
This can be definitely clearer.

Koji builds from a dist-git. Fedpkg is tool which allows you to handle dist-git and koji.
Sometimes it provides 
easy-to-remember wrapper around git and koji commands.

>  I could try to make one but again considering that I do not
> understand thing properly I would likely mess it up.
>  If I understand the doc properly the paragraph "Building with fedpkg targets"
> should not be located
>  at the beginning (that confused me really) but latter on introducing a somewhat simpler,
> easier way 
*nod* it completely miss "how to work with dist-git" part. Feel free to steal it
from 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsnJymZRQOM

>  About
> "https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/"
>
>  I am still walking through this big doc, but my first comment is that it does not point
> towards practical example(s), 
It is guidelines. A set of policies and common
standards. Not a teaching book how to package SW.
>  why not add a link to  "https://src.fedoraproject.org/"
> (that was pointed out to me by  Alexander Ploumistos, thanks 
>  again)
>  that would really help, to understand how things are done. 
Feel free to propose where to put the link. But it should come with a big disclaimer, that
sometimes packages in Fedora 
(in src.f.o) do not follow and met Guidelines. There is various reasons. From getting
exception from FESCO to just being 
old package and maintainer did not noticed a change in the guidelines (because it change
quite frequently).

>  Or maybe even better a basic, yet complete example, to build a RPM
> for Fedora, some kind of a simple template to 
>  follow to do things properly.
>  Beginning with the easiest, most simple example, yet complete, and the rest of the doc
> would detail modifications that 
>  can 
Very very simple example

https://xsuchy.github.io/rpm-spec-wizard/#

More documentation, more teaching book than a guidelines. Still needs some love:

https://rpm-packaging-guide.github.io/

>  With the actual format of the doc, and if you have no idea how to
> build a spec file, well I simply think that you 
>  cannot do it,
>  also because tt seems to me that several commands that are required for a proper spec
> file to work are simply not 
>  introduced:
>
>  -Group:, ex: Group: Productivity/Scientific/Physics
>  Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec file, if required
> this should be introduced,
>  as well as the different groups available if Fedora. 
It is obsoleted for soooo long time, that it is not even mentioned in documentation, that
you should remove it. It will 
make no harm to have it there, but it is not used at all.

>  -License:, ex License: AGPL-3.0-or-later (not even sure what keyword to put here)
>  Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec file, if required
> this should be introduced,
>  as well as the different keywoards to be used for packaging for Fedora. 
This is a must. Every package has to have this. It is document here:

https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/LicensingGuidel...

>  - %autosetup and %setup: in the doc %autosetup refers to %setup + patch, %setup is not
> introduced,
>  basically I know that it must be used  but I have no idea what it does ... what are the
> normal setup task ? 
*nod*

The **only** documentation of %setup I am aware of is RPM Max

http://ftp.rpm.org/max-rpm/s1-rpm-inside-macros.html

This documentation is older than dinosaurs. But no one was able/brave to rewrite it in
up-to-date documentation.

The %autosetup is documented here:
https://rpm-software-management.github.io/rpm/manual/autosetup.html

Miroslav

Propositions to improve the documentation

[Blaise Pabon]

https://youtu.be/VsnJymZRQOM
is really excellent, thank you Miroslav

On Wed, Oct 12, 2022 at 9:28 AM Miroslav Suchý <msuchy(a)redhat.com&gt; wrote:

>  Dne 12. 10. 22 v 12:03 Sébastien Le Roux napsal(a):
>  > Dear All,
>  > I joined the packaging team recently, or should I say I joined the
>  mailing list, since for the rest I am
>  > still looking for a sponsor and all that ... anyway I want to share few
>  ideas with you ...
>  > In my first messages I highlighted that the documentation might need
>  some updates / improvements,
>  > for the newbie that I am parts of it were / are still confusing.
>  > Otto Liljalaasko offered me to suggest modifications in the doc ... here
>  I go ... again keep in mind
>  > that I am new to all this ;-)
>  >
>  > About "
>  https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/package-maintainers/Using_the_Koji_B...
>  "
>
>  You can even propose pull request. Just see the litle pencil (edit) button
>  in upper right corner. In this case it will
>  navigate you to
>
>
>
> https://pagure.io/fedora-docs/package-maintainer-docs/blob/main/f/modules...
>
>
>  > This doc, talks about "Koji" build,  however the first command lines on
>  that page that introduces "Koji"
>  > referred to "fedpkg" and the relationship between both are somewhat
>  unclear, a diagram would really help.
>
>  This can be definitely clearer.
>
>  Koji builds from a dist-git. Fedpkg is tool which allows you to handle
>  dist-git and koji. Sometimes it provides
>  easy-to-remember wrapper around git and koji commands.
>
>  > I could try to make one but again considering that I do not understand
>  thing properly I would likely mess it up.
>  > If I understand the doc properly the paragraph "Building with fedpkg
>  targets" should not be located
>  > at the beginning (that confused me really) but latter on introducing a
>  somewhat simpler, easier way
>
>  *nod* it completely miss "how to work with dist-git" part. Feel free to
>  steal it from
>  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VsnJymZRQOM
>
>  > About "https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/"
>  >
>  > I am still walking through this big doc, but my first comment is that it
>  does not point towards practical example(s),
>  It is guidelines. A set of policies and common standards. Not a teaching
>  book how to package SW.
>  > why not add a link to  "https://src.fedoraproject.org/" (that was
>  pointed out to me by  Alexander Ploumistos, thanks
>  > again)
>  > that would really help, to understand how things are done.
>
>  Feel free to propose where to put the link. But it should come with a big
>  disclaimer, that sometimes packages in Fedora
>  (in src.f.o) do not follow and met Guidelines. There is various reasons.
>  From getting exception from FESCO to just being
>  old package and maintainer did not noticed a change in the guidelines
>  (because it change quite frequently).
>
>  > Or maybe even better a basic, yet complete example, to build a RPM for
>  Fedora, some kind of a simple template to
>  > follow to do things properly.
>  > Beginning with the easiest, most simple example, yet complete, and the
>  rest of the doc would detail modifications that
>  > can
>
>  Very very simple example
>
>  https://xsuchy.github.io/rpm-spec-wizard/#
>
>  More documentation, more teaching book than a guidelines. Still needs some
>  love:
>
>  https://rpm-packaging-guide.github.io/
>
>  > With the actual format of the doc, and if you have no idea how to build
>  a spec file, well I simply think that you
>  > cannot do it,
>  > also because tt seems to me that several commands that are required for
>  a proper spec file to work are simply not
>  > introduced:
>  >
>  > -Group:, ex: Group: Productivity/Scientific/Physics
>  > Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec
>  file, if required this should be introduced,
>  > as well as the different groups available if Fedora.
>
>  It is obsoleted for soooo long time, that it is not even mentioned in
>  documentation, that you should remove it. It will
>  make no harm to have it there, but it is not used at all.
>
>  >
>  > -License:, ex License: AGPL-3.0-or-later (not even sure what keyword to
>  put here)
>  > Not even sure that this is required, but you can find it in many spec
>  file, if required this should be introduced,
>  > as well as the different keywoards to be used for packaging for Fedora.
>
>  This is a must. Every package has to have this. It is document here:
>
>
>  https://docs.fedoraproject.org/en-US/packaging-guidelines/LicensingGuidel...
>
>  >
>  > - %autosetup and %setup: in the doc %autosetup refers to %setup + patch,
>  %setup is not introduced,
>  > basically I know that it must be used  but I have no idea what it does
>  ... what are the normal setup task ?
>
>  *nod*
>
>  The **only** documentation of %setup I am aware of is RPM Max
>
>  http://ftp.rpm.org/max-rpm/s1-rpm-inside-macros.html
>
>  This documentation is older than dinosaurs. But no one was able/brave to
>  rewrite it in up-to-date documentation.
>
>  The %autosetup is documented here:
>  https://rpm-software-management.github.io/rpm/manual/autosetup.html
>
>  Miroslav
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