Semantic Tagging in AsciiDoc

[Brian Exelbierd]

Hi All,

A chance conversation today led me to thinking about semantic markup and
AsciiDoc.  AsciiDoc is easier to write because it has fewer tags.  It is
also easier because it has fewer keystrokes.  However, it doesn't offer
a lot of options for marking up elements to:

* ensure consistency of localization by passing element information to
the localizer
* ensure consistency of formatting by ensuring all of the same elements,
for example command names, are marked up the same way
* allow for future automated testing with a project like `emender`

I went through the Installation Guide and found 97 DocBook XML tags. 
I've put them in the table on this wiki page:

https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Tag_Discussion

Please visit the page and edit it to weigh in on preferences about the
tags.

I believe this will help us complete our AsciiDoc style guide and do the
conversions more rapidly and effectively.

Today, if you want to discuss implementation of these tags in AsciiDoc,
please start a separate email thread.

Thank you.

regards,

bex

[sumedh deshpande]

I don't know about XML doctype & what I have to do right now . please
explain it in simple way and my work at all

On Sep 8, 2016 1:38 AM, "Brian Exelbierd" <bex(a)pobox.com&gt; wrote:

>  Hi All,
>
>  A chance conversation today led me to thinking about semantic markup and
>  AsciiDoc.  AsciiDoc is easier to write because it has fewer tags.  It is
>  also easier because it has fewer keystrokes.  However, it doesn't offer
>  a lot of options for marking up elements to:
>
>  * ensure consistency of localization by passing element information to
>  the localizer
>  * ensure consistency of formatting by ensuring all of the same elements,
>  for example command names, are marked up the same way
>  * allow for future automated testing with a project like `emender`
>
>  I went through the Installation Guide and found 97 DocBook XML tags.
>  I've put them in the table on this wiki page:
>
>  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Tag_Discussion
>
>  Please visit the page and edit it to weigh in on preferences about the
>  tags.
>
>  I believe this will help us complete our AsciiDoc style guide and do the
>  conversions more rapidly and effectively.
>
>  Today, if you want to discuss implementation of these tags in AsciiDoc,
>  please start a separate email thread.
>
>  Thank you.
>
>  regards,
>
>  bex
>  --
>  docs mailing list
>  docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  To unsubscribe:
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]

[Brian Exelbierd]

Hi Sumedh,

On Thu, Sep 8, 2016, at 03:29 AM, sumedh deshpande wrote:
>  I don't know about XML doctype & what I have to do right now
> . please
>  explain it in simple way and my work at all 
I am not 100% sure what you're asking, so I will provide you with
several answers:

1) If you are looking to contribute to documentation today, right now,
   there is no need to do anything with this information.  Documentation
   is in DocBook today and as long as you use DocBook you will be fine.

2) If you want to influence how documentation will be written after the
   conversion to AsciiDoc, then please visit the wikipage and review the
   DocBook tags in the table.  If there is a tag you feel like we should
   keep for whatever reason (typically consistency of presentation,
   signals to localizers, or automated testing) add the explanation in
   the third column.

If you're going to edit the table, don't forget that we don't want to
recreate DocBook in AsciiDoc and so we want to try and strive for the
smallest semantic markup tag set possible.

You may also want to read my blog post on this, which I just wrote:

http://www.winglemeyer.org/2016/09/08/semantic-asciidoc/

regards,

bex

>  On Sep 8, 2016 1:38 AM, "Brian Exelbierd" <bex(a)pobox.com&gt; wrote:
> > Hi All,
> >
> > A chance conversation today led me to thinking about semantic
> > markup and
> > AsciiDoc.  AsciiDoc is easier to write because it has fewer
> > tags.  It is
> > also easier because it has fewer keystrokes.  However, it
> > doesn't offer
> > a lot of options for marking up elements to:
> >
> > * ensure consistency of localization by passing element
> >   information to
> > the localizer
> > * ensure consistency of formatting by ensuring all of the same
> >   elements,
> > for example command names, are marked up the same way
> > * allow for future automated testing with a project like `emender`
> >
> > I went through the Installation Guide and found 97 DocBook XML tags.
> > I've put them in the table on this wiki page:
> >
> > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Tag_Discussion
> >
> > Please visit the page and edit it to weigh in on preferences
> > about the
> > tags.
> >
> > I believe this will help us complete our AsciiDoc style guide
> > and do the
> > conversions more rapidly and effectively.
> >
> > Today, if you want to discuss implementation of these tags in
> > AsciiDoc,
> > please start a separate email thread.
> >
> > Thank you.
> >
> > regards,
> >
> > bex
> > --
> > docs mailing list
> > docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> > To unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]
>  --
>  docs mailing list
>  docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  To unsubscribe:
>  https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]

[Lailah]

Hi Brian!

Sorry to say your link is not working.  It returns  (to me at least)  a
404 error.


Cheers,
Sylvia

On Thu, 2016-09-08 at 15:40 +0200, Brian Exelbierd wrote:
>  Hi Sumedh,
>  
>  
>  
>  On Thu, Sep 8, 2016, at 03:29 AM, sumedh deshpande wrote:
>  
>  > > > I don't know about XML doctype & what I have to do right now .
please explain it in simple way and my work at all
>  
>  > I am not 100% sure what you're asking, so I will provide you with 
several
answers:
>  
>  
>  
>  > > > 1) If you are looking to contribute to documentation today, right
now, there is no need to do anything with this information. 
Documentation is in DocBook today and as long as you use DocBook you
will be fine.
>  
>  
>  
>  > > > > > 2) If you want to influence how documentation will be written
> after 
the conversion to AsciiDoc, then please visit the wikipage and review
the DocBook tags in the table.  If there is a tag you feel like we
should keep for whatever reason (typically consistency of
presentation, signals to localizers, or automated testing) add the
explanation in the third column.
>  
>  
>  
>  > > If you're going to edit the table, don't forget that we don't want
> to 
recreate DocBook in AsciiDoc and so we want to try and strive for the
smallest semantic markup tag set possible.
>  
>  
>  
>  You may also want to read my blog post on this, which I just wrote:
>  
>  
>  
>  http://www.winglemeyer.org/2016/09/08/semantic-asciidoc/
>  
>  
>  
>  regards,
>  
>  
>  
>  bex
>  
>  
>  
>  > 
>  > > > On Sep 8, 2016 1:38 AM, "Brian Exelbierd" <bex(a)pobox.com&gt;
> wrote:
>  > 
>  > Hi All,
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > A chance conversation today led me to thinking about semantic 
markup
and
>  > 
>  > > > AsciiDoc.  AsciiDoc is easier to write because it has fewer tags. 
It is
>  > 
>  > > > also easier because it has fewer keystrokes.  However, it doesn't
offer
>  > 
>  > a lot of options for marking up elements to:
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > * ensure consistency of localization by passing element information
to
>  > 
>  > the localizer
>  > 
>  > > > * ensure consistency of formatting by ensuring all of the same
elements,
>  > 
>  > for example command names, are marked up the same way
>  > 
>  > * allow for future automated testing with a project like `emender`
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > I went through the Installation Guide and found 97 DocBook XML
tags.
>  > 
>  > I've put them in the table on this wiki page:
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Tag_Discussion
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > Please visit the page and edit it to weigh in on preferences about
the
>  > 
>  > tags.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > I believe this will help us complete our AsciiDoc style guide and 
do
the
>  > 
>  > conversions more rapidly and effectively.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > > > Today, if you want to discuss implementation of these tags in
AsciiDoc,
>  > 
>  > please start a separate email thread.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > Thank you.
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > regards,
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > bex
>  > 
>  > --
>  > 
>  > docs mailing list
>  > 
>  > docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  > 
>  > To unsubscribe:
>  > 
>  > > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]
t.org
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > 
>  > --
>  > 
>  > docs mailing list
>  > 
>  > docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
>  > 
>  > To unsubscribe:
>  > 
>  > > > https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]
t.org
>  > 
>  
>  
>  
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>  docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
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org

[Tummala Dhanvi]

On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 12:57 PM, Sylvia <bhkohane(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  Hi Brian!
>
>  Sorry to say your link is not working.  It returns  (to me at least)  a 404
>  error.
>  
Here is the updated link

http://www.winglemeyer.org/technology/2016/09/08/semantic-asciidoc/

which is first blog post from http://www.winglemeyer.org/


-- 
Regards
Tummala Dhanvi

https://www.dhanvi.org
"Only thing that can never be 'RE-CYCLED' is 'WASTED TIME' ".

[Lailah]

Thank you!


On Mon, 2016-09-12 at 18:46 +0530, Tummala Dhanvi wrote:
>  > On Mon, Sep 12, 2016 at 12:57 PM, Sylvia
> <bhkohane(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  > 
>  > 
>  > Hi Brian!
>  > 
>  > > > Sorry to say your link is not working.  It returns  (to me at
least)  a 404
>  > error.
>  > 
>  
>  Here is the updated link
>  
>  http://www.winglemeyer.org/technology/2016/09/08/semantic-asciidoc/
>  
>  which is first blog post from http://www.winglemeyer.org/
>  
>

[Shaun McCance]

On Wed, 2016-09-07 at 22:08 +0200, Brian Exelbierd wrote:
>  Hi All,
>  
>  A chance conversation today led me to thinking about semantic markup
>  and
>  AsciiDoc.  AsciiDoc is easier to write because it has fewer tags.  It
>  is
>  also easier because it has fewer keystrokes.  However, it doesn't
>  offer
>  a lot of options for marking up elements to:
>  
>  * ensure consistency of localization by passing element information
>  to
>  the localizer
>  * ensure consistency of formatting by ensuring all of the same
>  elements,
>  for example command names, are marked up the same way
>  * allow for future automated testing with a project like `emender`
>  
>  I went through the Installation Guide and found 97 DocBook XML tags. 
>  I've put them in the table on this wiki page:
>  
>  https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Tag_Discussion 
A long, long time ago (2015!), I went through a similar process for
GNOME. For the curious, here's a couple blog posts, including a shell
script that will give you tag counts. (You'll need to change the path
where it looks for files.)

https://blogs.gnome.org/shaunm/2005/10/21/how-much-docbook/
https://blogs.gnome.org/shaunm/2005/10/22/how-much-docbook-internals/


> 
> Please visit the page and edit it to weigh in on preferences about
> the
> tags.
> 
> I believe this will help us complete our AsciiDoc style guide and do
> the
> conversions more rapidly and effectively.
> 
> Today, if you want to discuss implementation of these tags in
> AsciiDoc,
> please start a separate email thread.
> 
> Thank you.
> 
> regards,
> 
> bex
> --
> docs mailing list
> docs(a)lists.fedoraproject.org
> To unsubscribe:
> https://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail].
> org

[Shaun McCance]

On Fri, 2016-09-09 at 11:40 -0400, Shaun McCance wrote:
>  
>  A long, long time ago (2015!), I went through a similar process for
                         ^^^^
Ahem. 2005. I also walked uphill both ways to school. Get off my lawn.

> GNOME. For the curious, here's a couple blog posts, including a shell
> script that will give you tag counts. (You'll need to change the path
> where it looks for files.)
> 
> https://blogs.gnome.org/shaunm/2005/10/21/how-much-docbook/
> https://blogs.gnome.org/shaunm/2005/10/22/how-much-docbook-internals/