Test Day page

[Noriko Mizumoto]

Hi team

Thank you for creating the test page!
While there is some issue in creating live image, I am wondering when
'Test Matrix' section is updated with complete package list?

Thanks
noriko

[Ani Peter]

Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page will 
be updated soon with all details.

Best regards
Ani

Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> Hi team
>
> Thank you for creating the test page!
> While there is some issue in creating live image, I am wondering when
> 'Test Matrix' section is updated with complete package list?
>
> Thanks
> noriko
>
> fltg mailing list
> [e-mail]
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fltg

[Noriko Mizumoto]

(2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page 
> will be updated soon with all details.

Thanks, Ani

Now can I have one favour?
With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a 
translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by 
editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did 
write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this 
problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test. 
Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in parallel, 
but this is atm only way for us.
Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be 
divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but 
can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if this 
is considered.

Thanks again.

noriko
> Best regards
> Ani
>
> Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > Hi team
> >
> > Thank you for creating the test page!
> > While there is some issue in creating live image, I am wondering when
> > 'Test Matrix' section is updated with complete package list?
> >
> > Thanks
> > noriko
> >
> > fltg mailing list
> > [e-mail]
> > https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fltg

[Ankit Patel]

On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > will be updated soon with all details.
>
> Thanks, Ani
>
> Now can I have one favour?
> With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in parallel,
> but this is atm only way for us.
> Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but
> can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if this
> is considered.

This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We are
planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
templates, so the problem would never appear again.

Thanks for bringing this though!

[Noriko Mizumoto]

(2012年08月28日 15:46), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > > will be updated soon with all details.
> >
> > Thanks, Ani
> >
> > Now can I have one favour?
> > With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> > translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> > editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> > write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> > problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> > Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in parallel,
> > but this is atm only way for us.
> > Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> > divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but
> > can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if this
> > is considered.
>
> This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We are
> planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
> templates, so the problem would never appear again.
>
> Thanks for bringing this though!

Umm... I have one concern on this plan.
If we have multiple pages, then each of us needs to check other pages 
bug sections if a problem encountered has already been filed as bug or 
not. Otherwise we may have great number of duplicate bugs, no??

noriko

[Ani Peter]

Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> (2012年08月28日 15:46), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> > On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > > (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > > > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > > > will be updated soon with all details.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Ani
> > >
> > > Now can I have one favour?
> > > With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> > > translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> > > editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> > > write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> > > problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> > > Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in parallel,
> > > but this is atm only way for us.
> > > Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> > > divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but
> > > can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if this
> > > is considered.
> >
> > This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We are
> > planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
> > templates, so the problem would never appear again.
> >
> > Thanks for bringing this though!
>
> Umm... I have one concern on this plan.
> If we have multiple pages, then each of us needs to check other pages 
> bug sections if a problem encountered has already been filed as bug or 
> not. Otherwise we may have great number of duplicate bugs, no??
>
> noriko

In that case, what about creating wiki page for each application? But 
then again:
1. will end up in creating many wiki pages. This does not happen while 
creating pages per language.
2. multiple users will login to a wiki page at a time.

Thanks
Ani
> fltg mailing list
> [e-mail]
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fltg

[Ankit Patel]

On 08/28/2012 12:56 PM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> (2012年08月28日 15:46), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> > On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > > (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > > > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > > > will be updated soon with all details.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Ani
> > >
> > > Now can I have one favour?
> > > With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> > > translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> > > editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> > > write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> > > problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> > > Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in parallel,
> > > but this is atm only way for us.
> > > Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> > > divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but
> > > can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if this
> > > is considered.
> >
> > This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We are
> > planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
> > templates, so the problem would never appear again.
> >
> > Thanks for bringing this though!
>
> Umm... I have one concern on this plan.
> If we have multiple pages, then each of us needs to check other pages
> bug sections if a problem encountered has already been filed as bug or
> not. Otherwise we may have great number of duplicate bugs, no??

Bug filing should be done end of the testing event I think.

Also bugzill workflow states the fist step as:
* Search for equivalent existing bugs before filing a new bug

However, as we know, we might duplicate bugs, where bug triaging would
come into place and help upto some extent. I do not seem to find any
other better solution in order to avoid the problem of multiple testers
updating the same wiki page at the same time! :(

Thanks!

[Noriko Mizumoto]

(2012年08月28日 17:57), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> On 08/28/2012 12:56 PM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > (2012年08月28日 15:46), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> > > On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > > > (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > > > > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > > > > will be updated soon with all details.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks, Ani
> > > >
> > > > Now can I have one favour?
> > > > With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> > > > translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> > > > editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> > > > write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> > > > problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> > > > Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in 
> > > > parallel,
> > > > but this is atm only way for us.
> > > > Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> > > > divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, but
> > > > can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if 
> > > > this
> > > > is considered.
> > >
> > > This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We are
> > > planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
> > > templates, so the problem would never appear again.
> > >
> > > Thanks for bringing this though!
> >
> > Umm... I have one concern on this plan.
> > If we have multiple pages, then each of us needs to check other pages
> > bug sections if a problem encountered has already been filed as bug or
> > not. Otherwise we may have great number of duplicate bugs, no??
>
> Bug filing should be done end of the testing event I think.

It may depend on a translator how he/she wanna go... in fact, I file a 
bug as I go.
> Also bugzill workflow states the fist step as:
> Search for equivalent existing bugs before filing a new bug

You are absolutely right, however it is time consuming task searching a 
bug is. Especially it would become considerable amount of time at the 
end, since searching is not only for one bug but generally more. Current 
format is useful because a translator can see bugs at a glance without 
searching, so that many of translators can save searching time.

I prefer Ani's suggestion of creating wiki page for each application.
> In that case, what about creating wiki page for each application? But

then again:
> will end up in creating many wiki pages. This does not happen

while creating pages per language.
> multiple users will login to a wiki page at a time.

Or, creating wiki page per a couple of applications may reduce the 
number of pages (solve the problem#1 above), as well can  help 
distribute the traffic. I think...

noriko
> However, as we know, we might duplicate bugs, where bug triaging would
> come into place and help upto some extent. I do not seem to find any
> other better solution in order to avoid the problem of multiple testers
> updating the same wiki page at the same time! :(
>
> Thanks!

[Alam]

08/28/2012 02:01 PM ਨੂੰ, Noriko Mizumoto ਨੇ ਲਿਖਿਆ:
> (2012年 08月28日 17:57), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> > On 08/28/2012 12:56 PM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > > (2012年08月28日 15:46), Ankitkumar Rameshchandra Patel wrote:
> > > > On 08/28/2012 10:34 AM, Noriko Mizumoto wrote:
> > > > > (2012年08月28日 13:37), Ani Peter wrote:
> > > > > > Thank you Noriko for asking. The package list is ready and the page
> > > > > > will be updated soon with all details.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks, Ani
> > > > >
> > > > > Now can I have one favour?
> > > > > With last l10n test, we have had a bit bitter experience. When a
> > > > > translator tried to write in the test result in Matrix section by
> > > > > editing wiki page, he/she failed to do so if another translator did
> > > > > write in his report same time. Some poor translators experienced this
> > > > > problem numerous times, which demotivated translators to take a test.
> > > > > Wiki page is not supposed to be edited by multiple persons in 
> > > > > parallel,
> > > > > but this is atm only way for us.
> > > > > Therefore, I like to propose a work around that this section to be
> > > > > divided into multiple sections. This does not resolve the problem, 
> > > > > but
> > > > > can ease the traffic a bit I hope. It would be much appreciated if 
> > > > > this
> > > > > is considered.
> > > >
> > > > This issue was considered and discussed if I remember correctly. We 
> > > > are
> > > > planning to have wiki pages for each language with default test page
> > > > templates, so the problem would never appear again.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks for bringing this though!
> > >
> > > Umm... I have one concern on this plan.
> > > If we have multiple pages, then each of us needs to check other pages
> > > bug sections if a problem encountered has already been filed as bug or
> > > not. Otherwise we may have great number of duplicate bugs, no??
> >
> > Bug filing should be done end of the testing event I think.
>
> It may depend on a translator how he/she wanna go... in fact, I file a 
> bug as I go.

actually filing bug can be helpful as next Tester know there is already 
bug filed so that can avoid many duplicate bugs. During testing bug 
triage will further help to keep duplicate low.
> > Also bugzill workflow states the fist step as:
> > Search for equivalent existing bugs before filing a new bug
>
> You are absolutely right, however it is time consuming task searching 
> a bug is. Especially it would become considerable amount of time at 
> the end, since searching is not only for one bug but generally more. 
> Current format is useful because a translator can see bugs at a glance 
> without searching, so that many of translators can save searching time.

Not expecting Tester to search bugs during event, while reporting bug in 
Test page will help as said above.
> I prefer Ani's suggestion of creating wiki page for each application.
> > In that case, what about creating wiki page for each application?
>
> But then again:
> > will end up in creating many wiki pages. This does not happen
>
> while creating pages per language.
> > multiple users will login to a wiki page at a time.
>
> Or, creating wiki page per a couple of applications may reduce the 
> number of pages (solve the problem#1 above), as well can  help 
> distribute the traffic. I think...

yes, this is good suggestion, so creating One Test Result Page for Each 
feaquenty used applications, while other applications can use single 
Test Result page (for ALL).

let us create simple to review it once.

thanks for suggestions.
> noriko
> > However, as we know, we might duplicate bugs, where bug triaging would
> > come into place and help upto some extent. I do not seem to find any
> > other better solution in order to avoid the problem of multiple testers
> > updating the same wiki page at the same time! :(
> >
> > Thanks!
>
> fltg mailing list
> [e-mail]
> https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/fltg