qtbase: enable journald logging (for f24)?

[Rex Dieter]

qt5-qtbase has build options:

+  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
    -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.

and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns or 
objections?

-- Rex

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> qt5-qtbase has build options:
> -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
>
> and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns or
> objections?

please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter 
/var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of 
reasons

[Rex Dieter]

Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> >
> > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns
> > or objections?
>
> please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of
> reasons

I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works and 
is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific snippet to use 
?

-- Rex

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> Reindl Harald wrote:
> > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > > -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > >
> > > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns
> > > or objections?
> >
> > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of
> > reasons
>
> I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works and
> is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific snippet to use

something like below and see also 
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828

it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global 
logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important 
entries
________________________

[root@srv-rhsoft:~]$ cat /etc/rsyslog.d/contentlounge.conf
:msg, contains, "Starting ContentLounge" -/var/log/contentlounge.log
& stop

:msg, contains, "Started ContentLounge" -/var/log/contentlounge.log
& stop
________________________

[root@srv-rhsoft:~]$ cat /etc/logrotate.d/contentlounge
/var/log/contentlounge.log {
     missingok
     notifempty
     size 128k
     create 0644 root root
}
________________________

[Rex Dieter]

Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > > > -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > >
> > > > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns
> > > > or objections?
> > >
> > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of
> > > reasons
> >
> > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works
> > and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific snippet
> > to use
>
> something like below and see also
> https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
>
> it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important

Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting have to 
do with journald ?

Otherwise, it would appear to me that logging should be a bit more domain 
specific... (either specific to frameworks or applications).  I mean, are 
there any other toolkits (like Qt) shipping their own rsyslog.d snippets ?

-- Rex

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> Reindl Harald wrote:
> > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > > > >    -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > >
> > > > > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns
> > > > > or objections?
> > > >
> > > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of
> > > > reasons
> > >
> > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works
> > > and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific snippet
> > > to use
> >
> > something like below and see also
> > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> >
> > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
>
> Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting have to
> do with journald ?

whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is 
running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it
> Otherwise, it would appear to me that logging should be a bit more domain
> specific... (either specific to frameworks or applications).  I mean, are
> there any other toolkits (like Qt) shipping their own rsyslog.d snippets ?

dunno - i just don't want to get my global syslog flooded becasue every 
piece of software starts to just blow their informational output to 
journald and i am tired to write rsyslog-snippets and logrotate-snippets 
everytime another piece of software starts to do so by hand on each and 
every machine

[Rex Dieter]

Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > > +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > > > > >    -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and
> > > > > > concerns or objections?
> > > > >
> > > > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot
> > > > > of reasons
> > > >
> > > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works
> > > > and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific
> > > > snippet to use
> > >
> > > something like below and see also
> > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> > >
> > > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
> >
> > Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting have
> > to do with journald ?
>
> whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is
> running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it

both system *and* user journal entries land in /var/log/messages ?  If so, 
that's interesting... and a bit unfortunate.

-- Rex

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 19:50 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> Reindl Harald wrote:
> > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >      +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > > > > > >         -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and
> > > > > > > concerns or objections?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot
> > > > > > of reasons
> > > > >
> > > > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that works
> > > > > and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific
> > > > > snippet to use
> > > >
> > > > something like below and see also
> > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> > > >
> > > > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > > > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
> > >
> > > Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting have
> > > to do with journald ?
> >
> > whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is
> > running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it
>
> both system *and* user journal entries land in /var/log/messages ?  If so,
> that's interesting... and a bit unfortunate.

how should rsyslog distinct between them?

you already get /var/log/messages flooded with "kscreen" messages wehn 
login via "sddm" to a kde-session as example

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 19:56 schrieb Reindl Harald:
> Am 29.02.2016 um 19:50 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > >> qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>      +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to
> > > > > > >> journald.
> > > > > > >>         -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and
> > > > > > >> concerns or objections?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > > > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot
> > > > > > > of reasons
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that
> > > > > > works
> > > > > > and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a specific
> > > > > > snippet to use
> > > > >
> > > > > something like below and see also
> > > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> > > > >
> > > > > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > > > > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting
> > > > have
> > > > to do with journald ?
> > >
> > > whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is
> > > running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it
> >
> > both system *and* user journal entries land in /var/log/messages ?  If
> > so,
> > that's interesting... and a bit unfortunate.
>
> how should rsyslog distinct between them?
>
> you already get /var/log/messages flooded with "kscreen" messages wehn
> login via "sddm" to a kde-session as example

perfect example how careless logging makes the admin simply bling 
because he no longer is able to find interesting records between all the 
noise

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1072368

[Rex Dieter]

Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 29.02.2016 um 19:50 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > >> qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >>      +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to
> > > > > > >>      journald.
> > > > > > >>         -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and
> > > > > > >> concerns or objections?
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > > > > /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot
> > > > > > > of reasons
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that
> > > > > > works and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a
> > > > > > specific snippet to use
> > > > >
> > > > > something like below and see also
> > > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> > > > >
> > > > > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > > > > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
> > > >
> > > > Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting
> > > > have to do with journald ?
> > >
> > > whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is
> > > running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it
> >
> > both system *and* user journal entries land in /var/log/messages ?  If
> > so, that's interesting... and a bit unfortunate.
>
> how should rsyslog distinct between them?
>
> you already get /var/log/messages flooded with "kscreen" messages wehn
> login via "sddm" to a kde-session as example

A fair critcism, but I still think this needs to be finer-grained, and it is 
not generally appropriate to do at the toolkit (Qt) level, ie, I would 
disagree that Qt-related logging should go into a separate/segregated log.

-- Rex

[Reindl Harald]

Am 29.02.2016 um 20:03 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> Reindl Harald wrote:
> > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:50 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:43 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > > Am 29.02.2016 um 19:29 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > > Reindl Harald wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >> Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > > > > > >>> qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>>       +  -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to
> > > > > > >>>       journald.
> > > > > > >>>          -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> > > > > > >>>
> > > > > > >>> and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and
> > > > > > >>> concerns or objections?
> > > > > > >>
> > > > > > >> please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> > > > > > >> /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot
> > > > > > >> of reasons
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > I'm unfamiliar with that, can you be more specific with how that
> > > > > > > works and is related to journald usage, and ideally, provide a
> > > > > > > specific snippet to use
> > > > > >
> > > > > > something like below and see also
> > > > > > https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1304828
> > > > > >
> > > > > > it's annoying on a rsyslog-setup that you get everything in the global
> > > > > > logfile (/var/log/messages) which makes it hard to recognize important
> > > > >
> > > > > Sorry if I'm missing something, but what does what you're suggesting
> > > > > have to do with journald ?
> > > >
> > > > whatever you blow to journald ends in /var/log/messages when rsyslog is
> > > > running until there are rules to put it in specific logfiles - that's it
> > >
> > > both system *and* user journal entries land in /var/log/messages ?  If
> > > so, that's interesting... and a bit unfortunate.
> >
> > how should rsyslog distinct between them?
> >
> > you already get /var/log/messages flooded with "kscreen" messages wehn
> > login via "sddm" to a kde-session as example
>
> A fair critcism, but I still think this needs to be finer-grained, and it is
> not generally appropriate to do at the toolkit (Qt) level, ie, I would
> disagree that Qt-related logging should go into a separate/segregated log

i have no solution except "don't log irrelevant things until some deug 
mode is enabled" to not make sysadmins blind when the whole global log 
is cluttered with all sort of normal operations garbage instead things 
you need to watch for

[Rex Dieter]

Reindl Harald wrote:
> i have no solution except "don't log irrelevant things until some deug
> mode is enabled"

That's already our general default policy in qt/kde related packages, if you 
find exceptions to that, please file bugs, and I'll be happy to help fix 
them.

One you already mentioned was that kscreen seems to be a bit overly verbose 
by default, I'll try taking a look at that soon.

-- Rex

[Laurent Rineau]

Le Monday 29 February 2016 18:56:40 Reindl Harald a écrit :
> Am 29.02.2016 um 18:42 schrieb Rex Dieter:
> > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> >
> > -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> >
> > -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> >
> > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns or
> > objections?
>
> please ship some rsyslog.d/ snippet with it to not clutter
> /var/log/messages for people which continue to use rsyslog for a lot of
> reasons

Qt5 programs launched in a user session will log to the *user* journal, not to 
the system journal. And user journals are not fed to syslog.

You may only see differences for Qt5 programs launched in system sessions, 
such as /usr/bin/kdm launched by kdm.service.

[Helio Chissini de Castro]

Well, i'm all in favor.

On Mon, Feb 29, 2016 at 6:42 PM, Rex Dieter  wrote:
> qt5-qtbase has build options:
> -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
>
> and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns or
> objections?
>
> -- Rex
> _______________________________________________
> kde mailing list
> [e-mail]
> http://lists.fedoraproject.org/admin/lists/[e-mail]

[Rex Dieter]

Helio Chissini de Castro wrote:
> Well, i'm all in favor.
>
> On Mon, Feb 29, 2016 at 6:42 PM, Rex Dieter
>  wrote:
> > qt5-qtbase has build options:
> > -no-journald ........ Do not send logging output to journald.
> > -journald ........... Send logging output to journald.
> >
> > and I'm considering enabling the -journald option for f24, and concerns
> > or objections?

OK, enabled,

%changelog
* Sat Mar 05 2016 Rex Dieter  5.6.0-0.37.rc
- %build: ./configure -journal (f24+)