8:28 a.m.
First kontact would not start at all. This seems to be due to the fact that
it was seeking a non-existent folder, /home/anne/.local/share/Local, IIRC.
Pointing this to my local mail directory allowed Kontact to start, but I've
since been told that that is a bad idea - and I haven't been told what I
should do about it.
Then I discovered that my addressbook was empty. I replaced the file from a
backup, restarted everything, but still couldn't see any addresses. Exploring
the Akonadi setup I confirmed that it was pointing to the correct file. In
the end I added a new Resource, pointing it to the same file. All my
addresses were now visible and I thought I had won. Not so. Today I needed
to add a phone number. Edit opened a blank form - none of the existing
details showing. You could type into a field, but saving it made no
difference. The new item didn't show. Now, some hours later, Edit is working
and I can add the phone number.
During that time I have kept getting spells of seeing Kontact use more than
50% CPU, forcing the total to 99-100%, so that I had to shut it down. Several
times. I can only assume that it's Akonadi trying to organise the data, but
it has simply made it unusable. Unless these issues can be resolved there are
going to be some major screams.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
9:23 a.m.
Hello Anne,
On Thursday 31 December 2009, 11:28, Anne Wilson wrote:
First kontact would not start at all. This seems to be due to the
fact
that it was seeking a non-existent folder, /home/anne/.local/share/Local,
IIRC. Pointing this to my local mail directory allowed Kontact to start,
but I've since been told that that is a bad idea - and I haven't been told
what I should do about it.
Then I discovered that my addressbook was empty. I replaced the file from
a backup, restarted everything, but still couldn't see any addresses.
Exploring the Akonadi setup I confirmed that it was pointing to the
correct file. In the end I added a new Resource, pointing it to the same
file. All my addresses were now visible and I thought I had won. Not so.
Today I needed to add a phone number. Edit opened a blank form - none of
the existing details showing. You could type into a field, but saving it
made no difference. The new item didn't show. Now, some hours later,
Edit is working and I can add the phone number.
During that time I have kept getting spells of seeing Kontact use more than
50% CPU, forcing the total to 99-100%, so that I had to shut it down.
Several times. I can only assume that it's Akonadi trying to organise the
data, but it has simply made it unusable. Unless these issues can be
resolved there are going to be some major screams.
did you try to watch the processes with the "System Monitor"? in the Process
Table select on the listbox "All processes, Tree", and you may guess who to
blame. In my case, akonadi-control owns several sub-processes, none of them
consume much CPU nor memory (same is valid for Nepomuk - this has been a huge
improvement), look at the pic in
http://arielch.fedorapeople.org/images/sysload_akonadi_nepomuk.png
I wouldn't blame Akonadi, so may be it's a Kontact thing.
By the way, what's your Akonadi set up? I've found the embedded mysql to
consume more resources than the server, so I changed the default set-up to use
a MySQL server running on localhost, but this may not be the case for you...
Anyway, this you try with a whole brand new clean .kde user directory? After
some crashes, I've found this to be the better solution.
Regards
--
Ariel Constenla-Haile
La Plata, Argentina
9:44 a.m.
On Thursday 31 December 2009 15:23:44 Ariel Constenla-Haile wrote:
did you try to watch the processes with the "System
Monitor"? in the
Process Table select on the listbox "All processes, Tree", and you may
guess who to blame. In my case, akonadi-control owns several
sub-processes, none of them consume much CPU nor memory (same is valid for
Nepomuk - this has been a huge improvement), look at the pic in
http://arielch.fedorapeople.org/images/sysload_akonadi_nepomuk.png
I wouldn't blame Akonadi, so may be it's a Kontact thing.
Maybe it is. Yes, I've been trying to find the culprit in ksysguard. As you
say, the individual akonadi processes don't seem to use too much, the MySQL
daemon is using much more, and kontact was using around 45% cpu, whereas since
I made the change I mention in my last mail it has dropped to 5% or less. I
assume that it's the interaction, of trying to do something that's impossible,
that has caused the problem. It's still too early, though, to say whether
I've cured it.
By the way, what's your Akonadi set up? I've found the
embedded mysql to
consume more resources than the server, so I changed the default set-up to
use a MySQL server running on localhost, but this may not be the case for
you... Anyway, this you try with a whole brand new clean .kde user
directory? After some crashes, I've found this to be the better solution.
Embedded mysql - out-of-the-box from kde-fedora. I don't have a stand-alone
mysql server to use. I've always thought that it would be relatively
difficult to set up. The only time I tried it, the instructions didn't work.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
11:17 p.m.
Anne Wilson wrote:
Embedded mysql - out-of-the-box from kde-fedora. I don't have a
stand-alone mysql server to use. I've always thought that it would be
relatively difficult to set up. The only time I tried it, the
instructions didn't work.
Akonadi always uses a standalone server, not mysql-embedded, it just fires
it up per user with a preset configuration. The only user of mysql-embedded
in Fedora is Amarok.
Kevin Kofler
7:33 a.m.
On Saturday 02 January 2010 05:17:38 Kevin Kofler wrote:
Anne Wilson wrote:
> Embedded mysql - out-of-the-box from kde-fedora. I don't have a
> stand-alone mysql server to use. I've always thought that it would be
> relatively difficult to set up. The only time I tried it, the
> instructions didn't work.
Akonadi always uses a standalone server, not mysql-embedded, it just fires
it up per user with a preset configuration. The only user of mysql-embedded
in Fedora is Amarok.
OK - so stand-alone mysql, out of the box from kde-fedora.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
9:33 a.m.
New subject: Kontact/Akonadi is disastrous on 4.3.85 - update
On Thursday 31 December 2009 14:28:21 Anne Wilson wrote:
First kontact would not start at all. This seems to be due to the
fact
that it was seeking a non-existent folder, /home/anne/.local/share/Local,
IIRC. Pointing this to my local mail directory allowed Kontact to start,
but I've since been told that that is a bad idea - and I haven't been told
what I should do about it.
Suddenly I lost my panel, kontact didn't respond to keypresses and cpu was
showing 100%. When I couldn't recover at all I had to re-start X. Once
everything was up and running I decided that I would try to remove the local
mail resource. I then discovered that it was immediately replaced, but this
time the path is /home/anne/.local/share/local-mail - which does exist. We'll
see now whether things are more stable.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
10:22 a.m.
Anne Wilson wrote:
Unless these issues can be resolved there
are going to be some major screams.
Agreed. I've backed up my kde-4.3.x data/home to test migration issues.
Are there any other easy/good upgrade-path qa/tests we could do to help?
I suppose having a conversation here is less than ideal, when I get back
from a friend's wedding this weekend, I'll ping some pim folks on
irc/lists... and try to help come up with some sort of test plan for
akonadi/kdepim and 4.4.0
-- Rex
11:44 a.m.
Rex Dieter wrote:
Anne Wilson wrote:
> Unless these issues can be resolved there
> are going to be some major screams.
Agreed.
Well, all I can add is that I seem to have resolved the issues here. Although I had
said a week ago that I would not migrate to Akonadi for a year or two (waiting for
it to mature, as I fear for the safety of my data), last night I *did* link my
resources to akonadi.
What I did was make sure I have my traditional file resources for kalendar,
kaddressbook, knotes working and have *no* akonadi resources for these programs set
up.
Next, I started the akonadi tray (under utilities in the menu), and selected
configure. I pointed address book, my calendar and notes.ics to the locations where
I actually keep the files, then I added a birthdays and anniversaries resource, and
I even pointed local folders (the email maildir resource) to
/home/petrus/.kde/share/apps/kmail/mail/.inbox.directory/, where akonadi was able
to locate the desired 'cur' directories for each of my identities.
With this setup, I have been able to do an akonadi backup and I have logged out/in
and powered down and back up this morning without incident. Kmail works fine, the
kaddressbook is fine, all the akonadi resources are still set up correctly, as the
akonadi tray utility shows, after I restarted it this morning (this appears to be a
management utility and doesn't need to run all of the time).
So far, all is well. I must say, my previous misgivings about akonadi in kde-4.0 in
January have dissipated. Even then, it was working, *except* that one could not
delete calendar entries, only add new ones, but the setup then was different: one
had to move all one's data to akonadi, while now one is permitted to keep one's
traditional resources and akonadi acts more like a safeguard backup service (but
you must manually back up and restore), if I understand correctly.
1:49 p.m.
Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
So far, all is well.
Correction. After a bit of experimentation with Korganizer, I am able to create and
delete entries, but akonadi complains. Nevertheless, there does not appear to be any
deficiency in the functioning of the traditional resources I am using.
5:08 p.m.
On Thursday 31 December 2009 19:49:22 Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
> So far, all is well.
Correction. After a bit of experimentation with Korganizer, I am able
to create and delete entries, but akonadi complains. Nevertheless,
there does not appear to be any deficiency in the functioning of the
traditional resources I am using.
All seems to be working "quite" well here.
A few things.. I hope related to the Subj,
The ability to right click on an Email address to edit it, this option is
missing. No time to check with a standard address book yet.
With Nepomuk also enabled, sending an Email had a long "delay" one of the
Dev's mentioned that the Mail Dispatcher Agent should not be on by default
(it was on this box) correcting that fixed the delay.
Cheers
Colin
--
Fedora release 12 (Constantine)
Registered Linux user number #342953
7:30 p.m.
On Friday 01 January 2010 00:53:52 Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
Colin J Thomson - G6AVK wrote:
> the Mail Dispatcher Agent should not be on by default
Would you tell me how I can check this on my system?
Sure,
From a Konsole run akonadiconsole, then look in the Agents tab.
Cheers
Colin
--
Fedora release 12 (Constantine)
Registered Linux user number #342953
5:04 a.m.
On Friday 01 January 2010 01:30:24 Colin J Thomson - G6AVK wrote:
On Friday 01 January 2010 00:53:52 Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
> Colin J Thomson - G6AVK wrote:
> > the Mail Dispatcher Agent should not be on by default
>
> Would you tell me how I can check this on my system?
Sure,
>From a Konsole run akonadiconsole, then look in the Agents tab.
That lists the capabilities 'Unique, Autostart, NoConfig' - and sure
enough I
can't configure it. Do I have to remove it? I too have been frustrated by
the delays.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
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5:15 a.m.
On Friday 01 January 2010 11:04:53 Anne Wilson wrote:
On Friday 01 January 2010 01:30:24 Colin J Thomson - G6AVK wrote:
> On Friday 01 January 2010 00:53:52 Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
> > Colin J Thomson - G6AVK wrote:
> > > the Mail Dispatcher Agent should not be on by default
> >
> > Would you tell me how I can check this on my system?
>
> Sure,
>
> >From a Konsole run akonadiconsole, then look in the Agents tab.
That lists the capabilities 'Unique, Autostart, NoConfig' - and sure
enough I can't configure it. Do I have to remove it? I too have been
frustrated by the delays.
Right click on the Mail Dispatcher Agent entry and toggle online/offline.
HTH
Colin
--
Fedora release 12 (Constantine)
Registered Linux user number #342953
4:59 a.m.
On Thursday 31 December 2009 19:49:22 Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
The biggest problem I found was that migration to Akonadi
appeared to be
automatic, and, since there were issues to resolve, kontact was for a time
unusable. Also, Akonadi didn't start automatically - and I couldn't get
kontact until I had started it. Definitely this has been a learning curve
that we don't want to see for most users.
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
Petrus de Calguarium wrote:
> So far, all is well.
Correction. After a bit of experimentation with Korganizer, I am able to
create and delete entries, but akonadi complains. Nevertheless, there does
not appear to be any deficiency in the functioning of the traditional
resources I am using.
I use a remote file with Korganizer. Testing this, I made a new entry from
this laptop (it is stored on a server box), then confirmed that I can read it
on the netbook. So far so good. However, while the entry was being saved
there was an alarming notification popup (they really don't stay on screen
long enough to read) from which I got only 'std.ics.....Trash'. I also have
on screen two warning dialogs, entitled 'std.ics - AkonadiTray' and both
saying 'Unknown error. There is no transaction in progress.)'
As far as I can tell, though, all is well.
5:17 a.m.
Anne Wilson wrote:
I use a remote file with Korganizer. Testing this, I made a new
entry
from this laptop (it is stored on a server box), then confirmed that I can
read it
on the netbook.
Sorry to ask an ignorant question,
but what exactly is the point of akonadi?
I've only been able to find very general descriptions,
eg the Mission Statement at <http://pim.kde.org/akonadi/>;.
Is there a short document that will explain this to me?
Anne's experience does not encourage me to "try it and see".
But what concretely are some - or even one -
of the things I could do with akonadi?
I've actually found LDAP to be the best way of storing contacts.
However, it does not seem to me to work very well with kaddressbook.
Will akonadi be able to work with LDAP?
Or can it replace LDAP?
Finally, I see that I have (inadvertently) installed the akonadi package,
but do not see it on my fedora menu.
How would I start it if I wanted to?
--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
9:17 a.m.
On Friday 01 January 2010 11:17:43 Timothy Murphy wrote:
Anne Wilson wrote:
> I use a remote file with Korganizer. Testing this, I made a new entry
> from this laptop (it is stored on a server box), then confirmed that I
> can read it
> on the netbook.
Sorry to ask an ignorant question,
but what exactly is the point of akonadi?
I've only been able to find very general descriptions,
eg the Mission Statement at <http://pim.kde.org/akonadi/>;.
Is there a short document that will explain this to me?
Anne's experience does not encourage me to "try it and see".
But what concretely are some - or even one -
of the things I could do with akonadi?
I've actually found LDAP to be the best way of storing contacts.
However, it does not seem to me to work very well with kaddressbook.
Will akonadi be able to work with LDAP?
Or can it replace LDAP?
Finally, I see that I have (inadvertently) installed the akonadi package,
but do not see it on my fedora menu.
How would I start it if I wanted to?
If you type 'akonadi' into krunner you will see various options, including
a
tray icon from which you can start it. I wouldn't bother just yet.
At the moment it doesn't offer you much - it's really only for those of us
that want to debug and help in its development. Soon, though, it will be
quite different. The point is that all the data it can collect will be stored
in a database, which will be available to any application that is written with
database ability built in. It's all part of the grand plan for world
domination :-)
Anne
--
KDE Community Working Group
New to KDE Software? - get help from http://userbase.kde.org
5:07 p.m.
Anne Wilson wrote:
> Sorry to ask an ignorant question,
> but what exactly is the point of akonadi?
...
> Finally, I see that I have (inadvertently) installed the akonadi
package,
> but do not see it on my fedora menu.
> How would I start it if I wanted to?
If you type 'akonadi' into krunner you will see various
options, including
a tray icon from which you can start it.
Assuming krunner is the small window at the top of the f-menu,
nothing comes up when I type akonadi,
although I see from "rpm -ql akonadi"
that a few akonadi applications are installed,
/usr/bin/akonadi_control
/usr/bin/akonadictl
/usr/bin/akonadiserver
At the moment it doesn't offer you much - it's really only
for those of us
that want to debug and help in its development. Soon, though, it will be
quite different. The point is that all the data it can collect will be
stored in a database, which will be available to any application that is
written with
database ability built in. It's all part of the grand plan for world
domination :-)
I don't mind being dominated as long as it makes my life easier.
Actually, I doubt if KDE will take over the world,
as it seems to prefer doing everything its own way,
rather than taking in the best out there.
I'm thinking of firefox, in particular,
but also programs like kdvi, which seems to me a completely unnecessary
replacement for xdvi, which always works perfectly for me.
When you mentioned "database" I had a fear that KDE
would invent its own, but I see that some mysql-oriented stuff
is included with akonadi, so hopefully this will be used?
I would also like my contact list to be available on Windows machines,
and it wasn't clear to me if akonadi would offer this,
as openLDAP does.
Having said that, I find the user interface to LDAP very unfriendly.
But sadly, user friendliness does not seem to be high on KDE priorities,
so I'm not sure if akonadi will improve on LDAP from that point of view.
But thanks for helping me understand what akonadi is aiming for.
--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
5:19 p.m.
On Friday 01 January 2010 23:07:28 Timothy Murphy wrote:
Anne Wilson wrote:
>> Sorry to ask an ignorant question,
>> but what exactly is the point of akonadi?
...
>> Finally, I see that I have (inadvertently) installed the akonadi
>> package, but do not see it on my fedora menu.
>> How would I start it if I wanted to?
>
> If you type 'akonadi' into krunner you will see various options,
> including a tray icon from which you can start it.
Assuming krunner is the small window at the top of the f-menu,
nothing comes up when I type akonadi,
although I see from "rpm -ql akonadi"
that a few akonadi applications are installed,
/usr/bin/akonadi_control
/usr/bin/akonadictl
/usr/bin/akonadiserver
No that's just a menu search bar, to bring up Krunner use ALT F2 and type
ako. Its very useful once you get the hang of it.
Cheers
Colin
--
Fedora release 12 (Constantine)
Registered Linux user number #342953
5:20 p.m.
On 01/01/2010 07:07 PM, Timothy Murphy wrote:
Anne Wilson wrote:
>> Sorry to ask an ignorant question,
>> but what exactly is the point of akonadi?
...
>> Finally, I see that I have (inadvertently) installed the akonadi package,
>> but do not see it on my fedora menu.
>> How would I start it if I wanted to?
> If you type 'akonadi' into krunner you will see various options, including
> a tray icon from which you can start it.
Assuming krunner is the small window at the top of the f-menu,
nothing comes up when I type akonadi,
although I see from "rpm -ql akonadi"
that a few akonadi applications are installed,
/usr/bin/akonadi_control
/usr/bin/akonadictl
/usr/bin/akonadiserver
krunner is what comes up with Alt-F2
<snip>
6:11 p.m.
Patrick Boutilier wrote:
> Assuming krunner is the small window at the top of the f-menu,
> nothing comes up when I type akonadi,
krunner is what comes up with Alt-F2
OK, thanks.
I often type Alt-F2, but never heard it called krunner before.
Surely it isn't KDE specific?
--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
4:30 a.m.
Kevin Kofler wrote:
> I often type Alt-F2, but never heard it called krunner before.
> Surely it isn't KDE specific?
KRunner is KDE-specific, it's part of Plasma.
What I meant was that Alt-F2 is not KDE-specific.
Hasn't it always brought up a window in which one could type a command?
Is it even Linux-specific?
--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
8:47 a.m.
Timothy Murphy wrote:
What I meant was that Alt-F2 is not KDE-specific.
Hasn't it always brought up a window in which one could type a command?
Is it even Linux-specific?
Well, it's still implementation-specific, you'll find systems where Alt+F2
is not the default shortcut for "Run command", if such a feature exists at
all.
Kevin Kofler
11:50 p.m.
Timothy Murphy wrote:
but also programs like kdvi, which seems to me a completely
unnecessary
replacement for xdvi, which always works perfectly for me.
Actually, KDvi is dead, it's part of Okular these days. As for xdvi, that's
completely obsolete and uses some ancient toolkit that looks like crap
(AFAIK, there's actually a choice between Xaw, Xaw3D and Motif, the current
Fedora package is built against Xaw3D). I think it's great that you can view
DVIs in Okular and I don't see the point of using an ancient Xaw or Motif
app instead.
I also use Konqueror as my main browser (i.e. at least 99% of the time I
browse the web).
Kevin Kofler
4:51 a.m.
Kevin Kofler wrote:
> but also programs like kdvi, which seems to me a completely
unnecessary
> replacement for xdvi, which always works perfectly for me.
Actually, KDvi is dead, it's part of Okular these days. As for
xdvi,
that's completely obsolete and uses some ancient toolkit that looks like
crap (AFAIK, there's actually a choice between Xaw, Xaw3D and Motif, the
current Fedora package is built against Xaw3D). I think it's great that
you can view DVIs in Okular and I don't see the point of using an ancient
Xaw or Motif app instead.
Well, xdvi works fine for me, and brings up the TeX/LaTeX page
much faster than okular.
Last time I tried, okular (or maybe kdvi) did not bring out
Postscript embedded in .dvi files properly;
but that was some time ago.
Personally, I don't see any advantage in one program
being able to do a lot of different things.
Processing a .dvi file seems to me a very specific requirement,
and I actually prefer a program that "does one thing, and does it well",
as Ken Thompson said.
I also find xpdf is much faster than Adobe's PDF reader,
though that is a slightly different issue.
I also use Konqueror as my main browser (i.e. at least 99% of the
time I
browse the web).
I guess I don't share the KDE philosophy,
which seems to be to re-invent the wheel as kwheel.
Unless there is actually something wrong with firefox,
it seems to me simpler to use a program available
on all the systems I know.
--
Timothy Murphy
e-mail: gayleard /at/ eircom.net
tel: +353-86-2336090, +353-1-2842366
s-mail: School of Mathematics, Trinity College, Dublin 2, Ireland
8:20 a.m.
2010/1/2 Timothy Murphy <gayleard(a)eircom.net>:
Kevin Kofler wrote:
> I also use Konqueror as my main browser (i.e. at least 99% of the time I
> browse the web).
I guess I don't share the KDE philosophy,
which seems to be to re-invent the wheel as kwheel.
Unless there is actually something wrong with firefox,
it seems to me simpler to use a program available
on all the systems I know.
That, is one great part of linux. You use what you want. And there are
enough people out there who are not satisfied with Firefox. Me
included. I use it only for triaging purposes. And that just because
the scripts needed, are made for FF only. Bad eh? Sounds like Windows
and Internet Explorer.
Or with other words: Different folks, different strokes.
If you dont like it, dont use it.
--
LG Thomas
Dubium sapientiae initium
11:22 a.m.
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 14:28:21 +0000, Anne Wilson wrote:
Then I discovered that my addressbook was empty. I replaced the
file
from a backup, restarted everything, but still couldn't see any
addresses. Exploring the Akonadi setup I confirmed that it was pointing
to the correct file. In the end I added a new Resource, pointing it to
the same file.
I noticed this too. If you add an addressbook resource using the akonadi
system settings panel, it does not show up in kontact. I found that I had
to add the address book resource using kontact's "resource configuration"
dialog (select 'akonadi', then select 'manage addressbook sources').
C
12:49 p.m.
On Thursday 31 December 2009 17:22:58 Carl D. Roth wrote:
On Thu, 31 Dec 2009 14:28:21 +0000, Anne Wilson wrote:
> Then I discovered that my addressbook was empty. I replaced the file
> from a backup, restarted everything, but still couldn't see any
> addresses. Exploring the Akonadi setup I confirmed that it was pointing
> to the correct file. In the end I added a new Resource, pointing it to
> the same file.
I noticed this too. If you add an addressbook resource using the akonadi
system settings panel, it does not show up in kontact.
This is confusing. What do you mean by 'the akonadi system settings panel'?
I found that I had
to add the address book resource using kontact's "resource configuration"
dialog (select 'akonadi', then select 'manage addressbook sources').
This sounds like a pre-akonadi version. The latest version, if it has managed
to migrate your addressbook to akonadi, looks very different from the old one.
It might be a good idea to compare versions. My addressbook was converted in
KDE SC 4.3.85. I'm now on 4.3.90. The resource that appeared originally was
the one set up by the migration. I know some migration bugs have been
identified and corrected.
Anne
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5215
days inactive
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days old
30 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
Anne Wilson -
Ariel Constenla-Haile -
Carl D. Roth -
Colin J Thomson -
Kevin Kofler -
Patrick Boutilier -
Petrus de Calguarium -
Rex Dieter -
Thomas Janssen -
Timothy Murphy