Video code for Insight?

[Paul W. Frields]

http://camendesign.com/code/video_for_everybody

This page ("Video for Everybody") has an interesting approach to a
one-size-fits-all page for video that we should consider for Fedora
Insight. Maybe Simon knows if it would be possible to use this inside
some sort of template for video download pages?

Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first choice, but
provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well.

Paul

[Karsten Wade]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 08:22:14AM -0500, Paul Frields wrote:
>  http://camendesign.com/code/video_for_everybody
>  
>  This page ("Video for Everybody") has an interesting approach to a
>  one-size-fits-all page for video that we should consider for Fedora
>  Insight. Maybe Simon knows if it would be possible to use this inside
>  some sort of template for video download pages?
>  
>  Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first choice, but
>  provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
>  Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
>  to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well. 
How do we handle that?  Do we need to get a license from the patent
holders to use patented codecs via fedoraproject.org?

We might be better off if our graceful fallback were to just load the
Flash from YouTube/Vimeo/etc.  Store our non-free codec versions in
Someone Else's Problem.

- Karsten
-- 
name:  Karsten 'quaid' Wade, Sr. Community Gardener
team:                Red Hat Community Architecture 
uri:                  http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
gpg:                                       AD0E0C41

[Paul W. Frields]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 07:43:44AM -0800, Karsten Wade wrote:
>  On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 08:22:14AM -0500, Paul Frields wrote:
>  > http://camendesign.com/code/video_for_everybody
>  > 
>  > This page ("Video for Everybody") has an interesting approach to a
>  > one-size-fits-all page for video that we should consider for Fedora
>  > Insight. Maybe Simon knows if it would be possible to use this inside
>  > some sort of template for video download pages?
>  > 
>  > Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first choice, but
>  > provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
>  > Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
>  > to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well.
>  
>  How do we handle that?  Do we need to get a license from the patent
>  holders to use patented codecs via fedoraproject.org? 
Codecs are the problem of the user, not the provider.  I'm not saying
that's a solution or even a "good" problem, just that there's no
license needed on our part AFAICT.

>  We might be better off if our graceful fallback were to just load
> the
>  Flash from YouTube/Vimeo/etc.  Store our non-free codec versions in
>  Someone Else's Problem. 
It should be possible to do that using the VfE suggestion, if I read
it right.

-- 
Paul W. Frields                                http://paul.frields.org/
  gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233  5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
  http://redhat.com/   -  -  -  -   http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/
          Where open source multiplies: http://opensource.com

[Bill Nottingham]

Paul W. Frields (stickster(a)gmail.com) said: 
>  > > Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first
> choice, but
>  > > provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
>  > > Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
>  > > to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well.
>  > 
>  > How do we handle that?  Do we need to get a license from the patent
>  > holders to use patented codecs via fedoraproject.org?
>  
>  Codecs are the problem of the user, not the provider.  I'm not saying
>  that's a solution or even a "good" problem, just that there's no
>  license needed on our part AFAICT. 
Well, if we provide video in a certain format, there's the question
of what codecs we used to legally create the video. Mmm, rathole.

Bill

[Karsten Wade]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 02:13:11PM -0500, Bill Nottingham wrote:
>  Paul W. Frields (stickster(a)gmail.com) said: 
>  > > > Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first choice, but
>  > > > provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
>  > > > Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
>  > > > to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well.
>  > > 
>  > > How do we handle that?  Do we need to get a license from the patent
>  > > holders to use patented codecs via fedoraproject.org?
>  > 
>  > Codecs are the problem of the user, not the provider.  I'm not saying
>  > that's a solution or even a "good" problem, just that there's no
>  > license needed on our part AFAICT.
>  
>  Well, if we provide video in a certain format, there's the question
>  of what codecs we used to legally create the video. Mmm, rathole. 
This in fact is what I was thinking of.  We are committed to using a
completely free stack that exists in Fedora in content production, so
there isn't a way for us to build up Flash etc. videos, is there?

But if we take our free content and upload it to Vimeo, and Vimeo does
the conversion and distribution, and then we have our pages gracefully
fall back from all-OGG to Flash-from-some-other-domain ... does that
work in concept?

- Karsten
-- 
name:  Karsten 'quaid' Wade, Sr. Community Gardener
team:                Red Hat Community Architecture 
uri:                  http://quaid.fedorapeople.org
gpg:                                       AD0E0C41

[Till Maas]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 12:54:26PM -0800, Karsten Wade wrote:

>  This in fact is what I was thinking of.  We are committed to using a
>  completely free stack that exists in Fedora in content production, so
>  there isn't a way for us to build up Flash etc. videos, is there? 
There is also free flash ogg vorbis player available:
https://launchpad.net/fogg

And maybe also this:
http://flowplayer.org/

Regards
Till

[Tom Callaway]

On 02/10/2010 01:27 PM, Paul W. Frields wrote:
>  Codecs are the problem of the user, not the provider.  I'm not
> saying
>  that's a solution or even a "good" problem, just that there's no
>  license needed on our part AFAICT. 
This isn't always true, nor is it safe to assume.

~spot

[Paul W. Frields]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 02:13:22PM -0500, Tom spot Callaway wrote:
>  On 02/10/2010 01:27 PM, Paul W. Frields wrote:
>  > Codecs are the problem of the user, not the provider.  I'm not saying
>  > that's a solution or even a "good" problem, just that there's no
>  > license needed on our part AFAICT.
>  
>  This isn't always true, nor is it safe to assume. 
Are you saying that when someone links to YouTube, we're responsible
for the codecs YouTube uses?

-- 
Paul W. Frields                                http://paul.frields.org/
  gpg fingerprint: 3DA6 A0AC 6D58 FEC4 0233  5906 ACDB C937 BD11 3717
  http://redhat.com/   -  -  -  -   http://pfrields.fedorapeople.org/
          Where open source multiplies: http://opensource.com

[Tom Callaway]

On 02/10/2010 06:20 PM, Paul W. Frields wrote:
>  Are you saying that when someone links to YouTube, we're
> responsible
>  for the codecs YouTube uses? 
Not necessarily. YouTube might be.

~spot

[Till Maas]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 08:22:14AM -0500, Paul Frields wrote:

>  Note that this approach does place Ogg Theora as first choice, but
>  provides graceful fallbacks for other platforms as needed. If Fedora
>  Insight is to serve as a marketing tool for Fedora, we need to be able
>  to reach people who aren't already able to see Ogg Theora as well. 
There are at least two FOSS java ogg decoder applets, that can probably
be used on those platforms:
http://www.jcraft.com/jorbis/
http://www.flumotion.net/cortado/

Regards
Till