Christopher,
On 2012-02-22 17:00, Christopher R. Antila wrote:
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On 02/21/2012 03:51 PM, Brendan Jones wrote:
On 02/21/2012 09:07 PM, Kyrian wrote:
...
- Then I think, ah, wrong kernel, and pulseaudio? But that could
be grouped too, no? Have, say, Jack and have it conflict with pulseaudio somehow?
Pulseaudio is proving to be a pain. Its now an implicit dependency of the default desktop (GNOME) which is unfortunate. Having said all that, I think its a great piece of software, but creates unnecessary complications when all you want to do is create/produce and edit music. There are some applications which refuse to play with anything else now (skype anyone?) that mean people like me have no choice but to coexist with it. I'm still not happy with my setup - other users on this list have also posted their solutions [2]. I think we should aim to ship a pulseaudio-less solution. This means we need to decide on a desktop that's not Gnome - of course that won't make everyone happy, but if we have the comps group like you suggest, those gnome users can still pull in the audio packages with ease.
Something about this seems off.
I remember when it used to be the case that audio cards generally wouldn't work by default in Linux. Slowly, eventually, PulseAudio solved that. If we remove PulseAudio, we're forcing our users to "go it alone." Now, I understand that PulseAudio isn't ideal for audio creation software--that's why it uses JACK--but we don't want to throw away everything that PulseAudio gained. And surely we want to allow people to use GNOME if they want. And Skype. Otherwise we risk running into a situation where people enjoy using the Fedora Audio Spin for audio-creation tasks, but can't stand it for anything else.
That hasn't been my experience - after much pain over the last few years with audio, the first thing I do is remove PA and just use ALSA . . but I am an audio guru wannabe . .
Regards,
Phil.
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On 02/22/2012 04:05 AM, Philip Rhoades wrote:
Christopher,
...
That hasn't been my experience - after much pain over the last few years with audio, the first thing I do is remove PA and just use ALSA . . but I am an audio guru wannabe . .
Regards,
Phil.
If "the first thing [you] do" is literally remove PulseAudio, then how would you know whether it works? Okay okay... you probably meant something like "I'm still waiting for PulseAudio to improve on my computer."
But that's the real issue. In our ideal world, PulseAudio would coexist happily with JACK for every user. There are definitely problems to sort out, but the Right Thing To Do is ensure everything works together for everybody. I'd be happy with a a well-documented, easy-to-use method of removing PulseAudio. But this is Fedora, and at Fedora we aim for ideal situations and get there a few releases later.
Ultimately I'll be happy with whatever the community decides to do, as long as everybody has a chance to participate. So why doesn't PulseAudio work for you? Can we make it work?
Christopher.
Christopher,
On 2012-02-23 17:15, Christopher R. Antila wrote:
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On 02/22/2012 04:05 AM, Philip Rhoades wrote:
Christopher,
...
That hasn't been my experience - after much pain over the last few years with audio, the first thing I do is remove PA and just use ALSA . . but I am an audio guru wannabe . .
Regards,
Phil.
If "the first thing [you] do" is literally remove PulseAudio, then how would you know whether it works? Okay okay... you probably meant something like "I'm still waiting for PulseAudio to improve on my computer."
But that's the real issue. In our ideal world, PulseAudio would coexist happily with JACK for every user. There are definitely problems to sort out, but the Right Thing To Do is ensure everything works together for everybody. I'd be happy with a a well-documented, easy-to-use method of removing PulseAudio. But this is Fedora, and at Fedora we aim for ideal situations and get there a few releases later.
Ultimately I'll be happy with whatever the community decides to do, as long as everybody has a chance to participate. So why doesn't PulseAudio work for you? Can we make it work?
Perhaps I am being a little unfair - a few years ago, after getting a new MB: Intel DG45ID I found it had a problem with the drivers (?) that resulted in a Mic/LineIn reversal - it took me AGES to figure out a way of getting it to work - PA was an unnecessary complicating layer in this case. So I guess it was a case of sticking with what I knew would work from thereafter . .
Regards,
Phil.
What about those of us that don't have external/Proaudio usb or firewire devices? Or those that have them, but that aren't supported in linux, so they'll have to use their onboard audio. Is Jack/Pulse going to work well together onboard?
On Wed, Feb 22, 2012 at 11:20 PM, Philip Rhoades phil@pricom.com.au wrote:
Christopher,
On 2012-02-23 17:15, Christopher R. Antila wrote:
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On 02/22/2012 04:05 AM, Philip Rhoades wrote:
Christopher,
...
That hasn't been my experience - after much pain over the last few years with audio, the first thing I do is remove PA and just use ALSA . . but I am an audio guru wannabe . .
Regards,
Phil.
If "the first thing [you] do" is literally remove PulseAudio, then how would you know whether it works? Okay okay... you probably meant something like "I'm still waiting for PulseAudio to improve on my computer."
But that's the real issue. In our ideal world, PulseAudio would coexist happily with JACK for every user. There are definitely problems to sort out, but the Right Thing To Do is ensure everything works together for everybody. I'd be happy with a a well-documented, easy-to-use method of removing PulseAudio. But this is Fedora, and at Fedora we aim for ideal situations and get there a few releases later.
Ultimately I'll be happy with whatever the community decides to do, as long as everybody has a chance to participate. So why doesn't PulseAudio work for you? Can we make it work?
Perhaps I am being a little unfair - a few years ago, after getting a new MB: Intel DG45ID I found it had a problem with the drivers (?) that resulted in a Mic/LineIn reversal - it took me AGES to figure out a way of getting it to work - PA was an unnecessary complicating layer in this case. So I guess it was a case of sticking with what I knew would work from thereafter . .
Regards,
Phil.
Philip Rhoades
GPO Box 3411 Sydney NSW 2001 Australia E-mail: phil@pricom.com.au ______________________________**_________________ music mailing list music@lists.fedoraproject.org https://admin.fedoraproject.**org/mailman/listinfo/musichttps://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/music
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