11:16 p.m.
I recently acquired a
Refurbished: Grade A Dell OptiPlex GX980 Tower PC, Intel Core I3-550 3.2Ghz, 8G
DDR3, 1T HDD, DVD, VGA, WiFi, Bluetooth ...
I can boot it from a live Centos 7 disk.
According to W10, the HDD is partitioned as follows:
System: 350 MB
C: 930.44 GB
recovery: 750 MB
I think that I would want to dual-boot it (Windows/Fedora)
in case I ever need Windows for something.
I have set up dual booting before,
but it has been a long time.
Ideally it would be a triple boot:
one for Windows, one that I just installed
and one that I've been using lately.
Mostly what I remember about the process is that getting the information
from various distant places in the galaxy was a bit of a chore.
Can someone point me in the right direction?
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
4:22 p.m.
On 6/29/22 00:16, Michael Hennebry wrote:
I recently acquired a
Refurbished: Grade A Dell OptiPlex GX980 Tower PC, Intel Core I3-550
3.2Ghz, 8G DDR3, 1T HDD, DVD, VGA, WiFi, Bluetooth ...
I can boot it from a live Centos 7 disk.
According to W10, the HDD is partitioned as follows:
System: 350 MB
C: 930.44 GB
recovery: 750 MB
I think that I would want to dual-boot it (Windows/Fedora)
in case I ever need Windows for something.
I have set up dual booting before,
but it has been a long time.
Ideally it would be a triple boot:
one for Windows, one that I just installed
and one that I've been using lately.
Mostly what I remember about the process is that getting the information
from various distant places in the galaxy was a bit of a chore.
Can someone point me in the right direction?
Here is how I do the booting on a Dell Studio. The first step is to use
the windows disk management to shrink the C: partition. I forget whether
or not the Centos 7 Live disk has gparted on it or not. If not you can
install it to the image in memory for temporary use. Use gparted to
further reduce the C: drive to the size you expect to use with some
extra. Assuming from the vintage of the 980 that it is not an efi boot
system and that it is a Master Boot disk, make the rest of the free
space an extended partition. Put a 500 to 800MB partition in the
extended partition for your Linux boot as ext4. Additional partitions
can be made in the extended partition for whatever you want to do.
Things may be a bit tight.
The Fedora server install gives you the most freedom of specifying your
custom system structure the graphical interface you want to use can be
added with the groupinstall of dnf.
3:17 p.m.
Thanks.
On Wed, 29 Jun 2022, Robert McBroom via users wrote:
On 6/29/22 00:16, Michael Hennebry wrote:
> I think that I would want to dual-boot it (Windows/Fedora)
> in case I ever need Windows for something.
Here is how I do the booting on a Dell Studio. The first step is to
use the
windows disk management to shrink the C: partition. I forget whether or not
the Centos 7 Live disk has gparted on it or not. If not you can install it to
the image in memory for temporary use. Use gparted to further reduce the C:
drive to the size you expect to use with some extra. Assuming from the
Why the two-step process?
vintage of the 980 that it is not an efi boot system and that it is a
Master
Boot disk, make the rest of the free space an extended partition. Put a 500
to 800MB partition in the extended partition for your Linux boot as ext4.
Additional partitions can be made in the extended partition for whatever you
want to do. Things may be a bit tight.
I have a TB. Absent videos and the like,
things should not get tight.
The process described is more or less what I remember.
I used fdisk to do my partitioning before the install
and pointed the installer to the partitions I wanted.
IIRC I tried to use gparted once and got bit by something.
I've not tried it since.
The Fedora server install gives you the most freedom of specifying
your
custom system structure the graphical interface you want to use can be added
with the groupinstall of dnf.
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
10:41 p.m.
On 6/30/22 16:17, Michael Hennebry wrote:
Thanks.
On Wed, 29 Jun 2022, Robert McBroom via users wrote:
> On 6/29/22 00:16, Michael Hennebry wrote:
>> I think that I would want to dual-boot it (Windows/Fedora)
>> in case I ever need Windows for something.
> Here is how I do the booting on a Dell Studio. The first step is to
> use the windows disk management to shrink the C: partition. I forget
> whether or not the Centos 7 Live disk has gparted on it or not. If
> not you can install it to the image in memory for temporary use. Use
> gparted to further reduce the C: drive to the size you expect to use
> with some extra. Assuming from the
Why the two-step process?
Occasionally had problems with windows and partition
resizing. Windows
is happy with its own disk management. Can require chkdsk from other
processes.
> vintage of the 980 that it is not an efi boot system and that it is a
> Master Boot disk, make the rest of the free space an extended
> partition. Put a 500 to 800MB partition in the extended partition for
> your Linux boot as ext4. Additional partitions can be made in the
> extended partition for whatever you want to do. Things may be a bit
> tight.
I have a TB. Absent videos and the like,
things should not get tight.
You were mentioning having three OS
The process described is more or less what I remember.
I used fdisk to do my partitioning before the install
and pointed the installer to the partitions I wanted.
IIRC I tried to use gparted once and got bit by something.
I've not tried it since.
> The Fedora server install gives you the most freedom of specifying
> your custom system structure the graphical interface you want to use
> can be added with the groupinstall of dnf.
5:46 a.m.
On Wed, Jun 29, 2022 at 6:23 PM Robert McBroom via users <
users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:
On 6/29/22 00:16, Michael Hennebry wrote:
> I recently acquired a
> Refurbished: Grade A Dell OptiPlex GX980 Tower PC, Intel Core I3-550
> 3.2Ghz, 8G DDR3, 1T HDD, DVD, VGA, WiFi, Bluetooth ...
> I can boot it from a live Centos 7 disk.
> According to W10, the HDD is partitioned as follows:
> System: 350 MB
> C: 930.44 GB
> recovery: 750 MB
>
> I think that I would want to dual-boot it (Windows/Fedora)
> in case I ever need Windows for something.
>
> I have set up dual booting before,
> but it has been a long time.
> Ideally it would be a triple boot:
> one for Windows, one that I just installed
> and one that I've been using lately.
> Mostly what I remember about the process is that getting the information
> from various distant places in the galaxy was a bit of a chore.
Do you plan to have the user "home" directory in a separate partition?
There have been glitches with configuration details stored in the
users home directory. One approach is to keep users "home" directories
separate but share Documents, etc. via a 4th partition.
>
> Can someone point me in the right direction?
>
Here is how I do the booting on a Dell Studio. The first step is to use
the windows disk management to shrink the C: partition. I forget whether
or not the Centos 7 Live disk has gparted on it or not. If not you can
install it to the image in memory for temporary use. Use gparted to
further reduce the C: drive to the size you expect to use with some
extra. Assuming from the vintage of the 980 that it is not an efi boot
system and that it is a Master Boot disk, make the rest of the free
space an extended partition. Put a 500 to 800MB partition in the
extended partition for your Linux boot as ext4. Additional partitions
can be made in the extended partition for whatever you want to do.
This is essentially what I have been doing for years, but Michael wants
two linux boot partitions. He didn't mention if he wants these to share
a separate /home partition. This method preserves the recovery partition,
which can have drivers that aren't in the original Windows installation
DVD images, but you may be able to get newer install images or
download drivers from the vendor's site. A fresh install of current
Windows is generally better than trying to upgrade a years-old
recovery image. I would do away with the recovery partition.
Using Windows tools to shrink the original partition has been
reliable for me. With Windows 10 it was necessary to disable
"fastboot" as that just loads Windows without allowing the user
to choose another OS.
Things may be a bit tight.
In my experience, many users with 1TB drives were happy with
1/4 TB for Windows, a 1/8 TB linux "root" partition, and the
residual for /home. The others generally need much more than 1TB,
The Fedora server install gives you the most freedom of specifying your
custom system structure the graphical interface you want to use can
be
added with the groupinstall of dnf.
--
George N. White III
9:04 p.m.
On Sat, 2 Jul 2022, George N. White III wrote:
On Wed, Jun 29, 2022 at 6:23 PM Robert McBroom via users <
users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:
Do you plan to have the user "home" directory in a separate
partition?
There have been glitches with configuration details stored in the
users home directory. One approach is to keep users "home" directories
separate but share Documents, etc. via a 4th partition.
Haven't quite decided.
I've been bitten by the aforementioned
glitches even without multiple boots.
The reason for the third boot is so that in the case of a
bad install, there is still a good install to fall back on.
Ideally, I will not be running both Linux's.
I have previously used the documents partition method.
That said, 'twould be nice to keep things like Firefox windows.
Normally, I'd expect a new version of a program to be able to read
the previousl versions configuration and other data.
The aforemention bite occurred when Firefox only thought it could.
This is essentially what I have been doing for years, but Michael
wants
two linux boot partitions. He didn't mention if he wants these to share
a separate /home partition. This method preserves the recovery partition,
which can have drivers that aren't in the original Windows installation
DVD images, but you may be able to get newer install images or
download drivers from the vendor's site. A fresh install of current
Windows is generally better than trying to upgrade a years-old
recovery image. I would do away with the recovery partition.
A fresh install of Windows seems the way to go.
Using Windows tools to shrink the original partition has been
reliable for me. With Windows 10 it was necessary to disable
"fastboot" as that just loads Windows without allowing the user
to choose another OS.
In my experience, many users with 1TB drives were happy with
1/4 TB for Windows, a 1/8 TB linux "root" partition, and the
residual for /home. The others generally need much more than 1TB,
Once upon a time, I did a triple boot on an 80 GB drive.
Likely not so practical now.
'Twas tight then.
A recent thought:
IIRC Linux and Windows have different
ideas about what to do with the clock.
How is that usually handled?
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
11:06 p.m.
On Sun, 2022-07-03 at 21:04 -0500, Michael Hennebry wrote:
IIRC Linux and Windows have different
ideas about what to do with the clock.
How is that usually handled?
Badly... Nothing seems to have changed.
If you can get Windows to properly run in UTC, that's best.
If you can get Linux to run well using local time, that's second best.
Though be prepared to have a fight around daylight savings time changes
(Linux usually worked well enough by itself, in local time, but dual
booting may require you to manually intervene on both sides, so both
sides feel they've correctly accounted for the daylight savings
change).
Otherwise, be prepared to tell each OS to resync their clock each time
you boot the other OS. I've found that neither will automatically
correct the clock when it's out by a significant factor.
NB: I don't actually *run* Windows. It's an idle thing that's still
left on one of my laptop drive that I occasionally fire up when trying
out different Linux releases. Clock issues are about the only
shenanigans I look at on Windows, it has no functional use for me.
--
uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1160.71.1.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Jun 28 15:37:28 UTC 2022 x86_64
Boilerplate: All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.
2:13 a.m.
On 4 Jul 2022, at 03:11, Michael Hennebry
<hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.nodak.edu> wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jul 2022, George N. White III wrote:
>> On Wed, Jun 29, 2022 at 6:23 PM Robert McBroom via users <
>> users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:
>
> Do you plan to have the user "home" directory in a separate partition?
> There have been glitches with configuration details stored in the
> users home directory. One approach is to keep users "home" directories
> separate but share Documents, etc. via a 4th partition.
Haven't quite decided.
I've been bitten by the aforementioned
glitches even without multiple boots.
The reason for the third boot is so that in the case of a
bad install, there is still a good install to fall back on.
Ideally, I will not be running both Linux's.
I have previously used the documents partition method.
That said, 'twould be nice to keep things like Firefox windows.
Normally, I'd expect a new version of a program to be able to read
the previousl versions configuration and other data.
The aforemention bite occurred when Firefox only thought it could.
> This is essentially what I have been doing for years, but Michael wants
> two linux boot partitions. He didn't mention if he wants these to share
> a separate /home partition. This method preserves the recovery partition,
> which can have drivers that aren't in the original Windows installation
> DVD images, but you may be able to get newer install images or
> download drivers from the vendor's site. A fresh install of current
> Windows is generally better than trying to upgrade a years-old
> recovery image. I would do away with the recovery partition.
A fresh install of Windows seems the way to go.
> Using Windows tools to shrink the original partition has been
> reliable for me. With Windows 10 it was necessary to disable
> "fastboot" as that just loads Windows without allowing the user
> to choose another OS.
> In my experience, many users with 1TB drives were happy with
> 1/4 TB for Windows, a 1/8 TB linux "root" partition, and the
> residual for /home. The others generally need much more than 1TB,
Once upon a time, I did a triple boot on an 80 GB drive.
Likely not so practical now.
'Twas tight then.
A recent thought:
IIRC Linux and Windows have different
ideas about what to do with the clock.
How is that usually handled?
Set the bios to utc.
Then each os will do the right thing.
I ran duel boot win10+fedora like this,
now I duel boot win11+fedora in this way.
Barry
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
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7:37 a.m.
Barry wrote:
> I ran duel boot win10+fedora like this,
> now I duel boot win11+fedora in this way.
Patrick O'Callaghan:
Duel? Are they fighting each other?
Sorry :-)
I think it's rather apt.
Not sorry ;-)
--
uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1160.71.1.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Jun 28 15:37:28 UTC 2022 x86_64
Boilerplate: All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.
6:16 p.m.
On 4/7/22 22:37, Tim via users wrote:
Barry wrote:
>> I ran duel boot win10+fedora like this,
>> now I duel boot win11+fedora in this way.
Patrick O'Callaghan:
> Duel? Are they fighting each other?
>
> Sorry :-)
I think it's rather apt.
Not sorry ;-)
I'm tri-booting between Win11, Fedora and Ubuntu. I used to have the
bios time configured to local time and found that Linux assumed the bios
time was UTC, and didn't provide an easy way of changing that, and hence
was always 10 hours out, Windows used to allow configuration of that. As
indicated by other people setting the bios time to UTC used to correct
the issues. The motherboard I have now seems to have the time hard set
and doesn't provide any way of manually changing the time, and at the
moment I haven't paid attention to whether or not its set to UTC time.
I don't have separate home partitions, but being UEFI what I do have is
separate UEFI system partitions for all 3 OS's, I didn't try using one
partition for all 3, and I also found that Fedora would not start it's
installation process unless there was a partition configured as a UEFI
system partition.
regards,
Steve
10:11 p.m.
On Wed, 2022-07-06 at 09:16 +1000, Stephen Morris wrote:
I'm tri-booting between Win11, Fedora and Ubuntu. I used to have
the
bios time configured to local time and found that Linux assumed the
bios time was UTC, and didn't provide an easy way of changing that,
and hence was always 10 hours out, Windows used to allow
configuration of that.
It used to be dead easy to set Linux to UTC or localtime, there was a
tickbox on the graphical tool for setting the clock (during the
install, and later on the running OS). Doing the same thing on Windows
required delving into the registry after first finding out how to do
that over the web. I have had recent Linux installs presume localhost,
then had to figure out how to change it because they didn't make it
easy.
At least the option's still findable in MATE on CentOS 7, it's a
tickbox in the timezone tab in system-config-date. I can't see one on
Fedora 36, and I don't recall whether I got asked during the install.
Another of those things that got hidden by people who think we don't need to see these
options.
--
uname -rsvp
Linux 3.10.0-1160.71.1.el7.x86_64 #1 SMP Tue Jun 28 15:37:28 UTC 2022 x86_64
Boilerplate: All unexpected mail to my mailbox is automatically deleted.
I will only get to see the messages that are posted to the mailing list.
9:13 a.m.
On 7/3/22 22:04, Michael Hennebry wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jul 2022, George N. White III wrote:
> On Wed, Jun 29, 2022 at 6:23 PM Robert McBroom via users <
> users(a)lists.fedoraproject.org> wrote:
> Do you plan to have the user "home" directory in a separate partition?
> There have been glitches with configuration details stored in the
> users home directory. One approach is to keep users "home" directories
> separate but share Documents, etc. via a 4th partition.
Haven't quite decided.
I've been bitten by the aforementioned
glitches even without multiple boots.
The reason for the third boot is so that in the case of a
bad install, there is still a good install to fall back on.
Ideally, I will not be running both Linux's.
I have previously used the documents partition method.
That said, 'twould be nice to keep things like Firefox windows.
Normally, I'd expect a new version of a program to be able to read
the previousl versions configuration and other data.
The aforemention bite occurred when Firefox only thought it could.
> This is essentially what I have been doing for years, but Michael wants
> two linux boot partitions. He didn't mention if he wants these to share
> a separate /home partition. This method preserves the recovery
> partition,
> which can have drivers that aren't in the original Windows installation
> DVD images, but you may be able to get newer install images or
> download drivers from the vendor's site. A fresh install of current
> Windows is generally better than trying to upgrade a years-old
> recovery image. I would do away with the recovery partition.
A fresh install of Windows seems the way to go.
> Using Windows tools to shrink the original partition has been
> reliable for me. With Windows 10 it was necessary to disable
> "fastboot" as that just loads Windows without allowing the user
> to choose another OS.
> In my experience, many users with 1TB drives were happy with
> 1/4 TB for Windows, a 1/8 TB linux "root" partition, and the
> residual for /home. The others generally need much more than 1TB,
Running Windows 10, Fedora 35, Fedora 36 and CentOS 7. The
grub2-mkconfig with Fedora doesn't seem to honor grub.cfg or find the
boot of other linux. The Windows stanza chainloads without any problems.
There is no need to reinstall Windows. This is as the term seems to be a
BIOS boot.
I put the boot files of the second and higher linux systems in the
/root. The necessary files can be copied to the master boot partition.
The .conf entries in /boot/loader/entries are picked up by the grub menu
and boot the linux systems.
YMMV
9:40 a.m.
I'm going to put off dealing with the "new"
computer until I get another VGA cable.
This computer also requires a VGA cable,
which makes using the "new" one a bit of a bother.
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
11:26 a.m.
It can be a big tricky if this is BIOS firmware rather than UEFI. I'm
guessing it's probably UEFI in which case you can do the installations
in any order. For BIOS, it really should be Windows first, Fedora last
or else you get into a situation where Windows steps on GRUB and
you'll have to repair it by reinstalling GRUB (i.e. grub2-install).
Backup first.
From Windows, download the installation media creation tool and have
it make installation media. Do not install. You can also create Fedora
USB stick media with Fedora Media Creator for Windows.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows11
Then boot a Fedora Live ISO and obliterate the entire disk. If it's an
HDD, you can use the wipefs tool. If it's an SSD or NVMe, you can use
blkdiscard command.
Now install Windows first if the firmware is BIOS. Fedora last.
If firmware is UEFI, the order doesn't matter.
I agree with the suggestions to use Windows' tools to shrink NTFS and
its partition. But more importantly make sure to disable Fast
startup.https://dev.to/xeroxism/how-to-disable-fast-start-in-ubuntu-windows-dual-booting-setup-4akn
--
Chris Murphy
4:22 p.m.
On Fri, 1 Jul 2022, Chris Murphy wrote:
Backup first.
In this instance,
the only thing on the disk I might want is Windows.
That said, 'tis W10 and I suppose I
might need a later version someday.
From Windows, download the installation media creation tool and have
it make installation media. Do not install. You can also create Fedora
USB stick media with Fedora Media Creator for Windows.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows11
Then boot a Fedora Live ISO and obliterate the entire disk. If
it's an
HDD, you can use the wipefs tool. If it's an SSD or NVMe, you can use
blkdiscard command.
Why obliteration?
At what point can I do my partitioing?
Now install Windows first if the firmware is BIOS. Fedora last.
If firmware is UEFI, the order doesn't matter.
I agree with the suggestions to use Windows' tools to shrink NTFS and
its partition. But more importantly make sure to disable Fast
Still, why a two-step?
Why not with Windows tools or with Linux tools?
startup.https://dev.to/xeroxism/how-to-disable-fast-start-in-ubuntu-windows-dual-booting-setup-4akn
Now that I had not known was necessary?
I expect that if I do not,
Windows might try fast-starting from disk space
wFedora treated as swap.
Correct.
In the case of a DOS partition system,
I'm concerned about the third existing partition.
Is it something that could be recreated?
Just keeping it could be complicated.
Not sure about gparted,
but using fdisk, it would likely stay as number three (primary).
Additional partitions before it, would get partition numbers after it.
I've had trouble with that before.
As of now, there are only stadard partitions, 1-3.
Do not know enough about GPT.
--
Michael hennebry(a)web.cs.ndsu.NoDak.edu
"Sorry but your password must contain an uppercase letter, a number,
a haiku, a gang sign, a heiroglyph, and the blood of a virgin."
-- someeecards
651
days inactive
660
days old
15 comments
8 participants
participants (8)
-
Barry -
Chris Murphy -
George N. White III -
Michael Hennebry -
Patrick O'Callaghan -
Robert McBroom -
Stephen Morris -
Tim