Dear All,
For some reasons I want to know what are "Minimum Required RPM Packages" for installing fedora on a PC. At installation time, we can remove all optional packages and after removing them Fedora will install with nearly 200 packages! But, many of these packages are not necessary, for example OpenSSH, WireLess, etc.
Then, when I tried to remove those unwanted packages after installation, many many dependencies appeared.
So, I have two questions: 1- What are Minimum Required RPM Packages for installing Fedora? (just booting up the system with kernel and then, a simple command line access) 2- How can I reach this minimal system? (As I described above those dependencies make it impossible to remove unwanted packages after installation and also there is no option to remove unwanted packages before installation)
Sincerely yours, Siavash Ghiasvand
On 07/14/2010 02:51 AM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
Dear All,
For some reasons I want to know what are "Minimum Required RPM Packages" for installing fedora on a PC. At installation time, we can remove all optional packages and after removing them Fedora will install with nearly 200 packages! But, many of these packages are not necessary, for example OpenSSH, WireLess, etc.
Then, when I tried to remove those unwanted packages after installation, many many dependencies appeared.
So, I have two questions: 1- What are Minimum Required RPM Packages for installing Fedora? (just booting up the system with kernel and then, a simple command line access) 2- How can I reach this minimal system? (As I described above those dependencies make it impossible to remove unwanted packages after installation and also there is no option to remove unwanted packages before installation)
Sincerely yours, Siavash Ghiasvand
There is no such description in all of fedora's documentation. Also, your description of "unwanted" is too vague and may well be ill defined. For examle "ls", which is part of the core tools, is not necessary for the kernel to boot and run - but without it, you are pretty much crippled. Ditto with ps. So you need to dig deeper into understanding what you mean by the most basic set of packages.
Hi,
On 07/14/2010 11:51 AM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
2- How can I reach this minimal system? (As I described above those dependencies make it impossible to remove unwanted packages after installation and also there is no option to remove unwanted packages before installation)
Did you try a kickstart install with '%packages --nobase'? This gets you 189 packages (at least in rawhide). I don't know (and seriously doubt) that you can go any lower without substantial efforts (if you do, let me know). But if you find obviously unnecessary dependencies, it's probably a good idea to file a bug. Maybe you also want to take a look at http://www.owlriver.com/tips/tiny-centos/
Regards, Chris
siavash ghiasvand <siavash.ghiyasvand <at> gmail.com> writes:
Dear All,
For some reasons I want to know what are "Minimum Required RPM Packages" for installing fedora on a PC.
Hi, Search Google for: fedora minimal installation kickstart The first hit http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/MinimalPlatform will give you info about the project and a contact to the owner at Red Hat. But read on Google results ... JB
I thought F13 has a new "minimal" install option that gives you ~120 or so packages installed. That feature seems to have made it into the RHEL6 beta, too! (Very Cool, IMNSHO)
Dear Chris
Did you try a kickstart install with '%packages --nobase'? This gets you 189 packages (at least in rawhide).
Yes, I've tried it but unfortunately many unwanted packages like "wireless" will be installed with this option. Thanks for that link, I will check it out.
Dear JB
Search Google for: fedora minimal installation kickstart The first hit http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/MinimalPlatform
I googled it before many times but all links (including the above one) are talking about a Minimal Fedora which has near 200 packages (As is described before this amount of packages is very much for me)
Dear Chris
I thought F13 has a new "minimal" install option that gives you ~120 or so packages installed. That feature seems to have made it into the RHEL6 beta, too! (Very Cool, IMNSHO)
Yeah, you are right about that minimal install, but with that option exactly 180 packages will be installed! but I'm sure that near hundred of them is not required packages.
Sincerely yours, Siavash Ghiasvand
siavash ghiasvand <siavash.ghiyasvand <at> gmail.com> writes:
1- What are Minimum Required RPM Packages for installing Fedora? (just booting up the system with kernel and then, a simple command line access)
Hi, have you looked into http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraLiveCD/LiveCDHowTo paragraph Live image Configuration Files livecd-fedora-minimal.ks The base live image system (included in the 'livecd-tools' package) yum install livecd-tools rpm -ql livecd-tools cat /usr/share/doc/livecd-tools-031/livecd-fedora-minimal.ks paragraph Example: A Barebones Live CD Why not create that barebone live cd and see what good, bad, and ugly went into it ? JB
Dear JB
have you looked into http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraLiveCD/LiveCDHowTo Why not create that barebone live cd and see what good, bad, and ugly went into it ?
Thanks, I will take a look at it now, may be it could help me. But you know, the problem is Official Fedora Release assumes some packages as "Essential Packages" which are not essential for me! Look at this: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/MinimalPlatform/PackageList
Any other suggestions will be greatly appreciated.
On 07/14/2010 05:32 PM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
Dear JB
have you looked into http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/FedoraLiveCD/LiveCDHowTo Why not create that barebone live cd and see what good, bad, and ugly went into it ?
Thanks, I will take a look at it now, may be it could help me. But you know, the problem is Official Fedora Release assumes some packages as "Essential Packages" which are not essential for me! Look at this: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Features/MinimalPlatform/PackageList
Be specific. Which packages? Why can't you use kickstart?
Rahul
Be specific. Which packages? Why can't you use kickstart?
Rahul
Each package which is NOT essential for booting the system. Some of those important but not essential packages are: - passwd - openssh - sudo - dirmngr - file and many more...
These packages are very important but they are not essential! I mean the linux kernel can booting up without them. So, I need the minimum (Read it: Just essential) packages which must have to bring up a Fedora system.
Sincerely yours, Siavash Ghiasvand
On 07/14/2010 08:18 PM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
Be specific. Which packages? Why can't you use kickstart?
Rahul
Each package which is NOT essential for booting the system. Some of those important but not essential packages are:
- passwd
- openssh
- sudo
- dirmngr
- file
and many more...
These packages are very important but they are not essential! I mean the linux kernel can booting up without them. So, I need the minimum (Read it: Just essential) packages which must have to bring up a Fedora system
You didn't answer why you can't use kickstart and pick your own set of packages?
Rahul
You didn't answer why you can't use kickstart and pick your own set of packages?
Rahul
Cause first I need to know what are those essential packages! after that, as you and other guys said I can use kickstart to picking up them. BTW, thanks for your attention And if you have any idea about those essential packages please let me know. thanks.
Siavash
On 07/14/2010 08:30 PM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
You didn't answer why you can't use kickstart and pick your own set of packages?
Rahul
Cause first I need to know what are those essential packages! after that, as you and other guys said I can use kickstart to picking up them.
You pick what you want in that list and remove those you don't want. There is no agreed upon list that applies to everybody.
Rahul
Cause first I need to know what are those essential packages! after that, as you and other guys said I can use kickstart to picking up them.
I use this in rhel 5 right before I list the extra packages I want such as tar/openssh etc...
%pre #!/bin/bash yum groupinfo base | perl -we 'my $in_mand = 0; while (<>) { $in_mand =0 if /\s+default packages/i; print if $in_mand; $in_mand = 1 if /\s+mandatory packages/i; }' > /tmp/package_base_mandatory %end
%packages --nobase @ Core %include /tmp/package_base_mandatory dhclient irqbalance logwatch mailx microcode_ctl net-snmp net-snmp-utils net-snmp-devel nfs-utils ntp openssh-clients openssh-server postfix readahead screen tar vim-common vim-enhanced yum yum-priorities
I use this in rhel 5 right before I list the extra packages I want such as tar/openssh etc...
Thanks Joseph. It would be helpfull.
I would make a minimal LiveCD from a kickstart file. Then boot a virtual machine with the iso. I would then try to remove what I consider "not required" and double check the yum output for essential deps which might have crept in. I would then use that to further streamline my kickstart. Then rinse and repeat until satisfied.
Thanks Suvayu, good tips.
tell us _why_ you want this "extreme minimal" install
The first reason is: "Minimal disk drive" and the second reason is: "Prevent any future conflict" which means, on that "extreme minimal linux" all packages can be installed without any problem (must be guaranteed). I'm talking about some rare, custom-build packages which may conflict with Fedora base packages.
On Wednesday 14 July 2010 10:50 AM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
tell us_why_ you want this "extreme minimal" install
The first reason is: "Minimal disk drive" and the second reason is: "Prevent any future conflict" which means, on that "extreme minimal linux" all packages can be installed without any problem (must be guaranteed). I'm talking about some rare, custom-build packages which may conflict with Fedora base packages.
Okay, as I mentioned in my earlier post, for disk space requirements you can try febootstrap. it is available in the Fedora repositories.
Name : febootstrap Arch : x86_64 Version : 2.7 Release : 1.fc13.1 Size : 67 k Repo : updates Summary : Bootstrap a new Fedora system (like debootstrap) URL : http://et.redhat.com/~rjones/febootstrap/ License : GPLv2+ Description: febootstrap is a Fedora equivalent to Debian's debootstrap. You : can use it to create a basic Fedora filesystem, and build initramfs : (initrd.img) or filesystem images. : : febootstrap also includes a separate tool to minimize filesystems : by removing unneeded locales, documentation etc. : : The main difference from other appliance building tools is that : this one doesn't need to be run as root.
But this might not reduce your list of installed packages to something as small as you are looking for. Maybe you can try the method I outlined earlier to reduce the package list, and subsequently use this to reduce the disk usage.
GL
Okay, as I mentioned in my earlier post, for disk space requirements you can try febootstrap. it is available in the Fedora repositories.
But this might not reduce your list of installed packages to something as small as you are looking for. Maybe you can try the method I outlined earlier to reduce the package list, and subsequently use this to reduce the disk usage.
Thank you very much, I will check it ASAP.
Once upon a time, siavash ghiasvand siavash.ghiyasvand@gmail.com said:
Each package which is NOT essential for booting the system. Some of those important but not essential packages are:
- passwd
- openssh
- sudo
- dirmngr
- file
and many more...
Everybody's list of "essential" packages is different. For example, most people would have "passwd" on their list, since without it, you can't set a password for logging in. You may be using network logins, even for root, so you might put NIS or LDAP client packages on your "essential" list instead, but most do not (or don't for all users), so they'd want "passwd" (and may not want NIS/LDAP support as "essential").
Some things are installed because they are dependencies. For example, even though you may never use "awk" yourself, the standard init scripts use and require it, so you can't remove it.
If you don't like the core packages in the Fedora list, you'll have to decide on your own what you consider "essential"; nobody can make that decision for you. You can go through the list of installed packages and use rpm and yum to see what the dependencies are (to see what you can remove and what is required by basic system packages).
Everybody's list of "essential" packages is different. For example, ... remove and what is required by basic system packages).
There is no such description in all of fedora's documentation. Also, your description of "unwanted" is too vague and may well be ill defined.
Thanks chris and JD It seams I couldn't describe my issue clearly.
As you said, "passwd" or "less" may be or may not be essential for some users! But, without "udev" or "device-mapper" system couldn't boot at all; I'm looking for these packages, which are essential for a proper boot.
Clearly: I need a minimal list of those packages which are "critical for booting" a system and without just one of those packages booting is impossible. (A truly minimal)
Siavash
On Wednesday 14 July 2010 09:38 AM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
Everybody's list of "essential" packages is different. For example, ... remove and what is required by basic system packages).
There is no such description in all of fedora's documentation. Also, your description of "unwanted" is too vague and may well be ill defined.
Thanks chris and JD It seams I couldn't describe my issue clearly.
As you said, "passwd" or "less" may be or may not be essential for some users! But, without "udev" or "device-mapper" system couldn't boot at all; I'm looking for these packages, which are essential for a proper boot.
Clearly: I need a minimal list of those packages which are "critical for booting" a system and without just one of those packages booting is impossible. (A truly minimal)
I would make a minimal LiveCD from a kickstart file. Then boot a virtual machine with the iso. I would then try to remove what I consider "not required" and double check the yum output for essential deps which might have crept in. I would then use that to further streamline my kickstart. Then rinse and repeat until satisfied.
If you feel like it, you might want to tell us _why_ you want this "extreme minimal" install. There could be other solutions people can suggest. For example if you want fewer packages to reduce disk space requirements then there are efforts like febootstrap that reduce disk usage to under 50 MB. If your requirement is because you want to use it in a very specialised hardware for a very specialised application, even then people might be able to suggest better alternatives.
To conclude, more complete information will be helpful.
Siavash
GL
siavash ghiasvand <siavash.ghiyasvand <at> gmail.com> writes:
1- What are Minimum Required RPM Packages for installing Fedora? (just booting up the system with kernel and then, a simple command line access) 2- How can I reach this minimal system? (As I described above those dependencies make it impossible to remove unwanted packages after installation and also there is no option to remove unwanted packages before installation)
Hi, I have found a project called JeOS = "Just enough Operating System" that deals with similar issues. http://orangejeos.sourceforge.net/ It has an informative site. After that you can download oj-builder-1.8.7-11.noarch.rpm which, when installed, lets you take a look at their kickstart files. I hope it will be useful. JB
Hi, I have found a project called JeOS = "Just enough Operating System" that deals with similar issues. http://orangejeos.sourceforge.net/ JB
Thank you very much, I read that project description and it looks similar to mine. but for further reply I must spend some time there.
Siavash
siavash ghiasvand wrote: <snip>
For some reasons I want to know what are "Minimum Required RPM Packages" for installing fedora on a PC.
'For some reasons' is very broad and allows for a maximum possible reasons. and, almost as many replies as you have received.
as has been stated, you do not really give a good answer to your intent and use/need for your desire.
one thing for sure, your effort to find an answer is *minimal*.
did you try google? i think not, else you 'would have'/'should have' mentioned doing so.
so, as a guide to what you want to do, an 'google linux advanced' search of "minimal+system", with quotes and '+' sign gives 4,470 hits;
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&as_q=&as_epq=minimal%2Bsystem&...
a quick look thru 1st 30 gives some good pointers;
http://linuxguide.sourceforge.net/linux-minimal-filesystem.html http://sites.google.com/site/4utils/articles/minimal_linux_system/minimal-li... http://minimallinux.com/ http://www.experts-exchange.com/OS/Linux/Q_23022039.html http://www.linux-archive.org/centos/153770-what-minimum-iso-build-server.htm... http://www.linuxcertified.com/linux-recovery.html
above, is including for server and recovery floppy disk.
granted, these are not fedora, per se, but they give you a base to build a fedora system.
hth.
did you try google? i think not, else you 'would have'/'should have' mentioned doing so. so, as a guide to what you want to do, an 'google linux advanced' search of "minimal+system", with quotes and '+' sign gives 4,470 hits; g
Dear g,
For sure I've googled it carefully before sending this email. I saw those links and none of them did the trick which I want, Cause I'm looking for a LIST of RPM packages which are sufficient to bring up a simple kernel and nothing more.
I can erase files from an installed system and create a live disk from them , even I can use something like "BasicLinux" or also compiling anything from source will solve the problem But, I must bring up a PC with minimal Fedora Official RPM packages not anything else.
As other friends said, now I'm working on UN-installing packages from an installed system to achieve that minimum set of packages.
Siavash
siavash ghiasvand writes:
did you try google? i think not, else you 'would have'/'should have' mentioned doing so. so, as a guide to what you want to do, an 'google linux advanced' search of "minimal+system", with quotes and '+' sign gives 4,470 hits; g
Dear g,
For sure I've googled it carefully before sending this email. I saw those links and none of them did the trick which I want, Cause I'm looking for a LIST of RPM packages which are sufficient to bring up a simple kernel and nothing more.
I have a headless machine that serves as a router, a web and mail server, and a firewall. I stripped it down as much as possible, while still leaving a usable system that can be upgraded normally.
Right now, there are 458 rpm packages on it.
There are no development tools of any kind there, no X, no Gnome. Well, almost no X, some X stuff gets pulled in because of apcupsd-cgi -- there's a UPS attached to it. Dropping that will probably bring the total count to about 430, or so packages.
By comparison, my desktops are somewhere north of 1100 packages.
Once upon a time, Sam Varshavchik mrsam@courier-mta.com said:
I have a headless machine that serves as a router, a web and mail server, and a firewall. I stripped it down as much as possible, while still leaving a usable system that can be upgraded normally.
Right now, there are 458 rpm packages on it.
I have a pretty slimmed-down server that is a disk and PXE boot server (NFS, HTTP, TFTP), NTP server (with a GPS clock source), UPS monitor (with NUT, not apcupsd), and NNTP cache. It has 257 RPMs installed, and it uses about 1G of a 4G CF card (the OS lives on flash so the disks can spin down when idle).
As I said, to determine your own minimum, start with a base install and work down from there. Look at requires/depends with rpm, and run "yum remove foo" (and answer "n" if you don't like what is going to be removed).
I have a headless machine that serves as a router, a web and mail server, and a firewall. I stripped it down as much as possible, while still leaving a usable system that can be upgraded normally.
Right now, there are 458 rpm packages on it.
There are no development tools of any kind there, no X, no Gnome. Well, almost no X, some X stuff gets pulled in because of apcupsd-cgi -- there's a UPS attached to it. Dropping that will probably bring the total count to about 430, or so packages.
By comparison, my desktops are somewhere north of 1100 packages.
Dear Sam, Thanks for your time, actually I reduced the number of packages to less than 130 cause I'm not even need mail server, firewall, ... .
As I said, to determine your own minimum, start with a base install and work down from there. Look at requires/depends with rpm, and run "yum remove foo" (and answer "n" if you don't like what is going to be removed).
Dear Chris, I've followed this way and now I have a working Fedora with less than 130 packages. Now all those remained packages have many dependencies to fundamental packages but I think some of those dependencies can be ignored.
Best Regards, Siavash Ghiasvand
On 15 July 2010 10:08, siavash ghiasvand <siavash.ghiyasvand gmail.com> wrote:
As I said, to determine your own minimum, start with a base install and work down from there. Look at requires/depends with rpm, and run "yum remove foo" (and answer "n" if you don't like what is going to be removed).
rpmreaper is a nice little ripper & stripper I use for this
..dex
On Thursday, July 15, 2010 00:03:28 siavash ghiasvand wrote:
I'm looking for a LIST of RPM packages which are sufficient to bring up a simple kernel and nothing more.
I can erase files from an installed system and create a live disk from them , even I can use something like "BasicLinux" or also compiling anything from source will solve the problem But, I must bring up a PC with minimal Fedora Official RPM packages not anything else.
As other friends said, now I'm working on UN-installing packages from an installed system to achieve that minimum set of packages.
While I think I understand your criteria for a package being "essential" (in the sense that the system fails to boot if this package is not present), I am still confused. Booting the system is a process that takes several stages. At what point exactly do you consider that the system has finished booting?
Do you want to get into the login screen? Graphical? Text only?
Are you booting into runlevel 3 or maybe 1 (multiuser vs single user environment)?
Do you need networking/bluetooth/smart-card/other hardware support? Do you consider that the boot process is over before or after the initrc scripts have run?
Do you need to run init at all? Kernel runs init automatically *after* it has finished "booting itself". Is that good enough?
Do you consider a successful boot anything that does not produce a kernel panic?
AFAIK, in order to get the kernel up and running, you don't even need to mount any filesystems, other than the virtual initramfs thing in memory. Even some kernel modules can be stripped. For example, you can boot without initializing, say, sound card. Do you need that? Do you need functional USB ports? SCSI? Mouse? Anything other than the keyboard and graphics card? You can remove quite a big chunk of the kernel itself, while still retaining some elementary functionality, and successfully booting the kernel.
In terms of packages, for a complete barebones boot I would guess you need only grub, the kernel, glibc, and their dependencies. But if you want to be able to login after that, you will want more (init? bash?). If you want all hardware to work, you will want even more (initrc scripts? various deamons?). If you want multiuser environment, you need still more packages. Etc. You get the picture.
So maybe it would be a good idea to specify what exactly do you mean by "system has booted successfully". That way you will avoid a lot of confusion in getting answers, because various people have quite different opinions on what they consider a successful boot. Some want to see at the end the graphical login screen, which requires X and a whole other bunch of stuff...
HTH, :-) Marko
On 07/14/2010 07:02 PM, Marko Vojinovic wrote:
On Thursday, July 15, 2010 00:03:28 siavash ghiasvand wrote:
I'm looking for a LIST of RPM packages which are sufficient to bring up a simple kernel and nothing more.
I can erase files from an installed system and create a live disk from them , even I can use something like "BasicLinux" or also compiling anything from source will solve the problem But, I must bring up a PC with minimal Fedora Official RPM packages not anything else.
As other friends said, now I'm working on UN-installing packages from an installed system to achieve that minimum set of packages.
While I think I understand your criteria for a package being "essential" (in the sense that the system fails to boot if this package is not present), I am still confused. Booting the system is a process that takes several stages. At what point exactly do you consider that the system has finished booting?
Do you want to get into the login screen? Graphical? Text only?
Are you booting into runlevel 3 or maybe 1 (multiuser vs single user environment)?
Do you need networking/bluetooth/smart-card/other hardware support? Do you consider that the boot process is over before or after the initrc scripts have run?
Do you need to run init at all? Kernel runs init automatically *after* it has finished "booting itself". Is that good enough?
Do you consider a successful boot anything that does not produce a kernel panic?
AFAIK, in order to get the kernel up and running, you don't even need to mount any filesystems, other than the virtual initramfs thing in memory. Even some kernel modules can be stripped. For example, you can boot without initializing, say, sound card. Do you need that? Do you need functional USB ports? SCSI? Mouse? Anything other than the keyboard and graphics card? You can remove quite a big chunk of the kernel itself, while still retaining some elementary functionality, and successfully booting the kernel.
In terms of packages, for a complete barebones boot I would guess you need only grub, the kernel, glibc, and their dependencies. But if you want to be able to login after that, you will want more (init? bash?). If you want all hardware to work, you will want even more (initrc scripts? various deamons?). If you want multiuser environment, you need still more packages. Etc. You get the picture.
So maybe it would be a good idea to specify what exactly do you mean by "system has booted successfully". That way you will avoid a lot of confusion in getting answers, because various people have quite different opinions on what they consider a successful boot. Some want to see at the end the graphical login screen, which requires X and a whole other bunch of stuff...
HTH, :-) Marko
Well put Marko. I had asked of Siavash Ghiasvand a clarification of what he means by minimal. I never saw his stated criteria for minimal.
While I think I understand your criteria for a package being "essential" (in the sense that the system fails to boot if this package is not present), I am still confused. Booting the system is a process that takes several stages. At what point exactly do you consider that the system has finished booting?
Do you want to get into the login screen? Graphical? Text only?
Are you booting into runlevel 3 or maybe 1 (multiuser vs single user environment)?
Do you need networking/bluetooth/smart-card/other hardware support? Do you consider that the boot process is over before or after the initrc scripts have run?
Do you need to run init at all? Kernel runs init automatically *after* it has finished "booting itself". Is that good enough?
Do you consider a successful boot anything that does not produce a kernel panic?
AFAIK, in order to get the kernel up and running, you don't even need to mount any filesystems, other than the virtual initramfs thing in memory. Even some kernel modules can be stripped. For example, you can boot without initializing, say, sound card. Do you need that? Do you need functional USB ports? SCSI? Mouse? Anything other than the keyboard and graphics card? You can remove quite a big chunk of the kernel itself, while still retaining some elementary functionality, and successfully booting the kernel.
In terms of packages, for a complete barebones boot I would guess you need only grub, the kernel, glibc, and their dependencies. But if you want to be able to login after that, you will want more (init? bash?). If you want all hardware to work, you will want even more (initrc scripts? various deamons?). If you want multiuser environment, you need still more packages. Etc. You get the picture.
So maybe it would be a good idea to specify what exactly do you mean by "system has booted successfully". That way you will avoid a lot of confusion in getting answers, because various people have quite different opinions on what they consider a successful boot. Some want to see at the end the graphical login screen, which requires X and a whole other bunch of stuff...
HTH, :-) Marko
First of all thank you for this complete answer,
It sounds I need to be more specific. Ok, here we go. Consider a system which has an SCSI hard disk, 2GB of ram, a 64bit CPU, an internal IDE connected DVD-Drive, a common KeyBoard and an RBG connected monitor. just it. After getting done this project my expectation from this system is: When I start the system, Grub must be loaded and after choosing desired operating system, booting procedure will be started and all would be OK if after a "successful boot" I have a login page in runlevel 3 with a simple Bash access, a pure text-mode. So, any other internal or external devices like soundcard, printer, bluetooth, USB, etc... are not needed! (In this state please consider that the kernel is an RPM and I can't remove modules from it. so, I will and also must accept the overhead of kernel modules).
With the above considerations, It clearly shows that something like Init, RC, initscripts, bash and grubby must be exist. but what a bout other packages? which of them are critical for a "successful boot" with above definition.
Till now I just checked dependencies between installed packages and removed those that were stand alone (after doing this near 130 packages remained) but I think some of these dependencies can be ignored. But I can't find those unreal dependencies.
Now I think that "Minimal Fedora" system is clearly defined.
siavash ghiasvand wrote: <snip>
For sure I've googled it carefully before sending this email.
ok. but still not a final intent for use. which makes your request more intriguing.
after re-reading your post, being that you have eliminated obvious types of server and still not mentioning final intent, it is starting to sound like you are/may be, working on a class project.
+++ }> For some reasons I want to know }> which are not essential for me! }> I'm not even need mail server, firewall, ... . +++
i went back to google to do another search with new parameters;
yum rpm fedora "minimal+system"
which found some possibles;
a list removables; [yes, it is fc5, but list might catch any you have missed] http://colinux.wikia.com/wiki/Fedora5MinimalInstall071
a kickstart file;
http://blog.vodkamelone.de/archives/151-Red-Hat-Enterprise-LinuxCentOS-5-min...
at experts-exchange.com, there is;
What packages can i remove for a minimal system? http://www.experts-exchange.com/OS/Linux/Q_23022039.html where you can see answer to by joining with a 30 day free trial.
to your comment about 'modules' and 'kernel', if you wish/need to reduce kernel, consider that if you build your 'minimal' system at same level or your 'full' operating system, you can use latter to build your kernel and copy it to your 'minimal' to reduce memory usage.
anyway, much luck.
i went back to google to do another search with new parameters;
yum rpm fedora "minimal+system"
which found some possibles;
a list removables; [yes, it is fc5, but list might catch any you have missed] http://colinux.wikia.com/wiki/Fedora5MinimalInstall071
a kickstart file;
http://blog.vodkamelone.de/archives/151-Red-Hat-Enterprise-LinuxCentOS-5-min...
at experts-exchange.com, there is;
What packages can i remove for a minimal system? http://www.experts-exchange.com/OS/Linux/Q_23022039.html where you can see answer to by joining with a 30 day free trial.
to your comment about 'modules' and 'kernel', if you wish/need to reduce kernel, consider that if you build your 'minimal' system at same level or your 'full' operating system, you can use latter to build your kernel and copy it to your 'minimal' to reduce memory usage.
anyway, much luck.
Dear Geleem, Thank you very much for your help, I will read them ASAP.
P.S: after removign many packages, now, my current "minimal fedora", has less than 100 packages! ;)
Regards, Siavash
siavash ghiasvand wrote: <snip>
Thank you very much for your help, I will read them ASAP.
welcome very much.
i elected to wait a little while so i could ask following questions. :)
P.S: after removign many packages, now, my current "minimal fedora", has less than 100 packages! ;)
how many are you down to now?
when are you going to post a link to a list?
i elected to wait a little while so i could ask following questions. :)
how many are you down to now?
when are you going to post a link to a list?
Dear geleem,
By now, system can coming up with just 95 packages and it seems that nothing can be reduced any more. but I must prove that (95 is the minimal) and then I will publish the 95-package list + a simple script to reduce "Basic FC12" to "Minimal FC12" which we named it "SA-Linux" ;)
Regards.
siavash ghiasvand wrote: <snip>
By now, system can come up with just 95 packages and it seems that
<snip>
to reduce "Basic FC12" to "Minimal FC12" which we named it "SA-Linux" ;)
sounds good.
tho i would think SA-Fedora12 would be more appropriate.
do not forget that there is DSL, Damn Small Linux.
sounds good.
tho i would think SA-Fedora12 would be more appropriate.
do not forget that there is DSL, Damn Small Linux.
Thanks, yeah, you are right. let me talk about this with my team-mate (SA-Fedora12).
Thanks for remind me about DSL, but we have two different point of view, DSL=Minimal size but SA=Minimum Package. Thanks for your support ;)
On 07/14/2010 03:51 AM, siavash ghiasvand wrote:
Dear All,
For some reasons I want to know what are "Minimum Required RPM Packages" for installing fedora on a PC. At installation time, we can remove all optional packages and after removing them Fedora will install with nearly 200 packages! But, many of these packages are not necessary, for example OpenSSH, WireLess, etc.
... snip ...
Fedora is not a minimalist distro. Therefore, you are looking at the wrong things.
If you examine embedded systems, you won't find very many Fedora based verses, say debian.
Cisco makes home market routers that have 8MB ROM to store the OS. Try that with Fedora sometime. :)
Much of the work of getting Linux on smart-phones, such as Android, is getting it to run in tight spaces.
The purpose of Fedora is stated on the Fedora pages very succinctly. It is NOT for embedded systems, but has two priorities, in this order:
1. Server class systems 2. Desktop class systems.
Having said all of that, I myself have made embedded systems with a Fedora base.
If you allow 256MB RAM (or more), and 512MB swap, rpm database, yum intact (for updates) and most generic utilities (not busybox), you will end up with close to 400 rpms, and require nearly 2GB of disk space to accommodate OS, swap, and have room for some data. Since my requirements at the time were to run it on a 2GB compact flash card, that worked perfectly.
If you trim it below that, its no longer really Fedora. It becomes a custom distro, based upon Fedora, that you have spent a lot of time to build! :)
There are a lot of those, by the way. Moblin, and now Moblin + Maemo == MeeGo, started life as Fedora, but you wouldn't recognize it now!
Good Luck!
Fedora is not a minimalist distro. Therefore, you are looking at the wrong things.
If you examine embedded systems, you won't find very many Fedora based verses, say debian.
Cisco makes home market routers that have 8MB ROM to store the OS. Try that with Fedora sometime. :)
Much of the work of getting Linux on smart-phones, such as Android, is getting it to run in tight spaces.
The purpose of Fedora is stated on the Fedora pages very succinctly. It is NOT for embedded systems, but has two priorities, in this order:
- Server class systems
- Desktop class systems.
Having said all of that, I myself have made embedded systems with a Fedora base.
If you allow 256MB RAM (or more), and 512MB swap, rpm database, yum intact (for updates) and most generic utilities (not busybox), you will end up with close to 400 rpms, and require nearly 2GB of disk space to accommodate OS, swap, and have room for some data. Since my requirements at the time were to run it on a 2GB compact flash card, that worked perfectly.
If you trim it below that, its no longer really Fedora. It becomes a custom distro, based upon Fedora, that you have spent a lot of time to build! :)
There are a lot of those, by the way. Moblin, and now Moblin + Maemo == MeeGo, started life as Fedora, but you wouldn't recognize it now!
Good Luck!
Hi phil,
We can assume that, this is just another linux distro (as you said) like other thousands linux distros which were released till now. BTW, Thank you for this valuable information. and Good Luck ;)
Siavash
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