PC bios confused in which harddrive to boot fedora OS: Reboot and select proper boot device or insert boot media!

[Excalibur Xcalibur]

Hi All,
          This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server running fedora
linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I wanted to mirror
the server with an identical harddrive. When I plugged my new harddrive in,
I got the message:

"Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"

*It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS though), the
PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot harddrive. Weird! If a plug a
different harddisk than the one with the  linux OS, they system boots up.
Any clues on how to fix this problem? *

*
-- 
Peter "Excalibur"

[Karl Larsen]

Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  Hi All,
>            This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server running 
>  fedora linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I 
>  wanted to mirror the server with an identical harddrive. When I 
>  plugged my new harddrive in, I got the message:
>
>  "Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"
>
>  *It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS 
>  though), the PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot harddrive. 
>  Weird! If a plug a different harddisk than the one with the  linux OS, 
>  they system boots up. Any clues on how to fix this problem? *
>
>  *
>  -- 
>  Peter "Excalibur"  
I rather think the operator is confused. First you
need to look at what 
your bios did to the original HD. Your results make me think your old HD 
became another HD in the chain so it looks like /dev/sdb now when it was 
/dev/sda when alone in the computer.

    Look at what you bios has done. If these are both IDE drives make 
sure they are not on the same cable.




-- 

	Karl F. Larsen, AKA K5DI
	Linux User
	#450462   http://counter.li.org.

[Excalibur Xcalibur]

Please read below:

On 9/30/07, Karl Larsen <k5di(a)zianet.com&gt; wrote:
>  Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  > Hi All,
>  >           This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server running
>  > fedora linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I
>  > wanted to mirror the server with an identical harddrive. When I
>  > plugged my new harddrive in, I got the message:
>  >
>  > "Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"
>  >
>  > *It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS
>  > though), the PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot harddrive.
>  > Weird! If a plug a different harddisk than the one with the  linux OS,
>  > they system boots up. Any clues on how to fix this problem? *
>  >
>  > *
>  > --
>  > Peter "Excalibur"
>  I rather think the operator is confused. First you need to look at what 



Well Karl you have to agree that this is confusing.:)


your bios did to the original HD. Your results make me think your old HD
>  became another HD in the chain so it looks like /dev/sdb now when it
> was
>  /dev/sda when alone in the computer. 


Well yeah in a technical way.


    Look at what you bios has done. If these are both IDE drives make
>  sure they are not on the same cable. 



They are SATA drives. And I only had some molex connectors around. So I used
a molex to SATA adapters to connect the drives.

As for the BIOS, it shows two identical drives connected. And they both have
the same booting code.


They might have been connected on the same molex cable extension. So if I
understand correctly, just placing them on totally different cable would
solve the problem?


-- 
Peter "Excalibur"

[Karl Larsen]

Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  Please read below:
>
>  On 9/30/07, *Karl Larsen* <k5di(a)zianet.com <mailto:[e-mail]>> 
>  wrote:
>
>      Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>      > Hi All,
>      >           This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server
>      running
>      > fedora linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I
>      > wanted to mirror the server with an identical harddrive. When I
>      > plugged my new harddrive in, I got the message:
>      >
>      > "Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"
>      >
>      > *It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS
>      > though), the PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot
>      harddrive.
>      > Weird! If a plug a different harddisk than the one with
>      the  linux OS,
>      > they system boots up. Any clues on how to fix this problem? *
>      >
>      > *
>      > --
>      > Peter "Excalibur"
>      I rather think the operator is confused. First you need to look at
>      what
>
>
>
>
>  Well Karl you have to agree that this is confusing.:)
>   
>
>      your bios did to the original HD. Your results make me think your
>      old HD
>      became another HD in the chain so it looks like /dev/sdb now when
>      it was
>      /dev/sda when alone in the computer.
>
>
>
>  Well yeah in a technical way.
>   
>
>          Look at what you bios has done. If these are both IDE drives make
>      sure they are not on the same cable.
>
>
>
>
>  They are SATA drives. And I only had some molex connectors around. So 
>  I used a molex to SATA adapters to connect the drives.
>
>  As for the BIOS, it shows two identical drives connected. And they 
>  both have the same booting code.
>
>
>  They might have been connected on the same molex cable extension. So 
>  if I understand correctly, just placing them on totally different 
>  cable would solve the problem?
>
>
>  -- 
>  Peter "Excalibur"  
Hi Peter, someone has been not letting my answer reach
you. This time I 
send it to you direct.

    First, you need to get real SATA Data Cables. I do not know how you 
got your Molex cable to work. Also I have SATA and my book says that 
only one HD per SATA cable! It can't work like the older IDE drives.

    So get the real cables and I think your problems will vanish.

    And to the person who is killing my mail to this list, if your going 
to use this than make it known so we all know some mail at your whim 
will disappear!



-- 

	Karl F. Larsen, AKA K5DI
	Linux User
	#450462   http://counter.li.org.

[Excalibur Xcalibur]

Thanks Karl, Bruno and Mikkel for the replies.

I used this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812101120
(I mean why do they sell those?!?!!)

and this:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812201002


-- 
Peter "Excalibur"

On 9/30/07, Karl Larsen <k5di(a)zianet.com&gt; wrote:
>  Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  > Please read below:
>  >
>  > On 9/30/07, *Karl Larsen* <k5di(a)zianet.com <mailto:[e-mail]>>
>  > wrote:
>  >
>  >     Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  >     > Hi All,
>  >     >           This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server
>  >     running
>  >     > fedora linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I
>  >     > wanted to mirror the server with an identical harddrive. When I
>  >     > plugged my new harddrive in, I got the message:
>  >     >
>  >     > "Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"
>  >     >
>  >     > *It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS
>  >     > though), the PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot
>  >     harddrive.
>  >     > Weird! If a plug a different harddisk than the one with
>  >     the  linux OS,
>  >     > they system boots up. Any clues on how to fix this problem? *
>  >     >
>  >     > *
>  >     > --
>  >     > Peter "Excalibur"
>  >     I rather think the operator is confused. First you need to look at
>  >     what
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Well Karl you have to agree that this is confusing.:)
>  >
>  >
>  >     your bios did to the original HD. Your results make me think your
>  >     old HD
>  >     became another HD in the chain so it looks like /dev/sdb now when
>  >     it was
>  >     /dev/sda when alone in the computer.
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > Well yeah in a technical way.
>  >
>  >
>  >         Look at what you bios has done. If these are both IDE drives
>  make
>  >     sure they are not on the same cable.
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  >
>  > They are SATA drives. And I only had some molex connectors around. So
>  > I used a molex to SATA adapters to connect the drives.
>  >
>  > As for the BIOS, it shows two identical drives connected. And they
>  > both have the same booting code.
>  >
>  >
>  > They might have been connected on the same molex cable extension. So
>  > if I understand correctly, just placing them on totally different
>  > cable would solve the problem?
>  >
>  >
>  > --
>  > Peter "Excalibur"
>  Hi Peter, someone has been not letting my answer reach you. This time I
>  send it to you direct.
>
>      First, you need to get real SATA Data Cables. I do not know how you
>  got your Molex cable to work. Also I have SATA and my book says that
>  only one HD per SATA cable! It can't work like the older IDE drives.
>
>      So get the real cables and I think your problems will vanish.
>
>      And to the person who is killing my mail to this list, if your going
>  to use this than make it known so we all know some mail at your whim
>  will disappear!
>
>
>
>  --
>
>          Karl F. Larsen, AKA K5DI
>          Linux User
>          #450462   http://counter.li.org.
>
>

[Tim]

On Sun, 2007-09-30 at 21:47 -0400, Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  Thanks Karl, Bruno and Mikkel for the replies.
>  
>  I used this:
>  
>  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812101120
>  (I mean why do they sell those?!?!!)
>  
>  and this:
>  
>  http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16812201002 
Karl is getting confused.  Firstly, IDE PATA drives do not *need* to be
on separate cables (there's advantages in doing that, but it's not
needed).  Secondly, you're talking about the power connectors, and
that's something completely different, and irrelevent (unless it happens
to be faulty - but you'd not see a drive that's not working, not see
double).

As to two drives being identical, there shouldn't be a problem with two
of the same models being connected at once.  They won't be totally
identical, unless the manufacturer has done something wierd.  Even then,
I don't think that should be a problem.

Connecting two drives with identical data on them (e.g. cloned drives)
can be a problem, but that can be worked around.

You should say in what manner you're regarding them as identical.

You've mentioned that you're using SATA, so that puts PATA master and
slave issues out of the question, SATA doesn't share a bus like PATA
can.

I'm guessing that they way you've connected them, the computer is now
trying to boot from the other drive, and you haven't got anything on it
to boot from.  Try plugging them into each other's data ports, and see
if the system boots up from your first drive.  e.g. It's looking for
drive one, and you've got it plugged into socket two.

You might want to do what the message said, go into your BIOS, and play
with the options for selecting which is your boot drive.

-- 
(This box runs FC5, my others run FC4 & FC6, in case that's
 important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

[Excalibur Xcalibur]

Please read below:

On 10/1/07, Tim <ignored_mailbox(a)yahoo.com.au&gt; wrote:
>  *snip*
>  I'm guessing that they way you've connected them, the computer is now
>  trying to boot from the other drive, and you haven't got anything on it
>  to boot from.  Try plugging them into each other's data ports, and see
>  if the system boots up from your first drive.  e.g. It's looking for
>  drive one, and you've got it plugged into socket two. 

That worked! Just by interchanging cables.


You might want to do what the message said, go into your BIOS, and play
>  with the options for selecting which is your boot drive.
>
>  
Well this one doesn't work so well. The problem is that in the BIOS, both
are *identical*. Meaning they have the same reference caled ST57XXX.  So if
I select this one, it doesn't boot the primary drive.


-- 
Peter "Excalibur"

[Tim]

Tim:
> > You might want to do what the message said, go into your BIOS,
> and
> > play with the options for selecting which is your boot drive.  
Excalibur Xcalibur:
>  Well this one doesn't work so well. The problem is that in the
> BIOS,
>  both are *identical*. Meaning they have the same reference caled
>  ST57XXX.  So if I select this one, it doesn't boot the primary drive.  
Seeing as you've got it working, you probably don't want to pursue the
BIOS thing, but it shouldn't matter if you have two identical model
drives (they're just names in a list, for your convenience), it cares
about where they're connected.  I've certainly dealt with this issue on
one PC, here.  BIOSs usually give you two ways to select the drive to
boot from; picking from a list, or moving entries up and down in a list.
Whilst it'd be hard to tell if any changes happened if they don't have
different names, it should be possible to re-order things.

-- 
(This box runs FC5, my others run FC4 & FC6, in case that's
 important to the thread.)

Don't send private replies to my address, the mailbox is ignored.
I read messages from the public lists.

[Mikkel]

Excalibur Xcalibur wrote:
>  Hi All,
>            This is a rather unusual situation. I have a server running
>  fedora linux OS with a 650 Gb Seagate Barracuda Harddrive. Now I wanted
>  to mirror the server with an identical harddrive. When I plugged my new
>  harddrive in, I got the message:
>  
>  "Reboot and select proper *boot* device or *insert boot media"
>  
>  * It seems that because it's an identical harddrive (with not OS
>  though), the PC doesn't *see* which one is the correct boot harddrive.
>  Weird! If a plug a different harddisk than the one with the  linux OS,
>  they system boots up. Any clues on how to fix this problem? *
>   
Are you using Cable Select or Master/Slave jumpers? It sounds like
you ether have 2 drives jumpered as master, or more likely, you are
using Cable Select and you moved changed what drive is on the end of
the cable so you are trying to boot off the new drive.

Mikkel
-- 

  Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons,
for thou art crunchy and taste good with Ketchup!

[Excalibur Xcalibur]

Please read below:

On 9/30/07, Mikkel L. Ellertson <mikkel(a)infinity-ltd.com&gt; wrote:
>  *snip*
>  Are you using Cable Select or Master/Slave jumpers? It sounds like
>  you ether have 2 drives jumpered as master, or more likely, you are
>  using Cable Select and you moved changed what drive is on the end of
>  the cable so you are trying to boot off the new drive. 


I believe it is cable select.

So I'm kind of getting the clue here: I should in principle take 2 totally
separate cables to connect identical drives. Thanks Mikkel.

-- 
Peter "Excalibur"

[Bruno Wolff III]

On Sun, Sep 30, 2007 at 17:19:18 -0400,
  Excalibur Xcalibur <excalibur.xcalibur(a)gmail.com&gt; wrote:
>  
>  So I'm kind of getting the clue here: I should in principle take 2 totally
>  separate cables to connect identical drives. Thanks Mikkel. 
Not for the reason you are thinking. For performance reasons it helps
to have each PATA disk on its own controller.

You should always check the jumpers on the drives. Some need to be master
even if there is only one drive on the cable. Others are OK being set
to cable select if they are the only drive. And when there are two on a
cable you want them both to be cable select or one master and one slave.