11:39 a.m.
Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
part of the effort
Full story at;
http://www.computerworld.com/softwaretopics/os/linux/story/0,10801,108217...
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
12:16 p.m.
On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
part of the effort
unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
so ... Whats the real issue here?
I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB diskpace on my PPC.
--
WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
12:24 p.m.
>>>> "CS" == Chasecreek Systemhouse
<chasecreek.systemhouse(a)gmail.com> writes:
CS> unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space. redhat 9 fit into
CS> 1.57GB disk space
CS> so ... Whats the real issue here?
The machine has only 1GB of flash (for applications and all user data)
and no disk.
CS> I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB diskpace
CS> on my PPC.
- J<
12:27 p.m.
Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
>Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
>
>It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
>part of the effort
unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
so ... Whats the real issue here?
[snip]
You apparently didn't bother actually to *read* the article.
Helps actually to read it before commenting on it.
From the article...
But the problem isn’t so much recoding Fedora so it's a
“hacked-up,
skinny” Linux -- even though that wouldn't be difficult to do, said
Evans; the problem is making sure that it's optimized for the laptop’s
nonstandard, almost whimsical specifications. To keep costs down and
make it more durable, the laptop will eschew a hard drive in favor of
1GB of flash memory, on which the operating system, other software and
all local data must be stored.
I'd think this also means no ext2 or ext3 FS. Or any other
FS which keeps track of last access time.
Mike
--
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This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
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1:25 p.m.
On 2/1/06, Mike McCarty <mike.mccarty(a)sbcglobal.net> wrote:
You apparently didn't bother actually to *read* the article.
Helps actually to read it before commenting on it.
LOL, geez, I guess I'll wait a few days for the feeding frenzy to
subside but I reply to this reply...
(PS yes, that means I did read it ... so, whats the "real" problem?)
--
WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
1:35 p.m.
Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
On 2/1/06, Mike McCarty <mike.mccarty(a)sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>You apparently didn't bother actually to *read* the article.
>Helps actually to read it before commenting on it.
LOL, geez, I guess I'll wait a few days for the feeding frenzy to
subside but I reply to this reply...
I didn't mean that you didn't pass the words through your brain
via it's optical input ports. I meant that you didn't actually
*read*. Consider the difference between the words "look" and "see",
or "listen" and "hear".
I don't consider this a "feeding frenzy". I saw nothing that looked
like sharks eating you alive.
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
12:30 p.m.
Howdy,
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 13:16 -0500, Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
> Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
>
> It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
> part of the effort
unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
so ... Whats the real issue here?
My guess, after reading the article, is this: "To keep costs down and
make it more durable, the laptop will eschew a hard drive in favor of
1GB of flash memory, on which the operating system, other software and
all local data must be stored."
I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB
diskpace on my PPC.
--
See above ;-)
WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
12:41 p.m.
taharka wrote:
Howdy,
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 13:16 -0500, Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
>On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
>
>>Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
>>
>>It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
>>part of the effort
>
>unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
>redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
>
>so ... Whats the real issue here?
>
My guess, after reading the article, is this: "To keep costs down and
make it more durable, the laptop will eschew a hard drive in favor of
1GB of flash memory, on which the operating system, other software and
all local data must be stored."
>I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB diskpace on my
PPC.
>--
See above ;-)
>WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
>
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
Perhaps the MIT web site is out of date, but it lists the specs as
500 MHz processor
128 MB dram
500 MB of flash
Looks like the specs for a PDA.
Regards,
John
12:49 p.m.
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 10:41 -0800, John Wendel wrote:
taharka wrote:
> Howdy,
>
> On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 13:16 -0500, Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
>
>>On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
>>>
>>>It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
>>>part of the effort
>>
>>unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
>>redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
>>
>>so ... Whats the real issue here?
>>
>
> My guess, after reading the article, is this: "To keep costs down and
> make it more durable, the laptop will eschew a hard drive in favor of
> 1GB of flash memory, on which the operating system, other software and
> all local data must be stored."
>
>>I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB diskpace on my
PPC.
>>--
>
> See above ;-)
>
Perhaps the MIT web site is out of date, but it lists the specs as
500 MHz processor
128 MB dram
500 MB of flash
Looks like the specs for a PDA.
----
I wonder if Red Hat could license from the Rolling Stones...Crank It Up!
sort of a Windows parody...
Craig
10:20 p.m.
--- Craig White <craigwhite(a)azapple.com> wrote:
> Perhaps the MIT web site is out of date, but it lists the specs
as
>
> 500 MHz processor
> 128 MB dram
> 500 MB of flash
>
> Looks like the specs for a PDA.
----
I wonder if Red Hat could license from the Rolling Stones...Crank
It Up!
sort of a Windows parody...
My guess is that dram and flash just got one helluva lot cheaper with
the pricefixing charges leveled against the mfg! <cackles> how about
a scene of the savannas; lions & tigers and musk-ox, and "BORN TO BE
WILD" zooms around the room in 5.1 splendor. "The Gods Must Be Crazy"
cast all wildly cranking their $100 laptops. Barefooted Steve Jobs is
dying because he didn't think of it first. Pssst! No one tell him!!
Jeeeez. Ric
================================================
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
...the Sin of Ignorance, and
...the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
Linux user# 44256
Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/
================================================
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1:24 p.m.
Salute, being that you're a member of the armed forces :-) Vietnam
combat veteran myself :-))
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 10:41 -0800, John Wendel wrote:
taharka wrote:
> Howdy,
>
> On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 13:16 -0500, Chasecreek Systemhouse wrote:
>
>>On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
>>
>>>Red Hat commits to MIT's $100 laptop
>>>
>>>It also wants open-source developers to help slim down Fedora Core as
>>>part of the effort
>>
>>unbuntu fits into roughly 1.6GB disk space.
>>redhat 9 fit into 1.57GB disk space
>>
>>so ... Whats the real issue here?
>>
>
> My guess, after reading the article, is this: "To keep costs down and
> make it more durable, the laptop will eschew a hard drive in favor of
> 1GB of flash memory, on which the operating system, other software and
> all local data must be stored."
>
>>I mean hell ... A "feature" complete FC5T2 fits into 4GB diskpace on my
PPC.
>>--
>
> See above ;-)
>
>>WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
>>
>
> taharka
>
> Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
>
Perhaps the MIT web site is out of date, but it lists the specs as
500 MHz processor
128 MB dram
500 MB of flash
Maybe. Looks like the only spec that's off is the CF.
Looks like the specs for a PDA.
Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware firewall,
"m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals commercial
enterprise class firewall appliances costing thousands of dollars. This
m0n0wall box a 160 MHz processor & 128 MB RAM.
Regards,
John
Regards to you also,
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
1:30 p.m.
On 2/1/06, taharka <res00vl8(a)alltel.net> wrote:
Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware
firewall,
"m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals commercial
enterprise class firewall appliances costing thousands of dollars. This
m0n0wall box a 160 MHz processor & 128 MB RAM.
Agreed that FC *will* fit into the laptop -- there has been way too
much software bloat these days -- it's like building a sky scraper
when all you need is a corner office...
Oh wait -- I forgot about the "everything" and the "is it ready yet"
threads -- my apologies...
Geez...
--
WC -Sx- Jones | http://ccsh.us/ | Open Source Consulting
1:34 p.m.
taharka wrote:
Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware
firewall,
"m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals commercial
32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad you could get a very decent Linux
install in 8MB of JFFS2. kernel, Busybox, PHP, all mod cons.
Despite having reservations about the Bubble-era track record of some of
the Big Ideas that were printed when Wired had that lovely paper, and
the fact the project ended up with Redhat only after trying to get in
bed with Demonic Forces that were the first choice, the debloat
discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens with this OLPC
project.
-Andy
1:42 p.m.
Andy Green wrote:
taharka wrote:
>Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware firewall,
>"m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals commercial
32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad you could get a very decent Linux
install in 8MB of JFFS2. kernel, Busybox, PHP, all mod cons.
Despite having reservations about the Bubble-era track record of some of
the Big Ideas that were printed when Wired had that lovely paper, and
the fact the project ended up with Redhat only after trying to get in
bed with Demonic Forces that were the first choice, the debloat
discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens with this OLPC
project.
-Andy
I've never tried it, but <http://damnsmalllinux.org> looks
interesting. I think I'll dig out the old 350MHz AMD from the junk box
and give it a try.
Regards,
John
1:50 p.m.
John Wendel wrote:
Andy Green wrote:
> taharka wrote:
>
>
>> Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware firewall,
>> "m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals
commercial
>
>
>
> 32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad you could get a very decent Linux
> install in 8MB of JFFS2. kernel, Busybox, PHP, all mod cons.
>
> Despite having reservations about the Bubble-era track record of some of
> the Big Ideas that were printed when Wired had that lovely paper, and
> the fact the project ended up with Redhat only after trying to get in
> bed with Demonic Forces that were the first choice, the debloat
> discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens with this OLPC
> project.
>
> -Andy
>
I've never tried it, but <http://damnsmalllinux.org> looks interesting.
I think I'll dig out the old 350MHz AMD from the junk box and give it a
try.
You might also want to investigate Puppy Linux, then.
Here is an interesting site I looked at a few months ago
when my girlfriend was investigating (at my instigation)
installing Linux on her machine.
http://www.frozentech.com/content/livecd.php
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
10:32 p.m.
--- John Wendel <john.wendel(a)metnet.navy.mil> wrote:
I've never tried it, but <http://damnsmalllinux.org> looks
interesting. I think I'll dig out the old 350MHz AMD from the junk
box
and give it a try.
Jeeez John, you're making me feel bad. I'm running a K5 AMD 350MHz
right now! 128 Megs of ram helps. It's nowhere near as fast as the
newest stuff... but it does what I want it to do. And, it was plenty
cheap, and no probs installing Fedora 4, in text mode. I am not using
it as a server though, just as a client machine, etherneted to a
router connected to a DSL modem. Damn, this is just like an AA
meeting where I bare my deepest secrets "My name is Ric, and I'm
really cheap and run really old hardware." <sobs> I get alot of
group hugs this way. <g> Ric
================================================
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
...the Sin of Ignorance, and
...the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
Linux user# 44256
Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/
================================================
__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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11:42 a.m.
Rickey Moore wrote:
--- John Wendel <john.wendel(a)metnet.navy.mil> wrote:
>I've never tried it, but <http://damnsmalllinux.org> looks
>interesting. I think I'll dig out the old 350MHz AMD from the junk
>box
>and give it a try.
Jeeez John, you're making me feel bad. I'm running a K5 AMD 350MHz
right now! 128 Megs of ram helps. It's nowhere near as fast as the
newest stuff... but it does what I want it to do. And, it was plenty
cheap, and no probs installing Fedora 4, in text mode. I am not using
it as a server though, just as a client machine, etherneted to a
router connected to a DSL modem. Damn, this is just like an AA
meeting where I bare my deepest secrets "My name is Ric, and I'm
really cheap and run really old hardware." <sobs> I get alot of
group hugs this way. <g> Ric
================================================
My father, Victor Moore (Vic) used to say:
"There are two Great Sins in the world...
...the Sin of Ignorance, and
...the Sin of Stupidity.
Only the former may be overcome." R.I.P. Dad.
Linux user# 44256
Sign up at: http://counter.li.org/
================================================
I'm really cheap too! My last AMD Athlon CPU + motherboard cost $89.00
at Frys. The rest of the box came from computer junk stores (luckily I
live near Silicon Valley which has a great number of "computer
surplus" stores).
If you aren't near somwhere that has a lot of computer junk stores, I
highly recommend <http://surpluscomputers.com>;. I've bought a lot of
stuff from them without any problems.
Regards,
John
2:25 p.m.
Howdy,
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 19:34 +0000, Andy Green wrote:
taharka wrote:
> Don't let those specs fool ya though. My present hardware firewall,
> "m0n0wall" (FreeBSD based) runs on a 32MB CF card & rivals commercial
32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad you could get a very decent Linux
install in 8MB of JFFS2. kernel, Busybox, PHP, all mod cons.
Just to clarify, the entire m0n0wall system is a little over 5 MB & will
fit (with room to spare) on a 8 MB CF. However, 32 MB is the smallest CF
that my local drug store caries & probably cheaper than going on a turd
hunt for 8 MB CF ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we wouldn't be
having this discussion ;-)
Despite having reservations about the Bubble-era track record of some
of
the Big Ideas that were printed when Wired had that lovely paper, and
the fact the project ended up with Redhat only after trying to get in
bed with Demonic Forces that were the first choice, the debloat
discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens with this OLPC
project.
Fedora isn't the only one it will pay off for :-)
-Andy
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
2:38 p.m.
taharka wrote:
Just to clarify, the entire m0n0wall system is a little over 5 MB
& will
fit (with room to spare) on a 8 MB CF. However, 32 MB is the smallest CF
that my local drug store caries & probably cheaper than going on a turd
hunt for 8 MB CF ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we wouldn't be
having this discussion ;-)
Pardon my ignorance, but what is a CF?
The first computer I programmed was an IBM 1401. We used machine
language (as in hold down "multi-punch" on the card punch machine,
and type enough characters to get exactly the bits needed punched
out of the card). That was in, umm, 1969 or so. The first actual
machine I programmed used plugboards. Of course, it wasn't a
"computer".
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
3 p.m.
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 14:38 -0600, Mike McCarty wrote:
taharka wrote:
> Just to clarify, the entire m0n0wall system is a little over 5 MB & will
> fit (with room to spare) on a 8 MB CF. However, 32 MB is the smallest CF
> that my local drug store caries & probably cheaper than going on a turd
> hunt for 8 MB CF ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we wouldn't be
> having this discussion ;-)
Pardon my ignorance, but what is a CF?
That would be Compact Flash ;-) What's great is, you can get an IDE > CF
adaptor & boot the computer from CF :-)
The first computer I programmed was an IBM 1401. We used machine
language (as in hold down "multi-punch" on the card punch machine,
and type enough characters to get exactly the bits needed punched
out of the card). That was in, umm, 1969 or so. The first actual
machine I programmed used plugboards. Of course, it wasn't a
"computer".
Yep, I come from the punch card era (circa 1968) myself ;-) Had loads of
fun punching out cards to print out ASCII art on Greenbar paper :-)
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
2:43 p.m.
taharka wrote:
>32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad
hunt for 8 MB CF[1] ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we
wouldn't be
having this discussion ;-)
http://www.phespirit.info/montypython/four_yorkshiremen.htm ;-)
5MB is pretty impressive for a full firewall.
>discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens with
this OLPC
>project.
Fedora isn't the only one it will pay off for :-)
Well we'll have to see how it progresses. Hitting that price target
without throwing chunks of the design overboard is going to be hard.
Put another way it's a high-end PDA with a better processor and screen
for 1/3 of the price. Hum we'll see.
-Andy
[1] Compact Flash
2:49 p.m.
Andy Green wrote:
[1] Compact Flash
Thanks! A quick Google told me all I need to know, now.
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
2:52 p.m.
Andy Green wrote:
Hilarious! I recall one of those on Dilbert where the old engineers
are chewing the fat, and they say...
Back in my day, we didn't have all the fancy stuff we do now, we
had to build our databases by hand in hexadecimal.
Oh, yeah, well, we didn't even get to use hex, we hadda use binary.
All ones and zeroes.
Ones! You had ones!?
:-)
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
2:59 p.m.
Andy Green wrote:
I forgot to mention, my dad used to tell me he walked
five miles to and from school barefoot in the snow, uphill
both ways.
Mike
--
p="p=%c%s%c;main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}";main(){printf(p,34,p,34);}
This message made from 100% recycled bits.
You have found the bank of Larn.
I can explain it for you, but I can't understand it for you.
I speak only for myself, and I am unanimous in that!
5:34 p.m.
On Wed, 2006-01-02 at 20:43 +0000, Andy Green wrote:
taharka wrote:
>>32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad
> hunt for 8 MB CF[1] ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we wouldn't be
> having this discussion ;-)
http://www.phespirit.info/montypython/four_yorkshiremen.htm ;-)
5MB is pretty impressive for a full firewall.
Not really, LRP {Linux Router Project} used to fit on a single
3.5 inch HD Floppy (1.44 MB) and only required about 16MB of RAM
on a 386sx I used to have them all over the place before broadband
routers became available.
>>discipline is sure to pay off for Fedora whatever happens
with this OLPC
>>project.
>
>
> Fedora isn't the only one it will pay off for :-)
Well we'll have to see how it progresses. Hitting that price target
without throwing chunks of the design overboard is going to be hard.
Put another way it's a high-end PDA with a better processor and screen
for 1/3 of the price. Hum we'll see.
-Andy
[1] Compact Flash
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6:44 p.m.
Howdy,
On Wed, 2006-02-01 at 16:34 -0700, Guy Fraser wrote:
On Wed, 2006-01-02 at 20:43 +0000, Andy Green wrote:
> taharka wrote:
>
> >>32MB! Luxury! Why when I were a lad
>
> > hunt for 8 MB CF[1] ;-) Gee!!, "Why when I were a lad" we
wouldn't be
> > having this discussion ;-)
>
> http://www.phespirit.info/montypython/four_yorkshiremen.htm ;-)
>
> 5MB is pretty impressive for a full firewall.
>
Not really, LRP {Linux Router Project} used to fit on a single
3.5 inch HD Floppy (1.44 MB) and only required about 16MB of RAM
on a 386sx I used to have them all over the place before broadband
routers became available.
Yep, ditto for Freesco (which I still believe fits on a 1.4 MB floppy).
taharka
Lexington, Kentucky U.S.A.
6657
days inactive
6658
days old
25 comments
9 participants
participants (9)
-
Andy Green -
Chasecreek Systemhouse -
Craig White -
Guy Fraser -
Jason L Tibbitts III -
John Wendel -
Mike McCarty -
Rickey Moore -
taharka