This question is just because I am curious, I don't need the functionality. Is there a way to enable "third and fourth level choosers" in F33/34 Workstation (Gnome) to enable typing a third symbol on keyboard key?
F33 gnome-tweaks has an option for a compose key and it works under both Wayland and Xorg. I use it regularly. But I can't find an option for third level.
F34 workstation has an extra option to 'Type Special Characters' in gnome-settings with the 2 entries: one for 'Alternate Character Keys' and one for 'Compose Key'. Neither of these seems active (at least with Wayland). But the gnome-tweaks 'compose key' setting still works in F34. (after further investigation I will bugzilla this). And I can't find out what this 'alternate character' option is supposed to do.
KDE plasma has settings options for compose and third level but neither of these works under Wayland (not implemented yet). Have not tried Xorg yet.
There should be a possibility to edit some config file somewhere but I have not been able to find it. Or is it (still) not enabled under Wayland in any case.
AV
On 4/15/21 5:29 AM, AV wrote:
This question is just because I am curious, I don't need the functionality. Is there a way to enable "third and fourth level choosers" in F33/34 Workstation (Gnome) to enable typing a third symbol on keyboard key?
I'm using F33. In the keyboard shortcuts control panel, at the top there is an Alternate Characters Key selector which says it's for the third keyboard symbol.
F33 gnome-tweaks has an option for a compose key and it works under both Wayland and Xorg. I use it regularly. But I can't find an option for third level.
In Tweaks, there is an Additional Layout Options button that has all the settings that used to be in the keyboard settings. This includes a setting for 3rd level (which matches the one in the control panel) and also a 5th level.
It it doesn't work for you, maybe your keyboard layout doesn't have any keys in those levels.
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 09:30 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 4/15/21 5:29 AM, AV wrote:
Is there a way to enable "third and fourth level choosers" in F33/34 Workstation (Gnome) to enable typing a third symbol on keyboard key?
I'm using F33. In the keyboard shortcuts control panel, at the top there is an Alternate Characters Key selector which says it's for the third keyboard symbol.
F33 gnome-tweaks has an option for a compose key and it works under both Wayland and Xorg. I use it regularly. But I can't find an option for third level.
In Tweaks, there is an Additional Layout Options button that has all the settings that used to be in the keyboard settings. This includes a setting for 3rd level (which matches the one in the control panel) and also a 5th level.
Because I wanted to keep it short my email was not clearly formulated and gave the impression that I had not seen those options you mention. I had and the result is the same. The compose key always works and the 'alternate key' option for choosing a third level never (whatever key I choose from the available options). I have now tried it under wayland and xorg.
It it doesn't work for you, maybe your keyboard layout doesn't have any keys in those levels.
I have tried it on a desktop pc with well supported logitech keyboard and on a linux supported Lenovo laptop and a dell laptop that originally came with ubuntu. Why would none of these keyboards have keys in those levels? Does it work for you?
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On 4/15/21 4:15 PM, AV wrote:
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 09:30 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
It it doesn't work for you, maybe your keyboard layout doesn't have any keys in those levels.
I have tried it on a desktop pc with well supported logitech keyboard and on a linux supported Lenovo laptop and a dell laptop that originally came with ubuntu. Why would none of these keyboards have keys in those levels? Does it work for you?
It has nothing to do with the physical keyboard. It's the keyboard layout. You need to be using a layout that has keys defined in those levels. What keys are you trying to access?
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 16:27 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 4/15/21 4:15 PM, AV wrote:
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 09:30 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
It it doesn't work for you, maybe your keyboard layout doesn't have any keys in those levels.
I have tried it on a desktop pc with well supported logitech keyboard and on a linux supported Lenovo laptop and a dell laptop that originally came with ubuntu. Why would none of these keyboards have keys in those levels? Does it work for you?
It has nothing to do with the physical keyboard. It's the keyboard layout. You need to be using a layout that has keys defined in those levels. What keys are you trying to access?
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
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On 4/15/21 5:07 PM, AV wrote:
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 16:27 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
It has nothing to do with the physical keyboard. It's the keyboard layout. You need to be using a layout that has keys defined in those levels. What keys are you trying to access?
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
For those specific keyboards, you'll probably have to create your own layout. I tried switching to the English (UK) layout and it has lots of extra keys. If you click on the eye beside the name, it will give you graphical view of the layout, so you can see what keys are available.
On 4/15/21 8:07 PM, AV wrote:
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 16:27 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 4/15/21 4:15 PM, AV wrote:
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 09:30 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
It it doesn't work for you, maybe your keyboard layout doesn't have any keys in those levels.
I have tried it on a desktop pc with well supported logitech keyboard and on a linux supported Lenovo laptop and a dell laptop that originally came with ubuntu. Why would none of these keyboards have keys in those levels? Does it work for you?
It has nothing to do with the physical keyboard. It's the keyboard layout. You need to be using a layout that has keys defined in those levels. What keys are you trying to access?
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
I believe that it has not become clear to all readers. In plain words, you need a keyboard that has a number panel to the right of the letter keyboard. These number keys will also, adjacent to them, on the right, have a - sign at the top right, and a + sign at the middle right. These + and - keys have a DIFFERENT key code than the ones on the letter keyboard. Laptops don't have a separate number panel, and many--perhaps most--of the k/b's that come with new computers don't either. People who don't do numeric entry for a living mostly don't need that facility, so it gets left off--and saves money for the computer industry. --doug
On 4/15/21 8:52 PM, Doug McGarrett wrote:
On 4/15/21 8:07 PM, AV wrote:
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
I believe that it has not become clear to all readers. In plain words, you need a keyboard that has a number panel to the right of the letter keyboard. These number keys will also, adjacent to them, on the right, have a - sign at the top right, and a + sign at the middle right. These + and - keys have a DIFFERENT key code than the ones on the letter keyboard. Laptops don't have a separate number panel, and many--perhaps most--of the k/b's that come with new computers don't either. People who don't do numeric entry for a living mostly don't need that facility, so it gets left off--and saves money for the computer industry.
I'm very sure that he's referring to the regular number keys at the top. The international ones tend to have extra characters on them for local currencies. The most common reason for not having a number pad is because there isn't room. I have two laptops beside me. One has no number pad and the keyboard still goes from edge to edge. It's not wide enough for more. The other, much larger one, does have the keypad. Almost all laptops that I've seen and that are wide enough do have the keypad.
On 4/15/21 9:52 PM, Doug McGarrett wrote:
In plain words, you need a keyboard that has a number panel to the right of the letter keyboard. These number keys will also, adjacent to them, on the right, have a - sign at the top right, and a + sign at the middle right.
The term you're looking for is "numeric keypad."
On 16/04/2021 12:06, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 4/15/21 8:52 PM, Doug McGarrett wrote:
On 4/15/21 8:07 PM, AV wrote:
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
I believe that it has not become clear to all readers. In plain words, you need a keyboard that has a number panel to the right of the letter keyboard. These number keys will also, adjacent to them, on the right, have a - sign at the top right, and a + sign at the middle right. These + and - keys have a DIFFERENT key code than the ones on the letter keyboard. Laptops don't have a separate number panel, and many--perhaps most--of the k/b's that come with new computers don't either. People who don't do numeric entry for a living mostly don't need that facility, so it gets left off--and saves money for the computer industry.
I'm very sure that he's referring to the regular number keys at the top. The international ones tend to have extra characters on them for local currencies. The most common reason for not having a number pad is because there isn't room. I have two laptops beside me. One has no number pad and the keyboard still goes from edge to edge. It's not wide enough for more. The other, much larger one, does have the keypad. Almost all laptops that I've seen and that are wide enough do have the keypad.
FWIW, only have one laptop. An old Acer. It doesn't have a number pad because there isn't room. However, if I press Fn/F11 (The Fn on the key is blue, and in blue on F11 is Numlock) some keys are now the number pad. For example U,I,O becomes 4,5,6 and P becomes +.
On Thu, 2021-04-15 at 20:12 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 4/15/21 5:07 PM, AV wrote:
You need to be using a layout that has keys defined in those levels. What keys are you trying to access?
On the Logitech keyboard the 5 with % and €. Same for Lenovo laptop. On the Dell XPS 13 laptop the 5 with % and € and the 4 with $ and ₹ (Indian Rupee sign).
For those specific keyboards, you'll probably have to create your own layout I tried switching to the English (UK) layout and it has lots of extra keys. If you click on the eye beside the name, it will give you graphical view of the layout, so you can see what keys are available.
As I said earlier I do not need this functionality. I was just curious. As long as the option to use a compose key keeps working for a standard US keyboard I am happy as I just need the compose key for diacriticals in the western European languages. A standard US keyboard works best for me, NOT the US international or the UK one (I once tried the UK and got some weird surprises). So I am certainly not 'going to create my own layout'. My quest stops here. Thanks to everybody for replying.
This aside I am surprised these options are given in Gnome/KDE/etc without further explanation if it is so complicated and so dependent on the choice of keyboard and/or it's layout.
And I don't understand the remarks about the keypad. I have never seen a keypad with $/€/%/& signs (and I hate keypads (especially on laptops) they make you sit "twisted" and on a loose keyboard they also take away mouse room (and strain the upper arm muscles)). (And I have had enough occasion to use numbers: data analysis, simulation/research and such and the "top row" has always been sufficient for my needs).
This is in reply to Samuel Sieb but also to everybody who replied.
AV
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AV -
Doug McGarrett -
Ed Greshko -
Joe Zeff -
Samuel Sieb