Just upgraded from f25 to f26. Most programs run better, but scrollbars no longer have arrows at their upper and lower ends. System Settings used to have a function to control this, but it seems to be gone, both in native KDE and Gnome applications. How are scrollbars now controlled in KDE?
Thanks - jon
On Sun, 30 Jul 2017 13:16:32 -0700 Jonathan Ryshpan wrote:
but scrollbars no longer have arrows at their upper and lower ends
I guess KDE is copying GTK which also seems to think arrows are anathema. I used to be able to put this in ~/.config/gtk-3.0/gtk.css:
.scrollbar { -GtkScrollbar-has-backward-stepper: 1; -GtkScrollbar-has-forward-stepper: 1; -GtkRange-slider-width: 15; -GtkRange-stepper-size: 20; }
But that also no longer works.
I really wonder why they don't just get rid of the scrollbar completely. If you are looking at a big file and you so much as touch the scrollbar thumb it jerks to some new position hundreds or thousands of lines away, so you have to use the keyboard for all scrolling anyway.
On 07/30/2017 01:41 PM, Tom Horsley wrote:
I really wonder why they don't just get rid of the scrollbar completely. If you are looking at a big file and you so much as touch the scrollbar thumb it jerks to some new position hundreds or thousands of lines away, so you have to use the keyboard for all scrolling anyway.
Why would you ever use the arrows? And why would you use the thumb for anything other than general location in a large file? Do you have a mouse without a wheel or a touchpad that doesn't do scrolling?
On Sun, 2017-07-30 at 14:06 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 07/30/2017 01:41 PM, Tom Horsley wrote:
I really wonder why they don't just get rid of the scrollbar completely. If you are looking at a big file and you so much as touch the scrollbar thumb it jerks to some new position hundreds or thousands of lines away, so you have to use the keyboard for all scrolling anyway.
Why would you ever use the arrows? And why would you use the thumb for anything other than general location in a large file? Do you have a mouse without a wheel or a touchpad that doesn't do scrolling?
Scrolling using the wheel on my mouse is a little funky on some windows, particularly in Firefox: the text jumps around a little and decorations (generally unwanted but present nonetheless) don't move as they ought to. Up till recently I did have a mouse without a wheel, which I liked, but such mouses(?) are no longer easy to get, and I have got to like using arrows.
On 07/30/2017 06:27 PM, Jonathan Ryshpan wrote:
On Sun, 2017-07-30 at 14:06 -0700, Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 07/30/2017 01:41 PM, Tom Horsley wrote:
I really wonder why they don't just get rid of the scrollbar completely. If you are looking at a big file and you so much as touch the scrollbar thumb it jerks to some new position hundreds or thousands of lines away, so you have to use the keyboard for all scrolling anyway.
Why would you ever use the arrows? And why would you use the thumb for anything other than general location in a large file? Do you have a mouse without a wheel or a touchpad that doesn't do scrolling?
Scrolling using the wheel on my mouse is a little funky on some windows, particularly in Firefox: the text jumps around a little and decorations (generally unwanted but present nonetheless) don't move as they ought to. Up till recently I did have a mouse without a wheel, which I liked, but such mouses(?) are no longer easy to get, and I have got to like using arrows. _______________________________________________ users mailing list -- users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe send an email to users-leave@lists.fedoraproject.org
Have you considered a trackball? I like the Kensington optical trackball. I use the one without the scroll device cirumscribing the ball, since I consider the ball sufficient, but you might want the scroll device. These are not expensive, and they take up a lot less room on a crowded desktop. I really despise mouses (mice?).
--doug
Allegedly, on or about 30 July 2017, Samuel Sieb sent:
Why would you ever use the arrows? And why would you use the thumb for anything other than general location in a large file? Do you have a mouse without a wheel or a touchpad that doesn't do scrolling?
Not on KDE, but when window scroll bars work normally, I do find that it's convenient to:
Scroll through some pages with a mouse wheel, but that gets painful on the fingers with very long pages.
Sometimes it's convenient to click on the scroll bar, and drag it up and down with the mouse, instead, for rapidly scrolling through long things.
Sometimes it's convenient to click in the space above or below a scroll bar to page through a file (which can't be done when a scroll bar is set to jump to an absolute position in the file, as it will jump to a point that you cannot possibly predict).
Occasionally it's convenient to click on the arrows either side of a scroll bar to slowly scroll through something, for those moments where something is just off the edge and you don't want to let go of the mouse and reach for the keyboard. But single-step up and down clicks are generally more useful to setting values in configuration (e.g. how many copies to print), than page scrolling.
And that latter point emphasises a fundamental problem with the WIMP GUI, that it's inconvenient and annoying to have to go back and forth between keyboard and mouse.
Having to deal with scroll bars on trackpads is even worse.
On 30 July 2017 at 22:16, Jonathan Ryshpan jonrysh@pacbell.net wrote:
Just upgraded from f25 to f26. Most programs run better, but scrollbars no longer have arrows at their upper and lower ends. System Settings used to have a function to control this, but it seems to be gone, both in native KDE and Gnome applications. How are scrollbars now controlled in KDE?
Thanks - jon
AFAICS, the option to control that is still there in systemsettings -> application style -> widget style -> configure. I use the Breeze style.
$ rpm -q plasma-systemsettings plasma-systemsettings-5.10.1-1.fc26.x86_64
On 7/31/17 6:16 AM, Jonathan Ryshpan wrote:
Just upgraded from f25 to f26. Most programs run better, but scrollbars no longer have arrows at their upper and lower ends. System Settings used to have a function to control this, but it seems to be gone, both in native KDE and Gnome applications. How are scrollbars now controlled in KDE?
This has been an ongoing issue from F25 and does not occur with native KDE applications (for example, Dolphin) but occurs in both Gnome and KDE with GTK (I think it is GTK applications, the obvious one for this issue is Thunderbird) applications. From my experience with this and actually working around it, the issue is theme specific. There are themes will display the arrows on scrollbars and there are themes that do not. At the moment I am using the Breeze theme for GTK applications and that does not display the arrows on the scrollbars, but it did not display the arrows in F25 either, irrespective of whether you were using Gnome or KDE with GTK applications, but you could cycle through the installed themes and find one that did display the arrows.
I went to the extent of taking the Breeze them and manually modifying the css styles to specify the colour scheme I wanted to use, and to turn on the arrows, but I have not quite got it working correctly in all circumstances yet (this is its ability to display the colors I want rather than its ability to display arrows).
regards,
Steve
Thanks - jon
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