Greetings;
Warning, here I am going to repeat some parts of a rant I've made before. Several times in fact.
Like many who run Epson printers simply because the output color quality is worth it, I find I am stuck in a catch 22. I cannot update my gimp install with your new packages.
Why?
The new gimp packaging is apparently hard coded in its dependencies to absolutely depend on gimp-print-4.2.7-23 and its plugin of the same version number.
I installed, using checkinstall, gutenprint-5.1.0 which includes this renamed plugin, back in February as it fixed many long standing bugs such as the bottom of the page color fades, and now allows flawless borderless printing too. I am not about to screw up my printing ability by allowing a working very well installation to be over-written with broken code by false dependencies such as this.
gimp-print has essentially been frozen in time at version 4.2.7 for at least 2 years, maybe longer, and any support is totally up to the individual distro, so I fail to see any logic or reasoning behind the redhat/fedora reticence in adopting gutenprint in its place. It simply doesn't grok here.
Short of downloading the new gimp and installing it --nodeps --force, all by hand, which will work for me I'm sure, or building it from the tarball which I've also been known to do when fedora ignores known problems for months at a time, how do I convince TPTB that gimp-print is a deadend that should be deprecated and gutenprint used to replace it?
Or, perhaps better yet, give those of us with the ability to DO something about the ancient gimp-print by installing gutenprint, the ability to do it cleanly by removing the patently _false_ dependencies on gimp-print from the gimp packaging. That would be the ideal situation since there is not in fact an actual, gimp won't run without it, cross dependency. Gimp will in fact use any plugin it finds to print through, or if there is none, the print dialog is removed, but no other function in gimp needs it or references it.
Thanks for reading.
On Sat, Jun 30, 2007 at 10:21:05AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
Warning, here I am going to repeat some parts of a rant I've made before. Several times in fact.
Like many who run Epson printers simply because the output color quality is worth it, I find I am stuck in a catch 22. I cannot update my gimp install with your new packages.
The new gimp packaging is apparently hard coded in its dependencies to absolutely depend on gimp-print-4.2.7-23 and its plugin of the same version number.
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Hello Gene,
An update to Fedora 7 might fix your problem: Here are the files installed bij default in Fedora7-x86_64:
gimp-2.2.15-3.fc7 gimp-help-2-0.1.0.12.fc7 gimp-libs-2.2.15-3.fc7 xsane-gimp-0.994-3.fc7 gutenprint-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7 gutenprint-plugin-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7 gutenprint-foomatic-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7
PS However depending on your Epson printer I wouldn't expect any wonders from the gutenprint drivers. Though the placement of the print borders and the general quality of the print have improved markedly the colors are still abominable (at least on my Epson Stylus Photo R200). For quality photo prints I have to use the Epson software supplied with the printer under Windows. Linux remains nog go.
Alexander
On Saturday 30 June 2007, Alexander Volovics wrote:
On Sat, Jun 30, 2007 at 10:21:05AM -0400, Gene Heskett wrote:
Warning, here I am going to repeat some parts of a rant I've made before. Several times in fact.
Like many who run Epson printers simply because the output color quality is worth it, I find I am stuck in a catch 22. I cannot update my gimp install with your new packages.
The new gimp packaging is apparently hard coded in its dependencies to absolutely depend on gimp-print-4.2.7-23 and its plugin of the same version number.
-----------truncated----------------------------------
Hello Gene,
An update to Fedora 7 might fix your problem: Here are the files installed bij default in Fedora7-x86_64:
gimp-2.2.15-3.fc7 gimp-help-2-0.1.0.12.fc7 gimp-libs-2.2.15-3.fc7 xsane-gimp-0.994-3.fc7 gutenprint-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7 gutenprint-plugin-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7 gutenprint-foomatic-5.0.0.99.1-3.fc7
PS However depending on your Epson printer I wouldn't expect any wonders from the gutenprint drivers.
Wrong! At least for the cxx epsons, its great.
Though the placement of the print borders and the general quality of the print have improved markedly the colors are still abominable (at least on my Epson Stylus Photo R200). For quality photo prints I have to use the Epson software supplied with the printer under Windows. Linux remains nog go.
Alexander
I'm sorry you feel that way Alexander. I have actually sold a few color prints from my C82 (yeah, I know, its ancient), they ARE that good and the ink is archival. Most papers I've found will need a coat of fixative though for mechanical protection. But thanks for the warning that gimp-print and the r200's don't mix. I think that has been improved in gutenprint however.
For instance on my old c82, for red, I get a real red, whereas the hp's are noticeably orange & I haven't been able to come up with a word that adequately describes what lexmark printers do to reds. I have excellent color vision but that has an achilles heel too, I almost have to carry a bat in a cage around at night & use his sonar.
But, you do not address the real problem here either, the false dependencies in this new gimp package. It doesn't need gimp-print to function as gimp, gimp-print is only an addition to the menu that enables printing. Please repack it without those dependencies.
On Saturday 30 June 2007, Alexander Volovics wrote: [...]
still abominable (at least on my Epson Stylus Photo R200). For quality photo prints I have to use the Epson software supplied with the printer under Windows.
And I forgot to add that when linux drivers were tried at Epson HQ in a shootout, we bested the windows drivers in virtually every category.
Linux remains nog go.
Alexander
Gene Heskett wrote:
Like many who run Epson printers simply because the output color quality is worth it, I find I am stuck in a catch 22. I cannot update my gimp install with your new packages.
Why?
The new gimp packaging is apparently hard coded in its dependencies to absolutely depend on gimp-print-4.2.7-23 and its plugin of the same version number.
I installed, using checkinstall, gutenprint-5.1.0 which includes this renamed plugin, back in February as it fixed many long standing bugs such as the bottom of the page color fades, and now allows flawless borderless printing too. I am not about to screw up my printing ability by allowing a working very well installation to be over-written with broken code by false dependencies such as this.
gimp-print has essentially been frozen in time at version 4.2.7 for at least 2 years, maybe longer, and any support is totally up to the individual distro, so I fail to see any logic or reasoning behind the redhat/fedora reticence in adopting gutenprint in its place. It simply doesn't grok here.
Short of downloading the new gimp and installing it --nodeps --force, all by hand, which will work for me I'm sure, or building it from the tarball which I've also been known to do when fedora ignores known problems for months at a time, how do I convince TPTB that gimp-print is a deadend that should be deprecated and gutenprint used to replace it?
There is a flag in the source rpm to control whether the package is built with gimp-print or gutenprint. That might be the simpler way that building it all manually. Or maybe not. :)
It's surely not that the packagers aren't aware of both options, so there are likely reasons why the package now requires gimp-print-plugin. They may not be reasons you agree with though. If you feel the dependency is in error, the way to bring that to the packagers attention is to file a bug in your friend the bugzilla. That should at least help answer the question of why the dep is there and perhaps you can persuade the packager that it should not be.
I think some of the problem arises from the fact that in FC6, gutenprint was in Extras and not in Core. That means that the core package gimp can't require gutenprint. There is some discussion of this in https://bugzilla.redhat.com/243593. It looks as if the changes made for the F7 gimp package have been applied to the FC6 package as well. Perhaps they shouldn't be. You may be able to point this out in that bug and see if the gimp maintainer will reconsider that change.
On Saturday 30 June 2007, Todd Zullinger wrote:
Gene Heskett wrote:
Like many who run Epson printers simply because the output color quality is worth it, I find I am stuck in a catch 22. I cannot update my gimp install with your new packages.
Why?
The new gimp packaging is apparently hard coded in its dependencies to absolutely depend on gimp-print-4.2.7-23 and its plugin of the same version number.
I installed, using checkinstall, gutenprint-5.1.0 which includes this renamed plugin, back in February as it fixed many long standing bugs such as the bottom of the page color fades, and now allows flawless borderless printing too. I am not about to screw up my printing ability by allowing a working very well installation to be over-written with broken code by false dependencies such as this.
gimp-print has essentially been frozen in time at version 4.2.7 for at least 2 years, maybe longer, and any support is totally up to the individual distro, so I fail to see any logic or reasoning behind the redhat/fedora reticence in adopting gutenprint in its place. It simply doesn't grok here.
Short of downloading the new gimp and installing it --nodeps --force, all by hand, which will work for me I'm sure, or building it from the tarball which I've also been known to do when fedora ignores known problems for months at a time, how do I convince TPTB that gimp-print is a deadend that should be deprecated and gutenprint used to replace it?
There is a flag in the source rpm to control whether the package is built with gimp-print or gutenprint. That might be the simpler way that building it all manually. Or maybe not. :)
It's surely not that the packagers aren't aware of both options, so there are likely reasons why the package now requires gimp-print-plugin. They may not be reasons you agree with though. If you feel the dependency is in error, the way to bring that to the packagers attention is to file a bug in your friend the bugzilla. That should at least help answer the question of why the dep is there and perhaps you can persuade the packager that it should not be.
I think some of the problem arises from the fact that in FC6, gutenprint was in Extras and not in Core. That means that the core package gimp can't require gutenprint. There is some discussion of this in https://bugzilla.redhat.com/243593. It looks as if the changes made for the F7 gimp package have been applied to the FC6 package as well. Perhaps they shouldn't be. You may be able to point this out in that bug and see if the gimp maintainer will reconsider that change.
Thanks for the bz link Todd, I've added my comments.
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Alexander Volovics -
Gene Heskett -
Todd Zullinger