Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time? The CBC just used the term with a negative frame on the Tuesday, 23 April 2013 30-minute radio news at about the half-way point. Everyone ought to go to this link and suggest that they should quit abusing the term.
to listen to her abuse of the term, go to the link with "contact" removed / deleted - before Wednesday, 25 April at UTC 01:00 (PDT 18:00, in case I did the math wrong).
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
regards, Richard
On 04/23/2013 10:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time? The CBC just used the term with a negative frame on the Tuesday, 23 April 2013 30-minute radio news at about the half-way point. Everyone ought to go to this link and suggest that they should quit abusing the term.
to listen to her abuse of the term, go to the link with "contact" removed / deleted - before Wednesday, 25 April at UTC 01:00 (PDT 18:00, in case I did the math wrong).
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
regards, Richard
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 7:54 PM, Digimer lists@alteeve.ca wrote:
On 04/23/2013 10:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time? The CBC just used the term with a negative frame on the Tuesday, 23 April 2013 30-minute radio news at about the half-way point. Everyone ought to go to this link and suggest that they should quit abusing the term.
to listen to her abuse of the term, go to the link with "contact" removed / deleted - before Wednesday, 25 April at UTC 01:00 (PDT 18:00, in case I did the math wrong).
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
regards, Richard
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
-- Digimer Papers and Projects: https://alteeve.ca/w/ What if the cure for cancer is trapped in the mind of a person without access to education?
Arg! The "good stuff" never makes news; it's not sensational enough.
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 22:54:07 -0400, Digimer lists@alteeve.ca wrote:
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
You know the term wasn't all that positive in its earlier use. Using hacks instead of doing things right isn't a good thing. (Though it might be good in some cases to trade off time and effort now against future costs.)
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 8:17 PM, Bruno Wolff III bruno@wolff.to wrote:
On Tue, Apr 23, 2013 at 22:54:07 -0400, Digimer lists@alteeve.ca wrote:
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
You know the term wasn't all that positive in its earlier use. Using hacks instead of doing things right isn't a good thing. (Though it might be good in some cases to trade off time and effort now against future costs.) -- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.**org/mailman/listinfo/usershttps://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/**Mailing_list_guidelineshttp://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Perhaps next time someone gets an interview with the media we could call them idiots, just as bad as Fox; they don't allow our side of the story.
Many phenomenal discoveries have come from the likes of a "hack"! Discoveries like the Higgs boson came about in such a way, found (not necessarily the Higgs) by mistake while we were looking for something else. Hacks were also helpful in discovering holes, or breeches in other's software.
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Alan Evans ame.fedora@gmail.com wrote:
Richard Vickery wrote:
[blah, blah, "hacker" has an unfair negative connotation, blah blah] ... we could call them idiots, just as bad as Fox
Do you see what you just did there?
-- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Words taken out of context, Alan.
On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 22:54:07 -0400, Digimer wrote:
On 04/23/2013 10:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time? The CBC just used the term with a negative frame on the Tuesday, 23 April 2013 30-minute radio news at about the half-way point. Everyone ought to go to this link and suggest that they should quit abusing the term.
to listen to her abuse of the term, go to the link with "contact" removed / deleted - before Wednesday, 25 April at UTC 01:00 (PDT 18:00, in case I did the math wrong).
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
regards, Richard
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
I've given up on this a long time ago - after being interviewed concerning RTM's worm. In spite of repeated, detailed explanations, the reporters refused to alter their use of the term.
It's annoying, since I've just spent the day hacking (figuring out why something didn't follow the documentation, filing a bug, and creating the patched documentation). I don't have the source, otherwise I'd attempt a patch.
Sadly, technologists are rarely good writers, good writers are rarely technologists, and reporters seem to be good at neither.
. . . . just my two cents. /mde/
On Apr 24, 2013 8:05 PM, "Mark Eggers" mdeggers@gmail.com wrote:
On Tue, 23 Apr 2013 22:54:07 -0400, Digimer wrote:
On 04/23/2013 10:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time? The CBC just used the term with a negative frame on the Tuesday, 23 April 2013 30-minute radio news at about the half-way point. Everyone ought to go to this link and suggest that they should quit abusing the term.
to listen to her abuse of the term, go to the link with "contact" removed / deleted - before Wednesday, 25 April at UTC 01:00 (PDT 18:00, in case I did the math wrong).
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
regards, Richard
I've been interviewed a couple of times by CBC and other media. Each time I explain what "hackers" means, and it doesn't really go anywhere. The way I see it, we just need more positive "hacker" and maker stories than there are bad ones. In the mean time, don't let it get to you. Just go do good stuff.
I've given up on this a long time ago - after being interviewed concerning RTM's worm. In spite of repeated, detailed explanations, the reporters refused to alter their use of the term.
It's annoying, since I've just spent the day hacking (figuring out why something didn't follow the documentation, filing a bug, and creating the patched documentation). I don't have the source, otherwise I'd attempt a patch.
Sadly, technologists are rarely good writers, good writers are rarely technologists, and reporters seem to be good at neither.
. . . . just my two cents. /mde/
-- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
I really like a few suggestions, like signing a document "the happy hacker with the white hat on". This, and other like sayings, are things that I can use to educate stupid judges who just got a lucky pick when they Terry to convict any of us for using the term.
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time?
Sorry, but it's a tad late to lock up the barn when the horse is already been rendered down into glue.
As was discussed on ABC 774 with Raphael Epstein last week, the term Hacker is expediently, grossly and deliberately misused by the press and Government to create a negative impact.
Frankly Hackers, per se, as far as I understand the issue simply don't care, and from my perspective after reading Julian Assange where he addresses the term and Daniel Domsheit-Berg and a few other books, my suggestion would be to stay out of it, leave well enough alone.
Arel
On 04/24/2013 02:02 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/23/2013 07:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time?
Sorry, but it's a tad late to lock up the barn when the horse is already been rendered down into glue.
I thought horses were rendered down into lasagne these days.
Steve
On 04/24/2013 03:46 AM, Steve Underwood wrote:
On 04/24/2013 02:02 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/23/2013 07:42 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time?
Sorry, but it's a tad late to lock up the barn when the horse is already been rendered down into glue.
I thought horses were rendered down into lasagne these days.
Steve
Going to add my two cents on this issue. And mind you I have no ties to the government, nor am I a "geeK" (which at one time was attached to the word hacker and was usually being someone who wore thick glasses and had no life.!) I think the word hacker in this day and age should not be viewed in ANY negative way, if it weren't for these hackers, and the work they do....sometimes tings wouldn't get "fixed" imagine if the "script kiddies who hack into large corporations.....abusing Microsoft in EVERY way....well if it weren't for them doing that, then there'd be no "patching" and the exploits would remain, people would lose money....personal info...and lord knows what else!...and that's just ONE scenario!......
EGO II
On 04/24/2013 03:42 AM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Of course, the media are infamous for abusing scientific terms, such as calling the Higgs boson the god particle - a term scientists loathe - so I out not lose too much sleep over it.
Actually the scientists (inc. prof. Higgs) are not so happy with 'Higgs boson' as a name either:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22250092
I tend to think the 'hacker' vs. 'cracker' distinction is lost to history in the mainstream today. Among enlightened circles you can still make the distinction between the terms and be understood.
When communicating with broader audiences I think rigidly sticking to our preferred definition risks misunderstanding and further confusion for the listeners.
Regards, Bryn.
Hi,
--- On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 2:23 PM, Bryn M. Reeves bmr@redhat.com wrote: | I tend to think the 'hacker' vs. 'cracker' distinction is lost to history in | the mainstream today. --
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning. I usually refer them to the following:
* Free as in Freedom http://oreilly.com/openbook/freedom/
* How to become a hacker http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
SK
On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 06:20:05PM +0530, Shakthi Kannan wrote:
Hi,
--- On Wed, Apr 24, 2013 at 2:23 PM, Bryn M. Reeves bmr@redhat.com wrote: | I tend to think the 'hacker' vs. 'cracker' distinction is lost to history in | the mainstream today. --
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning. I usually refer them to the following:
Free as in Freedom http://oreilly.com/openbook/freedom/
How to become a hacker http://www.catb.org/esr/faqs/hacker-howto.html
I'm sure you've heard the saying "Never try to teach a pig to sing. It never works and it irritates the pig".
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning.
With respect, education of the masses revolves around dismembering the education system, endless boring cooking competition shows, talent shows, the CSI series, endless football and celeb gossip, news which contains death and traffic crashes interspersed with footballers who should know better but don't and all the while whining about the environment while not actually doing anything. They don't have time to be further educated and simply don't care.
The educated ones already know, the others use windows. Arel
On 04/24/2013 04:11 PM, Roger wrote:
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning.
As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geezer, the original meaning of the term Geezer, as still used in the UK, is significantly different from how it's used in the US. Should we also be trying to get people to go back to that meaning? For that matter, how about the term geek: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geek#Etymology Language evolves, and pretending that it doesn't isn't going to do anybody any good. My advice is to ignore it and move on.
On 04/25/2013 12:31 AM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/24/2013 04:11 PM, Roger wrote:
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning.
As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geezer, the original meaning of the term Geezer, as still used in the UK, is significantly different from how it's used in the US. Should we also be trying to get people to go back to that meaning? For that matter, how about the term geek: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geek#Etymology Language evolves, and pretending that it doesn't isn't going to do anybody any good. My advice is to ignore it and move on.
Exactly - go back to the middle ages and all children, whether male or female, were called 'girls'. A son was a 'knave girl' and a daughter a 'gay girl'.
'Gay' as the modern term started off as 'gai' in France and referred to 'courtly love'. It was later applied to promiscuous men and women in the UK before morphing in the 20th century to its present definition.
Perhaps we should go back and educate the masses as to the "true" meanings of all these words too? :-)
Regards, Bryn.
On 25.04.2013 11:31, Bryn M. Reeves wrote:
On 04/25/2013 12:31 AM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/24/2013 04:11 PM, Roger wrote:
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will learn the real meaning.
As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geezer, the original meaning of the term Geezer, as still used in the UK, is significantly different from how it's used in the US. Should we also be trying to get people to go back to that meaning? For that matter, how about the term geek: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geek#Etymology Language evolves, and pretending that it doesn't isn't going to do anybody any good. My advice is to ignore it and move on.
Exactly - go back to the middle ages and all children, whether male or female, were called 'girls'. A son was a 'knave girl' and a daughter a 'gay girl'.
'Gay' as the modern term started off as 'gai' in France and referred to 'courtly love'. It was later applied to promiscuous men and women in the UK before morphing in the 20th century to its present definition.
Perhaps we should go back and educate the masses as to the "true" meanings of all these words too? :-)
I always knew I would learn English language with Linux. :-)
Mateusz Marzantowicz
On Apr 25, 2013 3:51 AM, "Mateusz Marzantowicz" mmarzantowicz@osdf.com.pl wrote:
On 25.04.2013 11:31, Bryn M. Reeves wrote:
On 04/25/2013 12:31 AM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/24/2013 04:11 PM, Roger wrote:
Continuing to educate the masses is the only way that people will
learn
the real meaning.
As you can see here, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geezer, the original meaning of the term Geezer, as still used in the UK, is significantly different from how it's used in the US. Should we also be trying to
get
people to go back to that meaning? For that matter, how about the term geek: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geek#Etymology Language evolves,
and
pretending that it doesn't isn't going to do anybody any good. My advice is to ignore it and move on.
Exactly - go back to the middle ages and all children, whether male or female, were called 'girls'. A son was a 'knave girl' and a daughter a 'gay girl'.
'Gay' as the modern term started off as 'gai' in France and referred to 'courtly love'. It was later applied to promiscuous men and women in the UK before morphing in the 20th century to its present definition.
Perhaps we should go back and educate the masses as to the "true" meanings of all these words too? :-)
I always knew I would learn English language with Linux. :-)
Mateusz Marzantowicz
Ignore and move on? Would you say the same thing if we, the state, threw you in prison for the use of the term? Civil society already does. Case in point: use of the term "my account has been hacked" or "...website had been hacked" have negative connotations; instead of looking to fix homes in faulty software, they blame someone for attacking them. This has to change. People don't normally intend to rob a bank when they go in to make a withdrawal. They have to understand that the same goes for hackers.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:17:53AM -0700, Richard Vickery wrote:
.........snip.........
Ignore and move on? Would you say the same thing if we, the state, threw you in prison for the use of the term? Civil society already does. Case in point: use of the term "my account has been hacked" or "...website had been hacked" have negative connotations; instead of looking to fix homes in faulty software, they blame someone for attacking them. This has to change.
No, it doesn't *have to* change and will actively resist.
People don't normally intend to rob a bank when they go in to make a withdrawal. They have to understand that the same goes for hackers.
No, they don't *have to* understand and will actively resist.
What you're trying to change is human nature.
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 12:08 PM, Robert Holtzman holtzm@cox.net wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:17:53AM -0700, Richard Vickery wrote:
.........snip.........Ignore and move on? Would you say the same thing if we, the state, threw you in prison for the use of the term? Civil society already does. Case
in
point: use of the term "my account has been hacked" or "...website had
been
hacked" have negative connotations; instead of looking to fix homes in faulty software, they blame someone for attacking them. This has to
change.
No, it doesn't *have to* change and will actively resist.
People don't normally intend to rob a bank when they go in to make a withdrawal. They have to understand that the same goes for hackers.
No, they don't *have to* understand and will actively resist.
What you're trying to change is human nature.
You are just going to let society walk all over you?
Gents:
I have been quietly listening in to this discussion for several days now!
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to do with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Thomas Dineen
On 4/25/2013 12:40 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 12:08 PM, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net mailto:holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:17:53AM -0700, Richard Vickery wrote: .........snip......... > > Ignore and move on? Would you say the same thing if we, the state, threw > you in prison for the use of the term? Civil society already does. Case in > point: use of the term "my account has been hacked" or "...website had been > hacked" have negative connotations; instead of looking to fix homes in > faulty software, they blame someone for attacking them. This has to change. No, it doesn't *have to* change and will actively resist. > People don't normally intend to rob a bank when they go in to make a > withdrawal. They have to understand that the same goes for hackers. No, they don't *have to* understand and will actively resist. What you're trying to change is human nature.You are just going to let society walk all over you?
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 15:20 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 10:12 -0700, Thomas Dineen wrote:
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to dowith: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Nothing whatever. Not that that ever stopped anyone.
[BTW, please don't top-post on this list]
poc
I think it does have a lot to do with Linux users and developers. We are often grouped with the "hackers" negatively, and we need to make sure that people understand the difference. Whether you agree or not, is a personal feeling. Perceptions matter, and hacking which is using something in a way not necessarily intended by the original designer is a good hack. If someone is breaking into systems and doing harm, that is cracking.
At least that is my view. YMMV.
On Sat, 2013-04-27 at 10:18 -0700, les wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 15:20 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 10:12 -0700, Thomas Dineen wrote:
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to dowith: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Nothing whatever. Not that that ever stopped anyone.
[BTW, please don't top-post on this list]
poc
I think it does have a lot to do with Linux users and developers. We are often grouped with the "hackers" negatively, and we need to make sure that people understand the difference. Whether you agree or not, is a personal feeling. Perceptions matter, and hacking which is using something in a way not necessarily intended by the original designer is a good hack. If someone is breaking into systems and doing harm, that is cracking.
By the same argument, we could also talk about a whole raft of issues to do with free software or free culture, but that's not the purpose of this list. The list is specifically for discussing Fedora. The whole "hacking" thread doesn't even mention Fedora, and would be more appropriate in any of the other lists, blogs, hashtags or whatever that focus on these issues.
poc
<snip> I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to do with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"?????????? </snip>
Quite a lot really although I don't see it as a rant, just a plea by someone with either a deep concern or someone agitating for some ulterior motive. Lack of community concern can be gauged by the number of responses, many of whom say, "forget it", "leave it alone", and rightly so.
Drupal, wordpress, Mongodb, Microsoft, Security organisations, Adobe, manufacturing and telecommunications companies, Governments, the Military all hire hackers but they are known as Programmers and paid for their service.
When Linux is mentioned it's Programmers get lumped into a derogatory category "hackers" by those same organisations, who have so called hackers on the pay role. Fedora is a test bed, changed over and over again to improve everything. We use Fedora for this reason.
May I humbly suggest that the original poster of this series, take everything that's been said on board and formulate his plan to achieve his goal and make an effort. Join Avaaz and post his concern there he may get a wider response.
On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 1:05 PM, Patrick O'Callaghan pocallaghan@gmail.comwrote:
On Sat, 2013-04-27 at 10:18 -0700, les wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 15:20 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 10:12 -0700, Thomas Dineen wrote:
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to dowith: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Nothing whatever. Not that that ever stopped anyone.
[BTW, please don't top-post on this list]
poc
I think it does have a lot to do with Linux users and developers. We are often grouped with the "hackers" negatively, and we need to make sure that people understand the difference. Whether you agree or not, is a personal feeling. Perceptions matter, and hacking which is using something in a way not necessarily intended by the original designer is a good hack. If someone is breaking into systems and doing harm, that is cracking.
By the same argument, we could also talk about a whole raft of issues to do with free software or free culture, but that's not the purpose of this list. The list is specifically for discussing Fedora. The whole "hacking" thread doesn't even mention Fedora, and would be more appropriate in any of the other lists, blogs, hashtags or whatever that focus on these issues.
poc
-- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Er... Fedora isn't mentioned that much in what we do, much less the discussions.
To the point made immediately previous to my last comment: no one is forcing you to participate in this thread; if you don't like it, you are absolutely free - and I encourage you - to ignore it. Then you won't be bothered by it.
Oh, and by the way, it is relevant to a discussion - of open-source programming, which is what we are doing.
On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 8:00 PM, Richard Vickery < richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, Apr 27, 2013 at 1:05 PM, Patrick O'Callaghan < pocallaghan@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sat, 2013-04-27 at 10:18 -0700, les wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 15:20 -0430, Patrick O'Callaghan wrote:
On Fri, 2013-04-26 at 10:12 -0700, Thomas Dineen wrote:
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have todo
with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Nothing whatever. Not that that ever stopped anyone.
[BTW, please don't top-post on this list]
poc
I think it does have a lot to do with Linux users and developers. We are often grouped with the "hackers" negatively, and we need to make sure that people understand the difference. Whether you agree or not, is a personal feeling. Perceptions matter, and hacking which is using something in a way not necessarily intended by the original designer is a good hack. If someone is breaking into systems and doing harm, that is cracking.
By the same argument, we could also talk about a whole raft of issues to do with free software or free culture, but that's not the purpose of this list. The list is specifically for discussing Fedora. The whole "hacking" thread doesn't even mention Fedora, and would be more appropriate in any of the other lists, blogs, hashtags or whatever that focus on these issues.
poc
-- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Er... Fedora isn't mentioned that much in what we do, much less the discussions.
On Sat, 2013-04-27 at 20:13 -0700, Richard Vickery wrote:
To the point made immediately previous to my last comment: no one is forcing you to participate in this thread; if you don't like it, you are absolutely free - and I encourage you - to ignore it. Then you won't be bothered by it.
Don't worry, I've ignored it so far. I merely responded to the meta-question of its relevance to the purpose of the list.
That's all I have to say on the subject.
poc
n all honesty Mr. Dineen: Absolutely Nothing! But it was fun while it lasted, as I'm sure they'll now "shut down" the topic and move on to bigger and better things! LoL!
EGO II
On 04/26/2013 01:12 PM, Thomas Dineen wrote:
Gents:
I have been quietly listening in to this discussion for severaldays now!
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to do with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Thomas Dineen
On 4/25/2013 12:40 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 12:08 PM, Robert Holtzman <holtzm@cox.net mailto:holtzm@cox.net> wrote:
On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 10:17:53AM -0700, Richard Vickery wrote: .........snip......... > > Ignore and move on? Would you say the same thing if we, the state, threw > you in prison for the use of the term? Civil society already does. Case in > point: use of the term "my account has been hacked" or "...website had been > hacked" have negative connotations; instead of looking to fix homes in > faulty software, they blame someone for attacking them. This has to change. No, it doesn't *have to* change and will actively resist. > People don't normally intend to rob a bank when they go in to make a > withdrawal. They have to understand that the same goes for hackers. No, they don't *have to* understand and will actively resist. What you're trying to change is human nature.You are just going to let society walk all over you?
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 5:28 AM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. <eoconnor25@gmail.com
wrote:
n all honesty Mr. Dineen: Absolutely Nothing! But it was fun while it lasted, as I'm sure they'll now "shut down" the topic and move on to bigger and better things! LoL!
EGO II
On 04/26/2013 01:12 PM, Thomas Dineen wrote:
Gents:
I have been quietly listening in to this discussion for several daysnow!
I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to do with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"??????????
Thomas Dineen
If you do shut it down, and don't want to hear about the topic, then can we PLEASE clean up our language around hacking, hackers, and "I've been hacked"? Actually, this is not a question; it's more of a kindly demand. Since we are all hackers, I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means. If your system becomes compromised, say so, or fix it, or ask the community to help with code, like we used to do when we broke into each other's systems. Don't bother us with your cry wolf, or I - or someone else - will be back with this line. The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Richard Vickery
On 04/30/2013 12:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 12:23 PM, Joe Zeff joe@zeff.us wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
The lines that you have deleted, Joe, read that I would drop it so long as you use the term respectfully, especially in here among hackers. Did you miss this?
On 04/30/2013 12:39 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The lines that you have deleted, Joe, read that I would drop it so long as you use the term respectfully, especially in here among hackers. Did you miss this?
I didn't feel that it was relevant to my reply. My point is that it doesn't matter if you drop it or continue to complain about it because as far as the rest of the world is concerned, you're wrong.
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Zeff joe@zeff.us wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:39 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The lines that you have deleted, Joe, read that I would drop it so long as you use the term respectfully, especially in here among hackers. Did you miss this?
I didn't feel that it was relevant to my reply. My point is that it doesn't matter if you drop it or continue to complain about it because as far as the rest of the world is concerned, you're wrong.
Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers. Let me deal with the idiots in the political world.
Am 30.04.2013 23:56, schrieb richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com:
*From: *Joe Zeff *Sent: *Tuesd ay, April 30, 2013 1:41 PM *To: *Community support for Fedora users *Reply To: *Community support for Fedora users *Subject: *Re: "hackers"
On 04/30/2013 01:33 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers. Let me deal with the idiots in the political world.
By calling them "idiots?" Do I really have to answer this?
this was YOUR OWN quote
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 3:27 PM, Reindl Harald h.reindl@thelounge.netwrote:
Am 30.04.2013 23:56, schrieb richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com:
*From: *Joe Zeff *Sent: *Tuesd ay, April 30, 2013 1:41 PM *To: *Community support for Fedora users *Reply To: *Community support for Fedora users *Subject: *Re: "hackers"
On 04/30/2013 01:33 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers. Let me deal with the idiots in the political world.
By calling them "idiots?" Do I really have to answer this?
this was YOUR OWN quote
I didn't ask if it was my own quote, I asked if I really had to answer what I meant by using such term.
Am 30.04.2013 22:33, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Zeff <joe@zeff.us mailto:joe@zeff.us> wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:39 PM, Richard Vickery wrote: The lines that you have deleted, Joe, read that I would drop it so long as you use the term respectfully, especially in here among hackers. Did you miss this? I didn't feel that it was relevant to my reply. My point is that it doesn't matter if you drop it or continue to complain about it because as far as the rest of the world is concerned, you're wrong.Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers
boy you are on the USERS list there are typically not "the fedora programmers" however, this thread is bull**t at all
Please, let this thread end !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
On 4/30/2013 1:53 PM, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 30.04.2013 22:33, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 1:04 PM, Joe Zeff <joe@zeff.us mailto:joe@zeff.us> wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:39 PM, Richard Vickery wrote: The lines that you have deleted, Joe, read that I would drop it so long as you use the term respectfully, especially in here among hackers. Did you miss this? I didn't feel that it was relevant to my reply. My point is that it doesn't matter if you drop it or continue to complain about it because as far as the rest of the world is concerned, you're wrong.Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers
boy you are on the USERS list there are typically not "the fedora programmers" however, this thread is bull**t at all
Am 30.04.2013 23:52, schrieb richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com:
Sent from my BlackBerry 10 smartphone.
*From: *Reindl Harald *Sent: *Tuesday, April 30, 2013 1:53 PM *To: *users@lists.fedoraproject.org
this thread is bull**t at all I could say something about the group and these attacks against me...
says the one who said "Respectfully, you are not the rest of the world, you are Fedora programmers" not realizing that he is on a FEDORA LIST and not a "teach language list"
On 4/30/2013 3:23 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
You guys should pass this information around since it appears that the rest of The Internet disagrees with you. :-)
http://www.channel4.com/news/yahoos-email-system-hacked-by-criminal-spammers
http://www.neowin.net/news/yahoo-mail-accounts-continue-to-be-hacked-despite-fixes
And last, from me but not the last 'hit', but not least - from Yahoo Help
On 04/30/2013 12:44 PM, David wrote:
On 4/30/2013 3:23 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
You guys should pass this information around since it appears that the rest of The Internet disagrees with you. :-)
Thank you for helping me make my point.
This is just the f**king internet, not the political world. I'm asking for your help to just clean it up in here; as a political scientist, let me deal with the rest of the world. Can you help me? or are you going to continue a blockade?
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 12:44 PM, David dgboles@gmail.com wrote:
On 4/30/2013 3:23 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
You guys should pass this information around since it appears that the rest of The Internet disagrees with you. :-)
< http://thenextweb.com/insider/2013/03/06/despite-its-efforts-to-fix-vulnerab...
< http://www.channel4.com/news/yahoos-email-system-hacked-by-criminal-spammers
< https://www.google.com/search?q=yahoo+mail+hacked&client=firefox-nightly...
< http://siliconangle.com/blog/2013/04/30/yahoo-mail-hacked-again-serious-ques...
< http://www.fastcompany.com/3006724/creative-conversations/why-cant-persisten...
< http://www.neowin.net/news/yahoo-mail-accounts-continue-to-be-hacked-despite...
And last, from me but not the last 'hit', but not least - from Yahoo Help
< http://help.yahoo.com/kb/index?locale=en_US&y=PROD_ACCT&page=answers...
--
David
users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
On 04/30/2013 03:23 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 04/30/2013 12:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Language changes. Either keep up, or find yourself unable to communicate. Insisting that the term "hacker" means what it did thirty years ago, and nothing else, is going to have about as much effect as King Canute's attempts to hold back the tide.
If this was Facebook?..."Like"! LoL!
EGO II
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Tim ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au wrote:
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
Richard Vickery wrote:
Tim wrote:
Richard Vickery wrote:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
I with Tim on this one, and almost made the same reply regarding the original statement. If you didn't mean what you said then you are the one being obtuse.
It is strange to me that you seem so vociferous about a particular term but keep needing to chastise others because they don't understand your imprecise use of language. http://xkcd.com/169/
Quoting Alan Evans ame.fedora@gmail.com:
Richard Vickery wrote:
Tim wrote:
Richard Vickery wrote:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
I with Tim on this one, and almost made the same reply regarding the original statement. If you didn't mean what you said then you are the one being obtuse.
It is strange to me that you seem so vociferous about a particular term but keep needing to chastise others because they don't understand your imprecise use of language. http://xkcd.com/169/
Thanks! I'd missed that one.
D
On 04/30/2013 09:43 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
You make a big deal out of the fact that you either are or have studied political science, and yet you're going out of your way over and over to be offensive. Now as it happens, I have a friend with (among other things) a PhD in Poly Sci, and he's almost always careful to avoid offending anybody without good reason, so I know that not everybody who studies politics is as abrasive as you've been. Maybe you should step back a for moment and ask yourself why you've been expressing yourself this way.
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 10:02 PM, Joe Zeff joe@zeff.us wrote:
On 04/30/2013 09:43 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
You make a big deal out of the fact that you either are or have studied political science, and yet you're going out of your way over and over to be offensive. Now as it happens, I have a friend with (among other things) a PhD in Poly Sci, and he's almost always careful to avoid offending anybody without good reason, so I know that not everybody who studies politics is as abrasive as you've been. Maybe you should step back a for moment and ask yourself why you've been expressing yourself this way.
I have good reasons to express myself in the manner that I do; reasons that you probably don't want anything to do with, much less hear about. In this context, much of it has to do with that you all want to shit on me rather than work with me.
Your spelling is wrong - it's not Poly Sci; the short hand is poli sci.
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 10:39 PM, Richard Vickery < richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com> wrote:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 10:02 PM, Joe Zeff joe@zeff.us wrote:
On 04/30/2013 09:43 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
You make a big deal out of the fact that you either are or have studied political science, and yet you're going out of your way over and over to be offensive. Now as it happens, I have a friend with (among other things) a PhD in Poly Sci, and he's almost always careful to avoid offending anybody without good reason, so I know that not everybody who studies politics is as abrasive as you've been. Maybe you should step back a for moment and ask yourself why you've been expressing yourself this way.
I have good reasons to express myself in the manner that I do; reasons that you probably don't want anything to do with, much less hear about. In this context, much of it has to do with that you all want to shit on me rather than work with me.
Your spelling is wrong - it's not Poly Sci; the short hand is poli sci.
and your collective memory is so short it's amazing, cutting off the text that I was replying to.
On 04/30/2013 10:43 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
and your collective memory is so short it's amazing, cutting off the text that I was replying to.
I trimmed off that text because it wasn't relevant to my point. What was relevant is that you were replying in a way guaranteed to fan the flames instead of being tactful and trying to avoid prolonging a pointless argument.
Am 01.05.2013 07:39, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 10:02 PM, Joe Zeff <joe@zeff.us mailto:joe@zeff.us> wrote:
On 04/30/2013 09:43 PM, Richard Vickery wrote: I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you? You make a big deal out of the fact that you either are or have studied political science, and yet you're going out of your way over and over to be offensive. Now as it happens, I have a friend with (among other things) a PhD in Poly Sci, and he's almost always careful to avoid offending anybody without good reason, so I know that not everybody who studies politics is as abrasive as you've been. Maybe you should step back a for moment and ask yourself why you've been expressing yourself this way.I have good reasons to express myself in the manner that I do; reasons that you probably don't want anything to do with, much less hear about. In this context, much of it has to do with that you all want to shit on me rather than work with me.
maybe because you demand intelligence from others but lack it by yourself in the way you start discussions, ask questions without informations repeatly and insist in a braindead OFF-TOPIC thread?
I have good reasons to express myself in the manner that I do; reasons that you probably don't want anything to do with, much less hear about. In this context, much of it has to do with that you all want to shit on me rather than work with me.
Maybe we'd be more willing to work with you if we agreed with the statement you have made. You're an offensive asshole. The fact of the matter is quite simple -- The term "hacker" in today's language signifies unauthorized use of computer systems or data. As a whole, *WE* see NO point in changing the meaning because the perception will be the same no matter what. Why don't you look at this in a different light and identify yourself as a developer instead of a hacker. My two cents.
== Josh Johnston fedorajosh@outlook.com
Richard Vickery:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Tim:
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
addendum ^^^^ Should really say "alteration or use" (just to be complete).
Richard Vickery:
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
You wrote it. You were the one deliberately being a jackass over the issue. I'm calling you out on it. You're getting perilously close to turning this into a straw man argument.
I think that it's very safe to say that ever since the 1980s the term "being hacked" has been well understood to mean just what I, and others, in this thread have said.
Buggering around obtusely or inappropriately with something to gain unauthorised access *is* hacking. Hacked the website, hacking the phone company... *We* all understand what that means. It's merely breaking something to do what you want it, instead. And unless they actually did crack the password or encrypting, cracking is a less appropriate term.
Am 01.05.2013 06:43, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Tim <ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au mailto:ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent: > I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means. Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
and you are the one whining here that you are attacked by naming the thread bullsh**t? better shut up!
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 12:14:51PM +0200, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 01.05.2013 06:43, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Tim <ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au mailto:ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent: > I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means. Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
and you are the one whining here that you are attacked by naming the thread bullsh**t? better shut up!
This thread has gone on far too long already. This reply is directed at everyone on the list who is using bandwidth to dissect language and grammar on the list instead of purvey information. Please let's work harder to make this list a useful and polite forum, not a place to tear other people down.
Also, I recommend everyone review the netiquette guidelines:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
If you find a message hard to understand, ask nicely for clarification. If you don't receive it, or if you think it's not worth your time to try and help the poster, stop posting to the thread. Walk away and spend your time in a way you find more worthwhile. Do not carry on pointless bickering over semantics and language.
Please help us maintain the sanity of the list, so we don't have to moderate.
On 05/01/2013 11:55 AM, Paul W. Frields wrote:
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 12:14:51PM +0200, Reindl Harald wrote:
Am 01.05.2013 06:43, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Tim<ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.aumailto:ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent: > I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means. Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
and you are the one whining here that you are attacked by naming the thread bullsh**t? better shut up!
This thread has gone on far too long already. This reply is directed at everyone on the list who is using bandwidth to dissect language and grammar on the list instead of purvey information. Please let's work harder to make this list a useful and polite forum, not a place to tear other people down.
Also, I recommend everyone review the netiquette guidelines:
https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines
If you find a message hard to understand, ask nicely for clarification. If you don't receive it, or if you think it's not worth your time to try and help the poster, stop posting to the thread. Walk away and spend your time in a way you find more worthwhile. Do not carry on pointless bickering over semantics and language.
Please help us maintain the sanity of the list, so we don't have to moderate.
"So Let It Be Written.......So Let It Be Done!"(Sorry......I couldn't resist!...LoL!)
EGO II
Around 10:40pm on Wednesday, May 01, 2013 (UK time), richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com scrawled:
<Nothing>
Richard, you appear to keep sending emails to the list with the text portion containing no content. I appreciate that this may be done to please those who are fed up with what you do write, but perhaps you could stop sending them altogether.
Thanks
Steve
On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 01:01:13PM +0100, Steve Searle wrote:
Around 10:40pm on Wednesday, May 01, 2013 (UK time), richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com scrawled:
<Nothing>
Richard, you appear to keep sending emails to the list with the text portion containing no content. I appreciate that this may be done to please those who are fed up with what you do write, but perhaps you could stop sending them altogether.
First, he probably won't, just to be spiteful. Second, have you looked at the attachments he sends instead of text? Aside from the list footer, the main attachment is in html. He seems to refuse to comply with internet protocol.
-- users mailing list users@lists.fedoraproject.org To unsubscribe or change subscription options: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/mailman/listinfo/users Guidelines: http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Mailing_list_guidelines Have a question? Ask away: http://ask.fedoraproject.org
Am 01.05.2013 23:41, schrieb richard.vickeryrv@gmail.com:
*From: *Reindl Harald *Sent: *Wednesday, May 1, 2013 3:15 AM *To: *users@lists.fedoraproject.org *Reply To: *Community support for Fedora users *Subject: *Re: "hackers"
Am 01.05.2013 06:43, schrieb Richard Vickery:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 8:23 PM, Tim <ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au mailto:ignored_mailbox@yahoo.com.au&g t; wrote:
Allegedly, on or about 30 April 2013, Richard Vickery sent:
I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means.
Then you'd have to be about the only one working with computers who cannot comprehend what the person meant when they wrote that: some form of unauthorised alteration of their data.
I'm just going to guess, Tim, that you are a little more intelligent than your reply lets on, and that you can actually understand the meaning behind "I have no clue what the term 'I've been hacked' means". No one can be that stupid, can you?
and you are the one whining here that you are attacked by naming the thread bullsh**t? better shut up!
Why? Is that a threat? What possible harm do you have you could do if I kept up? And who the he'll do you think you are anyway, Reindl? Remember that I defended your rotten abuse of English! Learn how to facing speak!!!
first: you should learn to quote before you start critism others english second: what else than "No one can be that stupid, can you?" is a threat?
to your 'I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means' well, than better stop using computers at all
On 04/30/2013 03:11 PM, Richard Vickery wrote:
On Tue, Apr 30, 2013 at 5:28 AM, Eddie G. O'Connor Jr. <eoconnor25@gmail.com mailto:eoconnor25@gmail.com> wrote:
n all honesty Mr. Dineen: Absolutely Nothing! But it was fun while it lasted, as I'm sure they'll now "shut down" the topic and move on to bigger and better things! LoL! EGO II On 04/26/2013 01:12 PM, Thomas Dineen wrote:Gents: I have been quietly listening in to this discussion for several days now! I have a simple question: What the hell dose this rant have to do with: "Community Support For Fedora Users"?????????? Thomas DineenIf you do shut it down, and don't want to hear about the topic, then can we PLEASE clean up our language around hacking, hackers, and "I've been hacked"? Actually, this is not a question; it's more of a kindly demand. Since we are all hackers, I have no clue what the term "I've been hacked" means. If your system becomes compromised, say so, or fix it, or ask the community to help with code, like we used to do when we broke into each other's systems. Don't bother us with your cry wolf, or I - or someone else - will be back with this line. The line "I've been hacked" sounds like the author either doesn't know how to speak or ought to get out of computers because said person doesn't know how to code.
Richard Vickery
I agree that the word "hacker" brings to mind visions of some overweight, glasses-wearing, geek living in his parent's garage, surrounded by five computers that he built from spare parts, with all manner of code running......but that's just Hollywood, in real life, as stated before, "hackers' are hired to be programmers, and to try to break commercial software while its still in testing mode, so that they can ship a product that has been put through its paces. I don't think I would have said I've been hacked, I might have gone with "compromised"...attacked....maybe even violated"?....LoL! But that's just me....
EGO II
Hi,
--- On Thu, Apr 25, 2013 at 3:01 PM, Bryn M. Reeves bmr@redhat.com wrote: | Perhaps we should go back and educate the masses as to the "true" meanings | of all these words too? :-) --
It depends on the extent to which one can help.
Making people aware of the definitions by citing references is a way to make them understand why such terminology existed, and what it really means.
It is true that people don't read history, and come to conclusions based on half-baked truths. They also don't retrospect or reason before making statements. Sad, but true.
"Half knowledge is worse than ignorance." ~ Thomas B. Macaulay
SK
On Tue, 2013-04-23 at 19:42 -0700, Richard Vickery wrote:
Does anyone care to help me change the negative connotation that the outside world has of this term, one step at a time?
You can start by signing all your mails as hacker with a white hat on.
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Alan Evans -
Bob Holtzman -
Bruno Wolff III -
Bryn M. Reeves -
Dave Stevens -
David -
Digimer -
EGO-II.1 -
Howard Howell -
Joe Zeff -
Josh Johnston -
Mark Eggers -
Mateusz Marzantowicz -
Patrick O'Callaghan -
Paul W. Frields -
Reindl Harald -
Richard Vickery -
Roger -
Shakthi Kannan -
Steve Searle -
Steve Underwood -
Thomas Dineen -
Tim