Re: PSA: Do not run 'dnf update' inside GNOME, KDE or any other graphical desktop on Fedora 24
(Copying to the list)
On Tue, 04 Oct 2016 17:13:26 -0400 "Eddie G. O'Connor Jr." eoconnor25@gmail.com wrote:
Just curious.....i read you all saying you don't run dnf "inside a desktop" am I to assume that me running a terminal AFTER LOGGING IN TO THE DESKTOP is not a good idea..? I'm sorry.... It's just that I'm "old school" and only know about running commands from within a terminal.....but it's always been AFTER I've logged into the desktop...
You are running a terminal under X, so you are susceptible to the problem if you have hybrid graphics. You could try the systemctl command Adam mentioned to confirm, knowing that it will crash X if you meet the criteria, and lose anything in progress.
What Adam is saying is you need to run dnf in a virtual console environment (Ctl-Alt-[F2-F6]) to avoid the problem. This is non-X, and so even if X crashes, the dnf update won't be affected.
There is nothing wrong with running a terminal under X for other purposes, just with running dnf update, and even then only for people that meet the criteria.
On 10/04/2016 02:46 PM, stan wrote:
(Copying to the list)
On Tue, 04 Oct 2016 17:13:26 -0400 "Eddie G. O'Connor Jr." eoconnor25@gmail.com wrote:
Just curious.....i read you all saying you don't run dnf "inside a desktop" am I to assume that me running a terminal AFTER LOGGING IN TO THE DESKTOP is not a good idea..? I'm sorry.... It's just that I'm "old school" and only know about running commands from within a terminal.....but it's always been AFTER I've logged into the desktop...
You are running a terminal under X, so you are susceptible to the problem if you have hybrid graphics. You could try the systemctl command Adam mentioned to confirm, knowing that it will crash X if you meet the criteria, and lose anything in progress.
What Adam is saying is you need to run dnf in a virtual console environment (Ctl-Alt-[F2-F6]) to avoid the problem. This is non-X, and so even if X crashes, the dnf update won't be affected.
There is nothing wrong with running a terminal under X for other purposes, just with running dnf update, and even then only for people that meet the criteria.
I don't think I've ever run one of the GUI package managers. I have run "dnf --refresh upgrade" in an Xfce terminal, as root, any number of times (most of the time, in fact). I ran into an X screwup only once (early this week) and I think it was an upgrade of the session manager that blipped. I got logged out of my session rather unceremoniously, and a re-login was also screwed up.
I rebooted the machine (wanted the new kernel anyway) and all was well. I had no duplicate packages or anything of that nature. I even did a distro-sync and it looked OK. Perhaps I'm just fortunate. If so, it'd be the first time I have been in a really long time! I am Murphy's target. ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, AllDigital ricks@alldigital.com - - AIM/Skype: therps2 ICQ: 226437340 Yahoo: origrps2 - - - - "As for me, I aspire to be the Walmart Greeter in Hell." - ----------------------------------------------------------------------
On 10/04/2016 04:12 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:
I don't think I've ever run one of the GUI package managers. I have run "dnf --refresh upgrade" in an Xfce terminal, as root, any number of times (most of the time, in fact). I ran into an X screwup only once (early this week) and I think it was an upgrade of the session manager that blipped. I got logged out of my session rather unceremoniously, and a re-login was also screwed up.
I also run Xfce, but I use yumex-dnf (I used yumex until yum was transformed into dnf.) and have had excellent results. One nice thing about it is that if there's a dependency issue, you can go back to the screen listing the updates and unselect whatever's causing the issue without needing to start over and remember exactly which --exclude= arguments to use. And, it doesn't insist on rebooting before installing anything, which is nice if you're using a computer that you'd rather was up as close to 24/7 as possible. (Considering that you have to reboot after certain updates, such as a new kernel, this way means that you sometimes have to reboot twice for one update.)
On 10/04/2016 04:21 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 10/04/2016 04:12 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:
I don't think I've ever run one of the GUI package managers. I have run "dnf --refresh upgrade" in an Xfce terminal, as root, any number of times (most of the time, in fact). I ran into an X screwup only once (early this week) and I think it was an upgrade of the session manager that blipped. I got logged out of my session rather unceremoniously, and a re-login was also screwed up.
I also run Xfce, but I use yumex-dnf (I used yumex until yum was transformed into dnf.) and have had excellent results. One nice thing about it is that if there's a dependency issue, you can go back to the screen listing the updates and unselect whatever's causing the issue without needing to start over and remember exactly which --exclude= arguments to use. And, it doesn't insist on rebooting before installing anything, which is nice if you're using a computer that you'd rather was up as close to 24/7 as possible. (Considering that you have to reboot after certain updates, such as a new kernel, this way means that you sometimes have to reboot twice for one update.)
My method has never asked me to reboot. My machines are on 24-7-365 and as such, I do not permit automatic updates. I do the manual "dnf --refresh upgrade" at least once a week, look CAREFULLY at the list of stuff that's going to update/replace and if I feel I want to do it, I hit "y" and suffer the consequences, if any.
Even then, other than this one time (and only on one of my three F24 systems, two with integrated Intel graphics, one with nVidia), I've never HAD to reboot nor have they rebooted spontaneously (except for one machine, but its mobo was getting very, very sick and the spontaneous reboots were due to that, not dnf). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- - Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, AllDigital ricks@alldigital.com - - AIM/Skype: therps2 ICQ: 226437340 Yahoo: origrps2 - - - - Trying to make digital files uncopyable is like trying to make - - water not wet. -- Bruce Schneier - ----------------------------------------------------------------------
On Wed, Oct 5, 2016 at 8:35 AM, Rick Stevens ricks@alldigital.com wrote:
On 10/04/2016 04:21 PM, Joe Zeff wrote:
On 10/04/2016 04:12 PM, Rick Stevens wrote:
I don't think I've ever run one of the GUI package managers. I have run "dnf --refresh upgrade" in an Xfce terminal, as root, any number of times (most of the time, in fact). I ran into an X screwup only once (early this week) and I think it was an upgrade of the session manager that blipped. I got logged out of my session rather unceremoniously, and a re-login was also screwed up.
I also run Xfce, but I use yumex-dnf (I used yumex until yum was transformed into dnf.) and have had excellent results. One nice thing about it is that if there's a dependency issue, you can go back to the screen listing the updates and unselect whatever's causing the issue without needing to start over and remember exactly which --exclude= arguments to use. And, it doesn't insist on rebooting before installing anything, which is nice if you're using a computer that you'd rather was up as close to 24/7 as possible. (Considering that you have to reboot after certain updates, such as a new kernel, this way means that you sometimes have to reboot twice for one update.)
My method has never asked me to reboot. My machines are on 24-7-365 and as such, I do not permit automatic updates. I do the manual "dnf --refresh upgrade" at least once a week, look CAREFULLY at the list of stuff that's going to update/replace and if I feel I want to do it, I hit "y" and suffer the consequences, if any.
Even then, other than this one time (and only on one of my three F24 systems, two with integrated Intel graphics, one with nVidia), I've never HAD to reboot nor have they rebooted spontaneously (except for one machine, but its mobo was getting very, very sick and the spontaneous reboots were due to that, not dnf).
Ive run both dnf update from konsole, and also using the kde app and Ive never seen an issue going from F21 all the way up to F25 now. though i could imagine it is possible to hit some type of gui issue Ive yet to see it.
- Rick Stevens, Systems Engineer, AllDigital ricks@alldigital.com -
- AIM/Skype: therps2 ICQ: 226437340 Yahoo: origrps2 -
-- Trying to make digital files uncopyable is like trying to make -
water not wet. -- Bruce Schneier -
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