why I'm using Ubuntu instead of Fedora ATM

[Greg Dekoenigsberg]

On Wed, 3 Jan 2007, Bill Nottingham wrote:

>> Strongly agreed. I more and more think we need a "Fedora Experimental
>> Kitchen" project where stuff that's not yet covered by the Fedora
>> Project can be developed while the users feel as being a part of the
>> Fedora project -> this would help getting people involved and grow up.
>>
>> Kmods, alternate kernels, Firefox2 for FC6, Respins, Live-CDs, new
>> Distributions Spins (Fedora Audio, Fedora BrandNewIdea anyone?) could be
>> suitable to be done under the hood of the "Fedora Experimental Kitchen".
>
> OK, you've lost me. How is adding an experimental repo for highly
> technical things (kmods, alternate kernels, etc) about embracing
> the non-engineering community?

It's not.  It's about embracing the influential communities of developers 
who are trying to Get Shit Done -- which is, from my perspective, even 
*more* important.  If Fedora becomes the platform from which innovators 
choose to share their innovations, Fedora becomes stronger.  It's all 
about the applications.

>> I'm wondering if we could provide solutions for both users: One update
>> channel that only gets security updates and important bugfixes while the
>> other is a bit more bold -- we for example could have firefox2 in the
>> bold channel for FC6 while shipping the latest firefox 1.5.x in the more
>> conservative channel.
>
> So, an idea like this:
>
> - starts to exponentially expand the QA problem

Bill, I love you, but I'm going to have to call bullshit on this one. 
The answer is not "avoid making QA harder", the answer is to SOLVE THE QA 
PROBLEM.  Most users don't report bugs worth a crap, and when they do 
report bugs, those bug reports, as a rule, suck ass.  Why?  Because they 
have no idea how to do it -- and we haven't done *even a little bit of 
work* to make it any easier for them.

If there's two things I'd like to see Will doing, right now, they would 
be:

1. Come up with a better tool for reporting bugs -- maybe in bugzilla, 
maybe elsewhere, maybe a layer in-between.  Some kind of sysdump tool that 
can do stuff like, oh, look in /etc/yum.repos.d/ and, if experimental 
repos are found, mark the new bug accordingly.

2. Make the Fedora Triage team happen.

> - breaks dependencies across repositories (we have no xulrunner)

Let's work on tools and policy to address this issue, then.  Because for a 
lot of users, this is already a problem.  I still use the CCRMA repo, 
because CCRMA still hasn't integrated into Fedora, because CCRMA uses a RT 
kernel.

> - fractures the community into different splinters

Smells like FUD to me.

--g

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