Response to "Getting Fedora Out of the If-Then Loop"

Jaroslav Reznik jreznik at
Fri Feb 19 21:47:48 UTC 2010

On Friday 19 February 2010 10:16:03 pm Jeff Spaleta wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 19, 2010 at 11:57 AM, Jaroslav Reznik <jreznik at> 
> > First I didn't want to touch this topic but I think I can now ;-) It's a
> > good idea to have some target, something we can aim and something we can
> > analyze after time if we met it or not. Not easy task in open source
> > world. But the problem with this discussion is - it should be technology
> > (in terms of different desktops, spins) agnostic! There's no reason why
> > the default Fedora should be Gnome only, KDE only, LXDE only, server
> > only or whatever super hyper cool technology only is but the aim should
> > be to deliver best experience for users
> There are real technical constraints associated with choosing what a
> default will look like.
> Every technology framework that you include eats disk space. We do
> still care about livecd sized targets.

It's not actually so bad - for example K spin ships lot of G spin stack. The 
basic set is quite small - look at Maemo - they are even more constrained in 
terms of space.

> Every technology framework that you include is means a much more
> complicated software development environment.  Both KDE and GNOME work
> as a projects because they have a definable set of default APIs to
> offer developers that establish the development platform is.  Fedora
> can have the same thing if it makes hard choices about the boundaries
> of the technologies in each spin so that each spin can essential be a
> default development target.

But this gives you more freedom - you don't have to stick with one API, one 
framework and I really like this. Again Maemo - they were planning switch from 
Gtk to Qt (Gtk only community supported) - now by joining Moblin, Gtk will 
stay (at least for some time). I think it's a big win - you have one target 
platform (MeeGo, Fedora) and you can use development platform of your 
preference. Open source ;-) Yes, it can be tricky... I try to help as much as 
I can, not just talking - we did Polkit 1 Qt/KDE support, Arora support, Abrt 
as Fedora tech - it now has proper Qt integration. We are starting desktop 
agnostic DBus configuration interface (and yes, we aim PyGtk UI). It's possible 
but it pains in the beginnings. At GCDS RMS talk was about integration, I 
really liked it. 

> -jef"It's nice to have choices... I can have tons of different
> ingredients in my well stocked cupboard when I'm ready to make soup.
> But I'm not going to throw everything in just because I have it. When
> I have gazpacho on a warm summers day I don't throw in corn just
> because I also like corn chowder  in the winter or chicken stock
> because I chicken noodle when I'm sick.  I learned that lesson when I
> was ten... putting everything you like all in one pot and stirring it
> together doesn't mean the result is something you'll like even
> more."spaleta

In Czech we have "Tale about dog and cat cooking cake" - it's similar - they 
mixed everything without THINKING about it. But of course you have tons of 
ingredients - but some are rotten - are you going to eat it? You probably take 
the fresh ones. One from that shop/vendor and other from another one ;-) I'm 
have my system composed from that fresh ones too - I use lot of K stuff 
accompanied by lot of G stuff, it's still much more integrated than usual 
Windows applications (it's real dog's and cat's cake :D). 

>  anyone developing for that system.
> (developers, aliens, predators) . Yes, probably few purists from all
> > sides would complain now but I think it's the only way how to be
> > successful. These days integration between different projects is much
> > more easier (DBus, specifications etc.) that I believe
> > if we can communicate (and break all barriers) we can deliver best
> > Fedora ever by picking best piece of software (and it's not only
> > software). Interoperability is that strange word. And next to this
> > Fedora, there could be standalone Gnome spin, KDE spin, server spin...
> > Pure as glacier's water.
> > 
> > Communication is currently the worst issue in Fedora community and it's
> > crucial for open source to be successful. There should be no "I don't
> > care about Gnome/KDE/server whatever" but "I care, let's do it!". We are
> > all one community (I count even Ubuntu people :D). Do not play on your
> > own small sandbox, do a revolution! ;-)
> > 
> > Just my 1 CZK (full of cheap slogans) speaking as both Qt (KDE) and Gtk
> > (s-c- config tools) Fedora developer ;-)
> > 
> > Jaroslav
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> >
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