[Ambassadors] Fedora is the 2º most used Linux s ystem

[Onyeibo Oku]

Consider joining the Gnome-Shell list or the list for Unity. Ambassadors report UX as they interact with users/potential contributors at events and during personal support using blogs and The Planet news AFAIK.  I am a member of Gnome-Shell list and Ur concerns have been discussed to death there,

If U asked how an Ambassador should react in the face of such displeasure then that's different. Otherwise, there are other groups that exist within fedora to resolve engineering and design issues. You should take the discussion to them. Again there is difference between reporting what users say and reporting what you feel about what they say. There is a difference between asking for the Ambassadors' position to what was said and proffering a position for the Ambassadors to adopt. The way you present your view suggests the applicable audience and right now I doubt you are communicating to the right one. 

Finally, I wish to apologize for top-posting. I am seriously limited by blackberry OS 5, except I use third party app like Opera (a process that is quite painful). Please bear with me ... Gotta buy that netbook fast :)) 

---------------------------------------------
from twohot at device.mobile :)

-----Original Message-----
From: Jukka Palander <jukka at devspain.com>
Sender: ambassadors-bounces at lists.fedoraproject.org
Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2011 08:26:52 
To: <ambassadors at lists.fedoraproject.org>
Reply-To: ambassadors at lists.fedoraproject.org
Subject: Re: [Ambassadors]
 Fedora is the 2º most used Linux s
  ystem

On Sun, 2011-11-27 at 13:30 +0000, Onyeibo Oku wrote:
> Is this really a topic for Ambassadors list? This should be pursued at the source i.e. Gnome-designers and fedora desktop group. Personally, I find your position too relative (as in, pertaining to personal preferences rather than absolute (based on result of tested scenarios) ... And those scenarios being hypothetical and subjected to testing during development stage). Which experts do you refer to?


This is indeed a place to discuss about it!

Ambassadors list (in my opinion) is especially a forum to discuss about
_anything_ what we hear and see in the Fedora users field.

This is _not_ a forum to discuss about how something should be improved
(development boards are in place), but we have to remember that we
ambassadors are the first people in touch with the users. Therefore our
eyes and ears are very valuable asset for development (and I really hope
some of the developers reads this list).

This is the reason that I think we should say it out loud what people
think about Fedora and what they have decided to do no matter if it is
one or two users or a larger scale survey. -and no matter if it is
something we do not want to hear.

> I find Gnome3 easier to use and I have been using Gnome2 from F11. I don't think its perfect but I appreciate the direction and would rather suggest ways of improving what is ... As long as its in the direction of the future.  Change is around us. We either adapt or die ... If the Linux community is concerned about decline in usage in favour of other Linux solutions then I'm left in wonder - because that is not really a loss. And what does it profit if the circle is comprised of a clique of old GUI purists and new people are brewing outside the fence?


Going towards new is good, but we should go in there by listening our
users what they want. Being arrogant is not the way.

>  
> Finally, this kind of thread has the potential to go sour and noisy. This is simply not the forum for it.


Being sour and noisy at least leads us into the discussion (which
usually leads into new ideas). Being silent won't lead us into anything
else than backwards.

--
Jukka


> ---------------------------------------------
> from twohot at device.mobile :)
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jukka Palander <jukka at devspain.com>
> Sender: ambassadors-bounces at lists.fedoraproject.org
> Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2011 14:01:55 
> To: <ambassadors at lists.fedoraproject.org>
> Reply-To: ambassadors at lists.fedoraproject.org
> Subject: Re: [Ambassadors]
>  Fedora is the 2º most used Linux s
>  ystem
> 
> On Sun, 2011-11-27 at 11:37 -0100, Nuno Rodrigues Rodrigues wrote:
> 
> > According to experts, this decline may be explained by the
> > introduction of the Unity interface in Ubuntu for users new to Linux,
> > is more complicated than the GNOME version 3, still used in other
> > distributions from the top of the table."
> > 
> Distrowatch always shows high ranking when new distro is released. Just
> wait for the next Ubuntu release.. Unfortunately.
> 
> And according my personal knowledge (by all the friends and other Fedora
> users who I know or where I have been installing Fedora) Gnome 3 is
> lacking a lot and I have installed mostly the XFCE spin. This is due the
> Gnome 3.x's really poor user interface, it's modifiability and highly
> unergonomic window management.
> Good (or maybe bad) news is that all the Ubuntu users who I know are
> totally annoyed about Unity also and they want their old style Gnome 2.x
> back!
> 
> Roughly I would say, I've been installing, less than 20% Gnome and more
> than 80% XFCE. All of them because people want their old style Gnome
> back and XFCE is the easiest way to get the same feeling.
> 
> I seriously would think if Gnome right way to proceed for Fedora? At
> least I say NO -it is not! We should think about something else to be a
> default desktop. Personally I also switched into the XFCE spin from F14
> after I had skipped F15 entirely!
> 
> I am really sad, because this is not Fedoras fault. I _love_ Fedora but
> I do hate Gnome 3 which is going 10 years back on usability for me. Just
> being nice looking is not enough.
> 
> --
> Jukka
> 
> 
> 
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