Fedora 22 is out, Fedora 23 is coming :)

[Josh Boyer]

On Thu, Jun 4, 2015 at 12:47 PM, Matthew Miller
<mattdm at fedoraproject.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 04, 2015 at 12:31:15PM -0400, Josh Boyer wrote:
>> >> * https://github.com/vmware/tdnf this might help us to go another step
>> >>   closer to remove Python stack from the cloud image.* Having a better
>> > We need to talk to Peter Jones about plans to rewrite grubby in Python.
>> > I'm very sympathetic to his wish to have it no longer be in C, but if
>> > we _really_ are moving to getting python out....
>> Er, can you elaborate on this desire to get python out?  I'm kind of
>> confused.  Particularly about why grubby is such a concern.  If you
>> don't have python, you don't have yum/dnf which means updating your
>> kernel in your cloud image at _runtime_ is a PITA.  If you aren't
>
> Well, see above -- tdnf is python-free dnf (from which you could
> bootstrap to the full one).

I remain skeptical that is a good idea.  We've already had one
transition from yum to dnf where things aren't quite the same.
Throwing in yet-another implementation with no proven track record and
no discussion with QA simply because it's smaller seems odd.

>> updating your kernels at runtime and are instead relying on the whole
>> image to be respun (ala Atomic or otherwise) then you don't need
>> grubby anyway and it doesn't matter what language it's written in.
>
> And maybe that's the best path.

Sure.  I won't disagree that updating via rpm/dnf/yum might be better
served by just shipping a whole new image in the Cloud case.  Yet you
cut out and failed to reply about the other aspects of this.

>> This really kind of baffles me.  I would love to hear the reasoning
>> behind it.
>
> I think because it's one of the biggest and most complex things in
> minimal.

But cloud isn't minimal.  It's Cloud.  It needs to be useful for
Cloud-y things.  Like management via Ansible, etc.  If you're going
for minimal, you guys might as well become the Base image which
doesn't exist today.

josh