[Design-team] Fedora GRUB2 boot menu, from design perspective

[Dan Mashal]

However, keep one thing in mind. It already automagically selects the lates
Fedora kernel without user intervention, Martin. ;)
On Jun 20, 2012 12:39 PM, "Martin Sourada" <martin.sourada at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, 20 Jun 2012 08:03:35 -0700
> Kirk Bridger wrote:
>
> >
> > Perhaps we can put some additional solution ideas forward.
> >
> > As a quasi-novice kernel user I always found it helpful to have the
> > kernel versions visible.  When I update Fedora and the nvidia blob
> > causes X to fail, I like being able to choose older versions because
> > I can't do anything else.  When a pre-upgrade ends up with a
> > non-working version, I like to be able to run an older version to
> > stay productive while I research the problem.
> >
> > I'm not an expert user but I don't think I'm novice either.  I don't
> > see why we need to *hide* the older versions behind another menu,
> > just perhaps make it more clear that the old versions are still
> > functional but are not the latest on the machine.
> >
> > Novice users have the "out" of saying "I don't know what this all
> > means but I know I want to launch the most current version".  And if
> > they're dropped back here after a failure or two trying the current
> > version they can try the older versions.
> >
> > This all assumes that we're limited to the current console-style
> > menu. If we can use HTML/CSS or some other layout and styling we can
> > make this info much more parse-able with styling and different font
> > sizes/layout. If we can do more than just console can someone send a
> > screenshot of what we can do, and maybe we can mock something up?
> >
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> > Welcome to Fedora 17 (BeefyMiracle)
> >
> > *Current Versions*
> > Fedora 17 (kernel-3.6.0-1.fc17)
> > *
> > Superceded Versions*
> > Fedora 17 (kernel-3.5.20-3.fc17)
> > Fedora 17 (kernel-3.5.20-2.fc17)
> > Fedora 16 (kernel-3.2.10-4.fc16)
> >
> > *Other Operating Systems*
> > Microsoft Windows 7
> > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> >
> IMHO not a bad idea. I have a few notes though:
>  * Fedora 16 and Fedora 17 should be considered separate operating
>   systems (*if* they use different root).
>  * Boot loader should behave look like boot-loader not like an already
>   running operating system (the "Welcome to Fedora 17" text is
>   misleading)
>  * Why have Fedora stylistically higher priority than other operating
>   systems?
>
> IMHO, there are multiple different types of users, who use fedora,
> let's divide them into few different groups.
>
> 1. Dual booters -- Fedora and Windows (or Mac)
> ==============================================
> These people probably just want to boot the latest version unless
> something is broken. They might or might not know what the kernel
> versions mean. It might be better to "hide" older kernels in submenu
> (or if grub2 allows some better css-like way, why not?)
>
> 2. *nix enthusiasts/developers -- multi-booters
> ==============================================
> These people will probably have multiple operating systems installed,
> maybe even various versions of fedora. Let's say they have (for example)
> Fedora Rawhide, Fedora 17, Debian 6.0, FreeBSD 9 and Arch Linux. They
> know very well what kernel is, but if all installed kernels are listed
> there, the list gets rather large and it gets hard to quickly find the
> latest kernel. Especially for the two Fedoras that you can tell apart
> only by the fc18 vs. fc17 in kernel release number... While it would
> make selecting *older* kernel versions slower, I think it would be
> better to *hide* the older kernels in submenu, thus making the main
> menu easier to navigate. IMHO the gain of quicker selection of most
> recent kernel for each release would outweigh the less frequent slow
> down introduced by submenus.
>
> 3. Massive virtualization
> =========================
> These people have only one host operating system, the rest is in
> virtual machines. IMHO they are the only group that would *not* benefit
> from switch to sub-menus.
>
> IMHO, the gains to the first two groups outweigh the loss of the third
> group, but well, others might disagree. That's why we discuss things,
> right?
>
> So how would the bootloader screen would look like?
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
>                Welcome to GRUB 2
>              Select an OS to boot:
>
> * Fedora Rawhide (with linux-3.6.0-23.fc18)
> * Fedora 17 (with linux-3.6.0-23.fc17)
> * Debian 6.0 (with linux-2.6.28.3-23)
> * Microsoft Windows 7
>       --------
> * Fedora Rawhide (Rescue)
>  - older kernels listed in this submenu, and possibly some special
>   rescue mode(s)
> * Fedora 17 (Rescue)
>  - older kernels listed in this submenu, and possibly some special
>   rescue mode(s)
> * Debian 6.0 (Rescue)
>  - older kernels listed in this submenu, and possibly some special
>   rescue mode(s)
> * Microsoft Windows 7
>  - if we can only chainload win 7, this would not make sense, however
>   if we could run rescue modes for win from grub, this where it would
>   be.
>
> ----------------------------------------------------
>
>
> THanks,
> Martin
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