Schedule for Monday's FESCo Meeting (2012-06-18)

Richard W.M. Jones rjones at redhat.com
Sun Jun 17 17:49:43 UTC 2012


On Sun, Jun 17, 2012 at 05:06:51PM +0100, Richard Hughes wrote:
> On 17 June 2012 10:53, Richard W.M. Jones <rjones at redhat.com> wrote:
> > So this is a problem that needs to be solved, but does it require a
> > reboot?  Not really ... it's possible to list all processes using
> > zlib, convert that back into a list of packages, then instruct those
> > packages to restart themselves.  Job done, BETTER than Windows / OS X.
> 
> That's simply not possible. Some processes like dbus-daemon and
> gnome-session just cannot be restarted in this way.

You're asserting that dbus-daemon etc cannot be restarted, but without
saying why.  The current design may make restarting some daemons
difficult but we should fix those problems.

If you want to look around for ideas to lift from other OSes, take a
look at:

 - QNX
 - z/VM
 - EROS

Some of these OSes can run virtually indefinitely, being upgraded all
the time as they go along.  So please don't tell me that it's "simply
not possible".  It might not be possible *with poorly designed Linux
daemons* but that's quite a different thing.

[More assertions without explanations snipped]

[Irrelevant comment about static linking snipped]

> > This is another case where we ape the misfeatures of Mac OS X and
> > Windows, instead of doing it better (cf. Wayland, GNOME 3, etc)
> 
> I'm not sure how non-technical and misleading comments like this help
> people in coming to a decision. Can you refrain from posting things
> like this to a development mailing list please.

That was a very relevant comment.  The Wayland stack reinvents X, with
fewer features, including omitting very important features.  GNOME 3
tries to impose a tablet interface even though people are still using
keyboards and mice (I'm sure GNOME 3 works well on tablets, although
all tablets out there run iOS or Android so that's a bit irrelevant).

Rich.

-- 
Richard Jones, Virtualization Group, Red Hat http://people.redhat.com/~rjones
Read my programming blog: http://rwmj.wordpress.com
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