procps-ng is a mistake (was: Re: Summary/Minutes from today's FESCo Meeting (2012-05-14))

Lennart Poettering mzerqung at
Mon May 14 20:10:02 UTC 2012

On Mon, 14.05.12 14:45, Stephen Gallagher (sgallagh at wrote:

> * #851 F18 Feature: procps-ng (next generation procps tools) -
>  (sgallagh,
>   18:11:34)
>   * AGREED: Feature procps-ng is accepted (9 +1)  (sgallagh, 18:14:47)

Ahem. I think is is a really bad idea. "-ng" packages point to a huge
failure in the handling of the packages in question, and should not be
deemed a feature for Linux but a failure of Linux

Karel Zak has made clear that he is happy to merge procps into
util-linux (Karel is both upstream and downstream for u-l), and has offered
to do the work. util-linux is the much better place for these utilities,
so that common code, the development infrastructure, the build system,
the documentation scheme, the release cycle and the maintainership can
be shared.

There's really no point in all the bureaucracy for such a transition
if it just replaces one bad situation with another bad situation. If you
do a transition then do it right and merge procps into util-linux.

We really don't need two packages with such overlapping
functionality. Both of them had long phases in their history where they
were slowly rotting along. The best way to fight that is having a single
package from it so that this easier kept an eye on. They do very similar
stuff, they need the same expertise from the hackers and maintainers and
they should justbe one.

Really, nobody needs transitions, renames and multiple independent repos
for stuff that is very very similar in purpose and behaviour. 

I'd really like to see FESCO strongly ask the people behind procps-ng to
help working in the integration of its tools into util-linux, to make
the basic set of tools more nicely integrated rather than continue to
grow apart! There's really no point in just rubberstamping everything
people suggest. FESCO should push people in the right direction, and
push them towards collaboration. FESCO, please steer fedora (and Linux)
in the right direction here, that's your job!


Lennart Poettering - Red Hat, Inc.

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