Fedora 18 Beta to slip by two weeks, Beta release date is now Nov 27

[Tim Flink]

On Thu, 8 Nov 2012 20:14:05 +0000
Matthew Garrett <mjg59 at srcf.ucam.org> wrote:

> On Thu, Nov 08, 2012 at 11:31:18AM -0800, Adam Williamson wrote:
> > we're still thrashing around trying to figure out how to build and
> > ship the initramfs that fedup needs.
> 
> "we" are? I see approximately nobody offering assistance in that 
> respect.

If it would make you feel better, I can stop building test images,
updating test repos, testing fedup, writing documentation, answering
questions in bugzilla as best I can and attempting to help coordinate.
I'm obviously not helping in the least and it sounds like my time would
be better spent elsewhere. It'd certainly take things off my plate and
then you can do the work.

My skill set is not infinite. Sure, I could drop everything that I'm
doing in an attempt to wrap my head around how dracut and systemd are
used during upgrades so that I can help write the code needed for
fedup. However, I suspect that it would not only be incredibly
inefficient and slow down any testing efforts I'm involved in but I
would probably ask so many questions that I would just slow down the
development process. That sounds like a great plan.

> Anyway, it obviously gets built by Lorax, just like
> everything else under images.

Which is why I've gotten multiple answers on how the initramfs is going
to be generated, what it's going to look like and there's nothing
written about it in the official docs. It's so obvious, the answer
hasn't been consistent over time, releng has had very little idea of
what's going on and to the best of my knowledge, almost nothing has been
written down about the process.

Look, I realize that Will is getting the short end of the stick here
but there's not a whole lot that I, Adam or most of the rest of the QA
folks can do about that at the moment. We don't have the needed skills
right now and there are other things that need to be done outside fedup
development before F18 can be released. The best thing we can do right
now is to continue supporting development via testing, filing bugs and
coordination.

I'm doing my best to help in any way that I can so that Will (and anyone
else capable of helping with development) can focus on getting the stuff
done that he seems to be uniquely qualified for. Adam and _many_ other
people are working really hard to test F18, file bugs and help make
sure that when F18 is released, it's something we can all be proud of.

Asserting that we aren't helping in any way is incredibly insulting and
in my opinion, rather naive. I realize that I don't write code that gets
shipped with Fedora and I realize that through some eyes, that's what
happens when you have no talent or useful skills. If that's what you
want to think, go for it; you wouldn't be the first person to think so
and I sincerely doubt that you'd be the last.

Tim
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