F20 System Wide Change: No Default Syslog

[Lennart Poettering]

On Tue, 16.07.13 15:06, Chris Adams (linux at cmadams.net) wrote:

> Once upon a time, John.Florian at dart.biz <John.Florian at dart.biz> said:
> > While I'm no more important than the next guy, I'll defend the auto-pager 
> > feature of both git and journalctl.  I love it, in fact.  I'm no stranger 
> > to very long pipelines and sub-shells but I see nothing but benefit in not 
> > having to add "| less" routinely to things that are UI in nature.
> 
> My primary objection is that I don't like things that have differing
> behavior between a TTY and a pipe.  One problem is if you are writing a
> script to process output from something, you'll probably run the command
> in a TTY to check the output, but you'll get different results.
> 
> There are not many programs that have such TTY/pipe behavior.  The only
> ones that come to mind are "ps" (where output is truncated at screen
> width) and "ls" (where "--color=tty" changes between TTY and pipe).  The
> ls behavior makes sense (and doesn't change the information displayed,
> formatting, etc.); the "ps" behavior is annoying.  I guess "man" has
> similar auto-pager behavior to systemctl/journalctl (although IMHO man
> is a different type of thing, since it is a documentation reader).

ls, ps, man, git, wget, gcc, grep, pstree, bash, lsblk, lslocks, ...

And this is where I got bored and stopped looking.

> We already have pipes, and anyone that knows how to use a Unix shell
> knows how to use them.  IMHO it is extra complication (and code
> duplication) for programs to change behavior between a TTY and a pipe,
> unless there are specific things that can't easily be accomplished with
> a simple pipe (such as "ls --color=tty").  Pagination, truncation, etc.
> are easy using pipes, and should not be done in regular programs.

But anyway, this subthread is pointless. You won't convince me that
auto-paging is awful, you can just drop the thread entirely, it's
pointless.

Lennart

-- 
Lennart Poettering - Red Hat, Inc.