F20 System Wide Change: No Default Syslog

[Marc Deop i Argemí]

On Wednesday 17 July 2013 15:39:23 Lennart Poettering wrote:
> On Wed, 17.07.13 14:36, Denys Vlasenko (dvlasenk at redhat.com) wrote:
> 
> > > instead of administrators simply adding rsyslog or syslog-ng manually
> > > at install time or to their ks snippets.
> > 
> > And this too was answered several times already.
> > The machine in question may be already borked.
> > Our support people will need to figure out -
> > over the phone or email! - what has happened on client's
> > installation, and having traditional grep/sed/awk
> > recipes not working anymore because /var/log/messages
> > is not there anymore is an extremely unwelcome discovery
> > in an emergency.
> > 
> > You guys aren't administrators who are dealing with
> > these problems every day. You don't feel the pain
> > you create for other people.
> 
> Again:
> 
> "cat /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl"
> "tail -f /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -f"
> "tail -n100 /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl -n100"
> "grep foobar /var/log/messages" becomes "journalctl | grep foobar"
> 
> This isn't complex. You can grep/sed/awk as much as you want. You just
> do it over the output of journalctl rather than teh file. That's not
> that big a difference.
> 
> And if you really need it as a file, you can do "journalctl >
> /var/log/messages", and have it in a file. And if that doesn't cut it
> and you want something that is "living", then install rsyslog and you
> got the real /var/log/messages back.
> 
> > > and quite frankly administrators that complain about journal have not
> > > actually tried it and experienced the flexibility the journactl
> > > gives them it truly is not as bad as some people are trying to
> > > make it out to be.
> > 
> > False argument. People (on this thread) aren't complaining about
> > journactl being a bad thing.
> > They are complaining about /var/log/messages disappearing.
> 
> It's only disappearing as a file, it is not disappearing as a text
> format. "journalctl" has that, and thanks to the power of unix pipelines
> you can make use of that pretty much in the sam ways in grep/sed/awk as
> the text file itself.
> 
> Lennart
> 
> 

Again with this?

The problem is that we need another tool (journalctl) in the middle of that process.

Not to mention the problems (in the form of bugs/incompatibilities) that such tool can introduce in the job ( text files and sed,grep... have decades of refinement).

Regards,

Marc Deop

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