Fedora 20 release day FedUp bug: post-mortem

Adam Williamson awilliam at redhat.com
Fri Jan 3 07:10:34 UTC 2014

On Fri, 2014-01-03 at 06:46 +0100, Reindl Harald wrote:
> Am 03.01.2014 06:18, schrieb Adam Williamson:
> > On Fri, 2014-01-03 at 02:22 +0100, Kevin Kofler wrote:
> >> That leads us to the question of why we don't simply endorse the direct yum 
> >> (or dnf) method, which people do understand…
> > 
> > Only if you like asking and answering the same question twenty times,
> > which we know you do, Kevin. The answer that was given the last 19 times
> > is still valid: because /usrmove, and because grub->grub2, and because
> > other things that cannot be handled via a yum upgrade
> says who?

> not a single of my physical as well as virtual machines did see anaconda,
> preupgrade or fedup a single time, most of them where installed 2009 with
> F9, the newest setup started with F14 and they are all on F18/F19/F20 upgraded
> with yum

*sigh* It gets really fucking tiring dealing with this kind of
nitpicking bullshit. You know full well what I meant: can't be handled
*cleanly* with a yum upgrade. Of course you can hack around anything if
you wait for someone smart to figure out the method and then follow the
instructions carefully. But 'go read this page and do these complex
operations very carefully or else your system goes boom' is not an
upgrade experience we can reasonably recommend to users.

Yes, I am super t3h aweomse hardcore cool yay yay doge too and I've yum
upgraded my desktop all the way from F15 to current Rawhide OH WOW GO
ME. That's not the point.

> at this time 37 Fedora installations, 8 physical and 29 VM's
> > It doesn't really work to tell people 'you can yum upgrade with 13 and 
> > 14 and 15 but NOT 16 and 17 but NOT 18 and 19 and 20 and 21 but NOT 22
> what are you talking about?

I didn't bother going and looking up the correct release numbers for the
grub2 and /usrmove changes. I figured I could credit this list with
enough intelligence to figure out I was just giving a rough example.

> http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Upgrading_from_EOL_Fedora_using_yum#Fedora_15_-.3E_Fedora_16
> if someone can read the instructions are working fine and as long there
> are no completly wrong decisions in the future now that even GRUB2, UsrMove
> and the migration to systemd is done (all with yum) nothing should change
> here

So, um, you think that because we've done three big changes in the past
that means we won't ever do another again? I'm not quite sure how that
logic works.

> the typical recommendation "better install from scratch" makes much more
> headache than a dist-upgrade with yum

I didn't make any such suggestion, so this is entirely irrelevant.
Adam Williamson
Fedora QA Community Monkey
IRC: adamw | Twitter: AdamW_Fedora | XMPP: adamw AT happyassassin . net

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