Ramblings and questions regarding Fedora, but stemming from gnome-software and desktop environments

[Alec Leamas]

On 02/01/15 11:42, Richard Hughes wrote:

>> Because as of now, gnome-software just doesn't fit the workstation bill
>
> I think you're misunderstanding what most developers do. We probably
> spend about 10 minutes installing development packages (on the command
> line) when setting up a new OS instance. I then spend a year or so of
> installing or removing the odd application, and a few minutes every
> week applying updates. I don't think GNOME Software is hugely useful
> for installing low-level developer packages, which is fine. It doesn't
> mean it's not a useful application.

I don't know if "most" developers works with more or less just one 
toolchain and environment as you describe. At least "some" actually 
works in a lot of projects, with different development packages and 
sometimes also tools.

That said, what about describing  the developer usecase as a project, 
focusing on a user using both GUI and CLI tools?

- Get the sources (if they exist).
- Install a toolchain, GUI-based or not.
- Install dependencies: -devel packages, interpreted modules, etc.
- Install project- or user-specific tools (GUI or not).
- Keeping the installed sw updated.

Installing the toolchain seems like DevAssistant to me. Besides this, I 
understand your position as if users are supposed to use yum/dnf except 
for GUI development tools and their dependencies (?)

To my mind, forcing user to the prompt to this extent is less than 
ideal. A GUI installer certainly has advantages even for an occasional 
CLI user. And having to use different installers is a Bad Thing.

> Rather than talking in riddles in your emails, could you also please
> suggest what needs to be done? Are you in favour of ripping out
> gnome-software and installing yumex in the workstation image? Do you
> have an alternate application proposal with design mockups?

At this point, I'm just trying to understand the usecase. Without that, 
decisions like using yumex instead of gnome-software makes no sense, nor 
does mock-ups. It's also a question to what extent upstream is willing 
to support this usecase.

That said, my gut feeling is that the balance between simplicity and 
functionality is quite different for a "novice user" and a developer and 
that this needs to be handled with different modes, views or so (if 
gnome-software should handle it). Adding things like random CLI 
applications, -devel packages etc. to the search result for a  novice 
user is just not an option, agreed. But IMHO a developer probably needs 
it in some form.

Cheers!

--alec