[Bug 1021605] New: No Default Syslog

[bugzilla at redhat.com]

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1021605

            Bug ID: 1021605
           Summary: No Default Syslog
           Product: Fedora Documentation
           Version: devel
         Component: install-guide
          Keywords: Tracking
          Assignee: pbokoc at redhat.com
          Reporter: pbokoc at redhat.com
        QA Contact: docs-qa at lists.fedoraproject.org
                CC: brentrbrian at gmail.com, johannbg at gmail.com,
                    jreznik at redhat.com, kvolny at redhat.com,
                    mattdm at redhat.com, pbokoc at redhat.com,
                    yjcoshc at gmail.com, zach at oglesby.co, zbyszek at in.waw.pl
        Depends On: 967521, 998573
            Blocks: 1001355, 1001356



+++ This bug was initially created as a clone of Bug #998573 +++

This is a tracking bug for Change: No Default Syslog
For more details, see: http://fedoraproject.org//wiki/Changes/NoDefaultSyslog

No longer install a traditional syslog service by default. (Specifically,
remove rsyslog from the @core or @standard groups in comps.)

--- Additional comment from Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek on 2013-10-08 15:22:54
EDT ---

http://cgit.freedesktop.org/systemd/systemd/commit/?id=2b8f6883a17b

--- Additional comment from Jaroslav Reznik on 2013-10-11 04:44:57 EDT ---

This message is a reminder that Fedora 20 Accepted Changes 100%
Completed Deadline is on 2013-10-15 [1].

All Accepted Changes has to be code complete and ready to be
validated in the Beta release (optionally by Fedora QA). Required
bug state at this point is ON_QA.

As for several System Wide Changes, Beta Change Deadline is a
point of contingency plan, all incomplete Changes will be 
reported to FESCo for 2013-10-16 meeting. In case of any
questions, don't hesitate to ask Wrangler (jreznik).

[1] https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Releases/20/Schedule

--- Additional comment from Matthew Miller on 2013-10-15 14:38:53 EDT ---

The basic change to implement this went in, although quite a few packages still
bring in rsyslogd as a dependency. I think this feature is fine as it is, and
we'll detangle that as part of making separate, targeted Fedora products.

--- Additional comment from Jaroslav Reznik on 2013-10-16 06:56:42 EDT ---

Ok, thanks, moving to ON_QA.

--- Additional comment from Karel Volný on 2013-10-21 08:27:14 EDT ---

just FTR, journal brings bug #967521 - how could we switch to this nonsense if
that one is still unresolved?

well, in fact, how could we even have this activated by default, maybe I'm just
out of luck googling, but I see no approval for journal to be used?

--- Additional comment from Jóhann B. Guðmundsson on 2013-10-21 08:59:21 EDT
---

Just an FYI This feature is not as simple as no default syslog. We need to fix
the entire syslog ( journal/rsyslog/syslog-ng ) implementation in the
distribution, come up with virtual provide ( to sub package or not to sub
package rsyslog/syslog-ng ) as well as fix roughly 600 packages. Now the
proposal on how to do so has been stuck with FPC for 2 years now and until that
has been done and fixed this feature can never be considered 100% complete...

--- Additional comment from Matthew Miller on 2013-10-21 09:10:10 EDT ---

(In reply to Jóhann B. Guðmundsson from comment #6)
> Just an FYI This feature is not as simple as no default syslog. We need to
> fix the entire syslog ( journal/rsyslog/syslog-ng ) implementation in the
> distribution, come up with virtual provide ( to sub package or not to sub
> package rsyslog/syslog-ng ) as well as fix roughly 600 packages. Now the
> proposal on how to do so has been stuck with FPC for 2 years now and until
> that has been done and fixed this feature can never be considered 100%
> complete...

I agree that that's the target, and also that it will continue to be
slow-moving. This feature was intentionally meant to slice off and accomplish a
small portion of that.

--- Additional comment from Brent R Brian on 2013-10-21 09:42:27 EDT ---

My comments are not intended to be a remedy, fix, enoursement of a fix/remedy
or anything other than a "data point".

If you guys need a "lab rat", let me know.

B

--- Additional comment from Jóhann B. Guðmundsson on 2013-10-21 11:10:22 EDT
---

(In reply to Matthew Miller from comment #7)
> (In reply to Jóhann B. Guðmundsson from comment #6)
> > Just an FYI This feature is not as simple as no default syslog. We need to
> > fix the entire syslog ( journal/rsyslog/syslog-ng ) implementation in the
> > distribution, come up with virtual provide ( to sub package or not to sub
> > package rsyslog/syslog-ng ) as well as fix roughly 600 packages. Now the
> > proposal on how to do so has been stuck with FPC for 2 years now and until
> > that has been done and fixed this feature can never be considered 100%
> > complete...
> 
> I agree that that's the target, and also that it will continue to be
> slow-moving. This feature was intentionally meant to slice off and
> accomplish a small portion of that.

That is one of the core problem people really as in that feature and related
work are just implemented up to the point it serves the feature requester need
( and is labelled as 100% feature completed ) as opposed to the actual work
required to implement properly into the distribution.

What we need to do is to keep distribute wide changes as these in a separated
branch and switch all the components at the same time when the feature actually
is 100% feature complete


Referenced Bugs:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=967521
[Bug 967521] /var/log/journal breaks system startup
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=998573
[Bug 998573] No Default Syslog
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1001355
[Bug 1001355] No Default Syslog
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1001356
[Bug 1001356] No Default Syslog
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