Docs meeting 2010-04-07 - Log

Thu Apr 8 00:13:55 UTC 2010

23:00:37 <stickster> #startmeeting Fedora Docs
23:00:38 <zodbot> Meeting started Wed Apr  7 23:00:37 2010 UTC.  The chair is stickster. Information about MeetBot at http://wiki.debian.org/MeetBot.
23:00:40 <stickster> #meetingname Fedora Docs
23:00:40 <zodbot> Useful Commands: #action #agreed #halp #info #idea #link #topic.
23:00:42 <zodbot> The meeting name has been set to 'fedora_docs'
23:00:43 <stickster> #chair jjmcd
23:00:44 <zodbot> Current chairs: jjmcd stickster
23:01:02 <jjmcd> good evening all
23:01:07 <jjmcd> #topic roll call
23:01:11 * nathant 
23:01:14 * stickster 
23:01:15 * jjmcd 
23:01:56 <jjmcd> wow - short list tonight
23:01:59 * ke4qqq is here
23:02:05 <ke4qqq> a moment or two late
23:02:35 <jjmcd> Lets give it another minute
23:02:59 * jsmith is here... at least for a few minutes
23:03:07 <jjmcd> Alright, a few more
23:03:08 <stickster> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Docs_Project_meetings <-- Agenda
23:03:23 <jjmcd> Oh yeah, sorry forgot that
23:03:32 <jjmcd> #topic schecule review
23:03:46 <jjmcd> #link http://poelstra.fedorapeople.org/schedules/f-13/f-13-docs-tasks.html
23:04:27 <jjmcd> No real changes on release notes, how are guides coming?
23:04:29 <stickster> Next things up -- Project-wide final relnotes deadline reminder -- tomorrow
23:04:54 <jjmcd> yep
23:04:54 <stickster> jjmcd: You're doing the deadline reminder, right?
23:04:59 <jjmcd> Correct
23:05:19 <jjmcd> Are POTs getting built for guides?
23:05:20 <stickster> We have doc builds already being posted regularly
23:05:38 <stickster> Oh, that may be a rudi question -- I know that he posted to L10n and generally people agreed that twice a weeks was good
23:05:39 <jjmcd> Looks like L10N agrees with Mon/Thu for POTs
23:05:51 <rudi> +1 -- L10N likes Mon/Thurs
23:06:30 <stickster> #action jjmcd Send deadline reminder on 2010-04-08 to devel-announce@, and other lists re: relnotes deadline on 2010-04-19
23:06:53 <jjmcd> rudi, how are the POTs plumbed to tfx?
23:07:46 <jjmcd> Simply push to git or is there more to it?
23:07:54 <rudi> jjmcd -- basically, delete the en-US and POT folders from the F13 branch; then
23:07:57 <noriko> Mon/Thu would be fine.
23:08:07 <rudi> copy the en-US folder from the master branch to the f13 branch
23:08:18 <rudi> then run update_pot and update_po in the f13 branch
23:08:27 <rudi> I should document that on the Wiki :)
23:08:31 <stickster> :-)
23:08:44 <jjmcd> OK, so I will go ahead and script that for release notes, but we still need to deal with the guides
23:08:57 <rudi> jjmcd -- stand by for the guides
23:09:34 <rudi> Some are ready now, some are nearly ready, and some are still a way off and may not get translated prior to GA
23:10:02 <jjmcd> Ok, lets see if folks need help when we get there on the agenda
23:10:07 <rudi> Yep
23:10:09 <jjmcd> anything else on the schedule?
23:10:37 <jjmcd> OK, moving on
23:10:42 <stickster> wait
23:10:51 * stickster comes back, sorry
23:11:14 <stickster> We have Freeze of the wiki on 2010-04-19, last POT files in by 2010-04-26
23:11:40 <jjmcd> Right, that's what my calendar says, too
23:11:49 <stickster> #info wiki freeze 2010-04-19
23:11:57 <stickster> #info Last POT files for relnotes 2010-04-26
23:12:08 <jjmcd> good catch - I forget that bot
23:12:09 <stickster> So between those two dates we need to have all the wiki changes in the beats ported in
23:12:21 <jjmcd> correct
23:12:25 <stickster> Cool, that was it
23:12:31 <stickster> Just wanted to note for the... uh, notes :-)
23:12:33 <jjmcd> OK, anything else?
23:13:13 <stickster> Nope
23:13:17 <jjmcd> #topic Action items from last week
23:13:23 <jjmcd> #link http://meetbot.fedoraproject.org/fedora-meeting/2010-03-31/fedora_docs.2010-03-31-23.05.html
23:13:37 * stickster action items complete, except pre-porting party training session reminder
23:13:57 <jjmcd> OK, I'm behind on most of mine.  But dates slid a week
23:14:31 <jjmcd> I saw ke4qqq working with laubersm and others this week, any comments?
23:15:06 <ke4qqq> lots of people did chapters on UG
23:15:13 <jjmcd> Oh, one item from me.  README is badly out of date and I need to bend the ear of someone smarter than I to update it
23:15:52 <stickster> I did a chapter!
23:16:07 <jjmcd> We already talked about POT scheme, rudi did you make any headway on KDE?
23:16:12 <stickster> jjmcd: I can look at that tonight.
23:16:24 <jjmcd> *that* ?
23:16:32 * laubersm is back...
23:16:36 <rudi> jjmcd -- not yet; Still trying to get F13 to actiually install for me...
23:16:50 * laubersm wonders if stickster finished the chapter, seeing as the wiki does not reflect it is done
23:16:54 <rudi> Once I manage that; verification should be easy :)
23:16:59 <rudi> Hopefully today :)
23:17:20 <stickster> laubersm: I did
23:17:31 <jjmcd> Looks like the choice for KDE is alpha.  Seems like KDE beta is a rollyour own deal
23:18:11 <stickster> jjmcd: Actually: http://alt.fedoraproject.org/pub/alt/nightly-composes/kde/
23:18:18 <stickster> Just pull the latest nightly compose.
23:18:25 * jjmcd never caught the kde
23:18:40 <jjmcd> But today I've been working on FC6 (!)
23:18:42 <laubersm> I have a KDE live usb - one of the beta RC but not the most current
23:18:51 <jjmcd> OK, cool
23:18:53 <stickster> Was that all our action items, jjmcd?
23:18:57 <rudi> Thanks stickster
23:19:09 <jjmcd> stickster, you fixed the &PRODUCT; ?
23:19:21 <stickster> jjmcd: Well... I found one more uncorrected one just now
23:19:34 <stickster> fixed in master
23:19:36 <rudi> jjmcd -- Oh, I have some typos to fix in the RN before you refresh
23:20:00 <jjmcd> OK, also, infra just made the technical-notes repo, I'm struggling with that first commit, but most of that is in hand
23:20:09 <stickster> jjmcd: Are we finished with action items?
23:20:22 <jjmcd> I think so
23:20:25 <stickster> #topic Release Notes
23:20:44 <jjmcd> L10N status
23:20:48 <jjmcd> #link https://translate.fedoraproject.org/projects/p/docs-release-notes/c/f13/
23:21:06 <jjmcd> Looks like we have a couple more languages done and a couple more very close
23:21:14 <jjmcd> L10N rocks!
23:21:58 <jjmcd> The current challenge is I need previous version of Publican for release notes proper, current version for technical notes
23:22:00 <stickster> #info 7 languages at 100%, 2 more > 80%, 6 more > 30%
23:22:20 <stickster> jjmcd: What's going on with Publican and the release notes "proper"?
23:22:29 <stickster> And what's the difference?
23:22:44 <jjmcd> Latest Publican has an undesireable feature
23:22:47 <jjmcd> Drops the TOC
23:22:51 <stickster> Which is?
23:22:53 <stickster> eew
23:22:55 <stickster> Is that an option we can turn on?
23:22:56 <jjmcd> But fixes some issues with big tables
23:22:59 <rudi> jjmcd -- I'll have a fix for you today
23:23:04 <jjmcd> According to rudi yes
23:23:08 <rudi> stickster -- yeah
23:23:08 <stickster> coolio!
23:23:28 <jjmcd> Right now I'm flipping between rpms :-)
23:23:44 <jjmcd> OK, anything else on release notes?
23:24:15 <stickster> It seems like we're pretty much on track, yeah?
23:24:21 <jjmcd> I think so
23:24:35 <jjmcd> I don't think we will have an overwhelming amount to port
23:24:39 * stickster is comparing the rocky road that was F11/F12 to now... so much easier with the Publican/Tx interface working properly!
23:24:51 <jjmcd> ABSOLUTELY
23:25:04 <stickster> We should totally thank ricky, glezos, diegobz, juhp and others for that.
23:25:15 <stickster> By setting up the new Tx they made things *SO* much easier for everyone.
23:25:33 <jjmcd> stickster, perhaps you, me and sparks should organize dueling blogs
23:25:46 <stickster> jjmcd: right on!
23:26:06 <jjmcd> It really is a pleasure now
23:26:06 <stickster> #action stickster jjmcd sparks Create blogs to thank the folks who worked on the rollout of new Transifex
23:26:19 <jjmcd> and without all the merging, I can appreciate the new publican speed, too
23:26:47 <jjmcd> OK, anything else on release notes?
23:27:09 <stickster> nada
23:27:13 <jjmcd> #topic Guide status
23:27:34 <jjmcd> Anyone with info on live images?
23:27:39 <nathant> yup
23:27:47 <nathant> it's updated and branched
23:27:52 <nathant> translations coming in
23:28:00 <nathant> should I start doing builds yet?
23:28:03 <jjmcd> way cool, thanks nathant
23:28:13 <rudi> nathant -- absolutely
23:28:13 <jjmcd> Yes, probably not a bad plan
23:28:23 <jjmcd> Did my wiki page on building make any sense?
23:28:26 * nathant adds to his to-do list
23:28:41 <nathant> jjmcd: yes -great help, thanks!
23:28:51 <stickster> nathant: Nicely done sir!
23:29:05 <nathant> though for the time being it's just mon and thurs, right?
23:29:07 <jjmcd> I always wonder whether anyone can fathom what I'm saying!
23:29:29 <stickster> That's because it's so deep. (*bucket o fish!*)
23:29:36 <jjmcd> nathant, we've been building every night, POTs mon/thu
23:29:46 <nathant> oh, ok!
23:30:13 <jjmcd> Once rudi wikis the POT process that sounds like a piece of cake
23:30:21 <nathant> there'll be a few nights when a build won't get done
23:30:33 <nathant> i'll be away
23:30:46 <jjmcd> cron is your friend
23:31:11 * jjmcd is real good buddies with him
23:31:17 <nathant> wouldn't that mean leaving my machine switched on for days on end?
23:31:35 <jjmcd> nathant, yeah, which you might not be inclined to do
23:31:53 <nathant> just thinking about the electricity
23:31:57 <jjmcd> yep
23:32:11 <jjmcd> especially with these gigihertz, multi-core monsters
23:32:14 <stickster> In the future we could request a publictest* system from the infrastructure guys for that purpose.
23:32:47 <jjmcd> We should think about that for 14.  It is a lot of crunching, umpteen guides times a bazillion languages
23:32:50 <stickster> Yup.
23:33:14 <stickster> #idea Request a publictest system from Infrastructure in F14 for release notes building. Add this to the schedule pre-Alpha!
23:33:22 <stickster> I'll talk to poelcat about that.
23:33:35 <jjmcd> Anything else on guides?  Anyone need any help?
23:33:38 <laubersm> UG is under control (thanks to the beta slip). Just a couple of items...
23:33:41 <laubersm> I'm not quite done with my part so I cannot complain that I am also waiting on rudi
23:33:48 <laubersm> ogh wait I just did :)
23:33:59 <ke4qqq> IQSG is doing well thanks to bcotton and emad78
23:33:59 <laubersm> There are 2 items in the todo for this month (not this week)
23:34:05 <rudi> lolz -- have the new nightly compose coming down the pipes right now
23:34:06 <stickster> jjmcd: nathant: By the way, I can provide a host here at my house if needed. I have a humongous powerhouse machine that's on 24/7 here.
23:34:06 <ke4qqq> they've plowed through a ton of work
23:34:23 <stickster> rudi: nice!
23:34:26 <laubersm> luigi needs some help with the new Netowrking chapter and there is an open request for a printing chapter
23:34:37 <jjmcd> It is really great to see bcotton, nathant, emad78 diving in
23:34:48 <nathant> stickster: what would I need to do to set that up?
23:34:51 <stickster> bcotton, nathant, Emad78: APPLAUSE!
23:34:58 * nathant blushes
23:35:00 <laubersm> also lewis14
23:35:02 <stickster> nathant: Just ask -- get with me in #fedora-docs after this and we'll set it up
23:35:12 <nathant> stickster: ok
23:35:22 <jjmcd> yes laubersm he seems to be around when I'm asleep so I forget him
23:35:39 <jjmcd> uitstekend!
23:36:05 <jjmcd> Any more on guides?
23:36:30 <stickster> Lots of new Anaconda screens for IG/IQSG I noticed...
23:36:52 <ke4qqq> yep
23:37:21 <laubersm> stickster, since you know the big picture... where is artwork on backgrounds?
23:37:30 <laubersm> in the past they had a diff one for beta than for alpha
23:37:41 <laubersm> but I was looking at their pages and I am not as sure it is going to change
23:37:56 * laubersm has a todo item to figure out when to refresh the UG screenshots
23:38:20 <stickster> laubersm: A new version was just created by a new designer
23:38:31 <stickster> laubersm: And it's pretty sweet, so it may be landing slightly post-Beta
23:38:47 <stickster> laubersm: You might want to drop a note to the design-team@ list to ask about this.
23:38:47 <laubersm> ok, thanks stickster
23:39:05 <stickster> #action laubersm Write note to design-team@ list to ask about refresh of wallpaper due to UG screenshots
23:39:05 <laubersm> I'll continue with my plan to contact the team here at some point
23:39:12 <jjmcd> Perhaps mo could provide you with the image for docs
23:39:46 <stickster> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F13_Artwork#Concepts.2C_WIP_Designs <-- look at the last (bottom right) entry
23:40:06 <jjmcd> I kinda like the klingon artwork on alpha
23:40:13 <stickster> :-)
23:40:41 <jjmcd> Anything else on guides (I sound like a broken record)
23:40:59 <jjmcd> #topic Beta Announcement
23:41:02 <jjmcd> #link https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/F13_Beta_announcement
23:41:47 <jjmcd> Looks like we need some feature prose
23:41:51 <laubersm> I like the rocket squid by itself but thinkk the rocket trails is a better background
23:41:54 <stickster> This is a paste of Ryan's draft -- which was on time in the original schedule, and is now early
23:42:14 <stickster> #info Ryan is planning to work on some content, but will need help moving in other important stuff from release notes
23:42:39 <jjmcd> What timezone is Ryan on?
23:42:53 <ke4qqq> jjmcd: effectively pacific
23:43:51 <jjmcd> is he on channel with any frequency?
23:44:03 <ke4qqq> he' in -mktg all the time
23:44:09 <ke4qqq> or at least it seems that way
23:44:17 <stickster> He's here too, rrix
23:44:22 <ke4qqq> ahhh ok
23:44:50 <jjmcd> I guess we only have a few days
23:45:14 <stickster> jjmcd: The release notes stuff is in pretty good shape at this point -- we should take that time to bring some content from there into the announcement page to help Ryan out.
23:45:16 <laubersm> next readiness meeting is later tonight isn't it?
23:45:32 <stickster> laubersm: Yes, 0000 UTC (8:00pm Eastern)
23:45:37 <laubersm> the RC test cases were not looking that great this afternoon....
23:45:52 <stickster> That's not good. RC5 was supposed to fix a bunch of late problems.
23:46:29 <laubersm> honestly, I just still saw some red and bug numbers but didn't look to see the detaisl
23:46:39 <laubersm> they may not be blockers
23:46:56 * jjmcd can try to help rrix but I have some drama going on downstate, afraid I might get pulled away
23:47:38 <ke4qqq> if necessary I can work with rrix to get something ready
23:47:47 <ke4qqq> if jjmcd is pulled away
23:47:49 <stickster> ke4qqq: You sure? WIth the other guide stuff going on?
23:48:07 <ke4qqq> yeah iqsg is almost done (and others are doing the heavy lifting
23:48:10 <stickster> I'll try to help too
23:48:19 <jjmcd> ke4qqq, spent last day and a half onna fone with DECs, ECs, government types, section types, just awful
23:48:19 <ke4qqq> ig is (I think) still waiting on rudi to do a mass import
23:48:28 <stickster> #action ke4qqq stickster Get some release notes content into [[F13 Beta announcement]] page to help rrix
23:48:35 <stickster> ke4qqq: Ah
23:48:39 <rudi> Yeah, IG and IQSG
23:48:42 <ke4qqq> jjmcd: speaking as a former aec any conversation with them is awful :)
23:48:50 <jjmcd> hehe
23:48:54 <stickster> OK, OT guys -- let's finish the meeting :-)
23:49:01 * stickster has to vamoose at 20:00 for the release meeting
23:49:04 <jjmcd> Moving on
23:49:14 <jjmcd> #topic Outstanding BZ tickets
23:49:20 * laubersm hears the sound of whips cracking and an echo echo echo
23:49:24 <jjmcd> Anyone have any issues they need help on
23:49:37 <jjmcd> stickster, actually, I think we are on track
23:49:46 <jjmcd> We'll get kicked out then anyway
23:49:46 <stickster> #link http://is.gd/bjdwP
23:49:52 <stickster> Oh, true dat!
23:50:37 <jjmcd> Anyone need help with bugs?
23:51:23 <jjmcd> rudi, re: #544656, installed RNs now have a <noscript> section too
23:51:53 <jjmcd> ANything else on bugs?
23:52:05 <laubersm> .bug 508025
23:52:07 <zodbot> laubersm: Bug 508025 User Guide needs a chapter on printing - https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=508025
23:52:21 <laubersm> I am not likely to have time for this for F13.
23:52:42 * jjmcd is fighting with printing himself, could use the guide
23:52:47 <laubersm> I'll add it to the F14 plan unless someone else wants to pick it up and complete it in the next couple of weeks
23:53:06 <laubersm> It can be dropped into translation as a unit when it is ready
23:53:19 <stickster> #info We need someone to handle https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=508025 -- create a printing chapter for the User Guide
23:53:39 * stickster wonders... is that duplicated at all in the Deployment Guide or other content? Maybe rudi knows.
23:53:46 * stickster goes to check F12 version.
23:53:50 <ke4qqq> wonder if one of our new volunteers would like that if it isn't duplicated
23:54:02 <rudi> If so, it might be quite out of date...
23:54:07 <jjmcd> Or even if it is, it will need updating
23:54:10 <rudi> Yeah
23:54:14 <jjmcd> yeah what he said
23:54:16 <nathant> I could do a bit on usb printers
23:54:26 <nathant> need a guide myself for network printers
23:54:27 <stickster> Deployment Guide: http://docs.fedoraproject.org/deployment-guide/f12/en-US/html/ch-printing.html
23:54:35 <laubersm> If it is in detail elsewhere, an overview and a link can (and should) still be added to UG
23:54:52 <rudi> laubersm +1
23:55:04 * jjmcd uses tons of samba/jetprint stuff, but it often doesn't work and when it doesn't it's a mystery
23:55:08 <stickster> Yeah, from the user side it's supposed to get super-easy in F13.
23:55:16 <stickster> Plug it in, driver install if needed, print.
23:55:26 <laubersm> thanks stickster - and that needs updating anyways.  F13 feature of auto add driver at the least
23:55:30 <stickster> yup
23:56:22 <jjmcd> OK, only 4 minutes for next topic, is that it on bugs?
23:56:31 <jjmcd> #topic All other business
23:56:53 * jjmcd is always startled when zodpot types right after me
23:56:55 <stickster> nada here
23:57:07 * laubersm notes that having this meeting when the sun is still up is odd.
23:57:13 <jjmcd> I think that's all I have
23:57:27 <jjmcd> laubersm, you should be up here as we rapidly head for the midnight sun
23:57:28 <nathant> speak for your own timezone
23:57:42 <laubersm> :)
23:57:53 <nathant> :)
23:57:58 <jjmcd> OK, anything else for the group assembled
23:58:12 <jjmcd> 10
23:58:20 <jjmcd> 9
23:58:25 <jjmcd> 8
23:58:32 <jjmcd> 7 these are way slower than a second
23:58:32 <laubersm> 12
23:58:35 <jjmcd> ?
23:58:42 <jjmcd> 10/2
23:58:45 <jjmcd> 4
23:58:52 <jjmcd> 3
23:58:56 <jjmcd> 2
23:58:59 <jjmcd> 1
23:59:10 <jjmcd> Thanks everyone for coming and for all your hard work
23:59:16 <jjmcd> #endmeeting