Agenda for Env-and-Stacks WG meeting (2015-04-16)

Matthew Miller mattdm at
Thu Apr 16 13:51:47 UTC 2015

On Thu, Apr 16, 2015 at 09:16:39AM +0200, Petr Hracek wrote:
> only for my better understanding.
> dark blue circles means rings?


> Base design means ring 0 (if we start with counting from 0).
> Light blue means ring 1?
> Orange circle mean ring 2?

Going with my earlier circle, I'd say that Base Design is Ring 1,
and there is actually a not-pictured Ring 0 inside that, which
represents the minimal installable system.

> Would it be possible to describe a bit the picture?

Sure. The following is kind of a brain dump rather than an organized
presentation -- you can read the paragraphs out of order if it helps.

The basic idea is that we have Workstation, Cloud, Server (and, not
pictured, various spins) drawn from the general package collection,
possibly composed with rpm-ostree (and likely an rpm-ostree with
extensions to its current capability allowing more local "overlays" —
something Colin has talked about but not implemented because it's
outside of the Atomic use case).

The various rectangles next to each edition represent layering
technologies, whether they be ostree overlays, docker or other
containers, or the LinuxApps effort. Ideally, these are _all_
implemented with container technologies, although I'm not quite sure
we're there yet. For Server, it's the Server Roles (obviously, I hope).
For Workstation, I drew these as _modules_ comprising functional
bundles of software, because as a user, that's an level _I'd_ find
useful (with individual applications installable as a separate thing).
For Cloud, I wrote Docker, but we don't necessarily want to be
completely tied to that — if Project Atomic continues to be successful,
I envision that eventually being the _primary_ Fedora Cloud output,
with the minimal cloud base image being a side deliverable.

The dotted line for IOT or SDN represents suggested Internet of Things
or Software Defined Networking editions which have been informally
suggested but not formally proposed or worked on.

Everything in the blue circle is basically what we think of as the
Fedora OS today. If this were a 3D diagram, I might draw the rounded
rectangles as floating above.

The orange circle extends outside of traditional Fedora OS, but I'd
love for people to start thinking about the Fedora brand as bigger and
more inclusive than just the distro as it exists. I've put a dotted
line on the outside of that to indicate that it's really a fuzzy

Also of note, see the Docker containers for the cloud edition stepping
outside of the blue circle. I suggest that at some point at least
_some_ components which are part of a standard edition will consist of
containers built from source right to a docker container, eschewing the
middle step of building RPMs — but giving us the same traceability and
verifiability. (Maybe these containers will be built in koji, for

I didn't draw it, but I think the Playground actually exists on the
border between orange and blue, but really more inside than out. Maybe
it's best drawn as an incursion of the orange circle into the blue one.

Matthew Miller
<mattdm at>
Fedora Project Leader

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