[irc-support-sig] #100: eol fedora questions and questions from non-fedora users

[irc-support-sig]

#100: eol fedora questions and questions from non-fedora users
-----------------------+-----------------------
  Reporter:  bookwar   |      Owner:
      Type:  feedback  |     Status:  closed
  Priority:  minor     |  Milestone:  Fedora 16
   Version:            |   Severity:  Neutral
Resolution:  fixed     |   Keywords:
Blocked By:            |   Blocking:
-----------------------+-----------------------

Comment (by bjensen):

 Top and inline Post, sue me.

 >  This feedback is:
 >   {{{
 >   [ ] Positive
 >   [ ] Negative
 >   [X] Neutral
 >   }}}

 Neutral? It's a negative I shows failure.

 >  '''My IRC nick is:''' bookwar
 >
 >  '''Please briefly describe the interaction that caused you to file this
 >  ticket:'''

 You are covering two things, two situations in one ticket. I'm really only
 interested in the part that involves me.

 >   The situation when people are kicked or banned from the support
 channel,
 >  while they ask fedora-related questions in a reasonable and polite way
 >  seems to be wrong for me.
 >
 >   Once I saw how the person was sent out because he wasn't a Fedora
 user.
 >  He asked if there exists one specific package in Fedora repos. And he
 said
 >  he could not use yum to find it. Instead of giving him link for koji or
 >  Fedora package database or direct answer, DiscordianUK said "we support
 >  only Fedora users here".

 I pasted up the log relevant to the above description. I'll be inserting
 comments as I see fit. Again I'm only interested in the parts that involve
 me.

 >  {{{
 >  (11:54:25 PM) Edulix: can somebody please tell which fedora package
 >  provides the binary xsltproc?
 >  (11:55:25 PM) bookwar1: libxslt
 >  (11:55:32 PM) Edulix: bookwar1: thanks
 >  (12:00:35 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: the yum man page talks about "provides"

 My goal is almost always to educate users, Directing a user to a man page
 to
 gain knowledge is the way they help themselves.

 >  (12:01:12 AM) Edulix: EvilBob: cool
 >  (12:01:15 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: So "yum provides */xsltproc" would get
 you
 >  the desired info

 I made my initial direction more clear using an example.

 >  (12:01:35 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: You can also use rpm to look this up
 >  (12:01:46 AM) DiscordianUK: or repoquery
 >  (12:02:19 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: You would QUERY the database for the
 FILE
 >  in question, see the man page for more info

 Again a second attempt at educating the user.

 >  (12:02:29 AM) Edulix: EvilBob: but I don't have fedora installed so
 >  (12:02:35 AM) Edulix: I need something online :P
 >  (12:02:37 AM) EvilBob: Sure
 >  (12:03:10 AM) EvilBob: No time like NOW to get it installed

 At this point the user makes his situation more clear, he does not have
 Fedora.
 No time like the present to get on board trying to welcome them in to the
 fold.

 >  (12:03:15 AM) randomuser: Edulix, other package managers probably have
 >  this feature too
 >  (12:04:21 AM) Edulix: EvilBob: I'm creating a package for
 >  fedora,opensuse,mandriva,debian,ubuntu,windows,linux,mac...
 >  (12:05:21 AM) Edulix: EvilBob: and no I'm not installing all those,
 I'll
 >  let others do it, I'm using opensuse build service to create the
 package
 >  for all the linuxes and then ask people to test it

 The user gets in to finally more relevent details about his mission... I
 wish
 he had brought that to the table from the start.

 >  (12:05:40 AM) DiscordianUK: yikes
 >  (12:06:37 AM) hicham: Edulix: there are online websites
 >  (12:06:42 AM) hicham: that provides these tools
 >  (12:06:46 AM) Edulix: hicham: please tell me =)
 >  (12:06:52 AM) EvilBob: You can't be bothered to test your own bits...
 >  (12:06:55 AM) EvilBob: WOW

 Yeah, a little humer/sarcasm could have been done without the user did not
 seem
 to have translucent lily white skin so I felt it was ok to cut up a
 little,
 seemed like a nice enough guy.

 >  (12:07:10 AM) DiscordianUK: I'm tiring of this
 >  (12:07:58 AM) Edulix: sorry people I didn't ask you why are you helping
 >  me, I just asked a question related to fedora, and if you want you can
 >  help, I think I'm not trolling or anything ?¿
 >  (12:08:20 AM) DiscordianUK: you aren't running fedora
 >  (12:08:43 AM) DiscordianUK: This is f14/f15 support
 >  (12:08:47 AM) bookwar1: DiscordianUK: his question was ok, don't fight
 >  (12:08:56 AM) EvilBob: well this is a Fedora enduser support channel

 I was looking for an online tool for the user to get his info from and was
 failing. I pointed out that it is an enduser channel to hopefully turn the
 heat
 down.

 >  (12:08:58 AM) DiscordianUK: nor do you intend to
 >  (12:09:07 AM) DiscordianUK: precisely
 >  (12:09:13 AM) Fieldy: he got his question answered anyway, i'm sure we
 can
 >  relax
 >  (12:09:20 AM) Edulix: ok sorry. what fedora channel should I use?
 >  (12:09:26 AM) Edulix: Fieldy: sure =)
 >  (12:09:33 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: #fedora-devel

 After not finding the links I was looking for I decided I would pass him
 off to
 the -devel channel where those with more experience hang out and would
 hopefully help more than I could.

 >  (12:09:39 AM) hicham: Edulix: http://rpm.pbone.net/ provides that
 feature
 >  (12:09:43 AM) Edulix: EvilBob: thanks
 >  (12:09:54 AM) EvilBob: Edulix: Let them help you with your mutant
 >  packaging
 >  (12:10:11 AM) Edulix: hehe yeah nice term
 >  (12:10:11 AM) EvilBob: It's really the best place for that kind of help
 >  (12:10:48 AM) EvilBob: Foreign just did not seem right
 >  (12:11:24 AM) EvilBob: Good Luck to you
 >  (12:11:45 AM) Edulix: thanks you people for the help
 >  (12:12:10 AM) Edulix: my next devel question will be asked there for
 sure
 >  =)

 He got the help he wanted, in the end he was thankful, and was happy about
 it.

 >  (12:13:50 AM) bookwar1: it is kind of strange how you create such a big
 >  problem from 1-second-questions here, he didn't make any troubles and
 was
 >  polite enough, why not just answer and forget about it ?
 >  (12:14:36 AM) DiscordianUK: Do you not get that this is an end-user
 >  channel?
 >  (12:14:39 AM) Fieldy: and then, ironically, you extend the issue
 >  (12:14:43 AM) Fieldy: you = bookwar1
 >  (12:14:51 AM) Fieldy: we had moved on
 >  (12:15:03 AM) bookwar1: Fieldy: yes, sorry for that
 >  (12:15:49 AM) DiscordianUK: You don't run f14/f15 or want to you ain't
 >  coming in
 >  (12:16:51 AM) bookwar1: DiscordianUK: this is stupid, and i will try to
 >  participate in the next irc-support-meeting to discuss this
 >  }}}

 I'm going to snip off the added bits that cover fenrus here.

 This is my POV on it I thought I did well helping the user and tolerating
 his moving endgame.

-- 
Ticket URL: <https://fedorahosted.org/irc-support-sig/ticket/100#comment:5>
irc-support-sig <irc://irc.freenode.net/#fedora>
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