Ooops, we made Linus leave : (choices and punishment)

[Eli Wapniarski]

On Wednesday 28 January 2009 12:29:16 Anne Wilson wrote:
> On Wednesday 28 January 2009 00:19:49 Eli Wapniarski wrote:
> > On Tuesday 27 January 2009 21:57:09 Arthur Pemberton wrote:
> > > That's the problem, people want stuff that they can't provide
> > > themselves and goes against what the ones doing the work decide to do.
> >
> > Forgive me Arthur but that's just plain rude.
>
> Nothing rude there.  It's just a plain statement of fact.

Developers that develop for the sake of development really aren't worth my 
time or energy. I as a user and many other users take the time to report bugs 
offer suggestions for improvements and otherwise provide feedback (as you 
indicate further down). Of course a developer can accept or reject a users 
feedback. But dismiss it outright. Excuse me. I don't need to be annoyed and 
if I can't get a reasonable response other than I don't feel like it or its 
boring... welll... (not getting personal and not thinking of anyone 
specifically and a situation I'm sure almost all of us have encountered) I 
personally will dismiss that developer and whatever he is developing as 
irrelevant to me. And all the kudos that kind of ego is expecting for a job 
well done will evaporate.

> > Software is meant to be used
> > by users. If I'm misunderstanding what you're implying by the your post
> > then please forgive me. But even the most intelligent and best informed
> > group of people can make mistakes in judgment. The most famous examples
> > is the Bay of Pigs fiasco.
>
> Not interested in politics.  Please drop that.

Not a political statement. Merely an extreme example as to how group think can 
lead to a disaster.

> > User's can't provide the stuff that developers can provide because they
> > aren't developers. And developers should expect some negative feedback
> > when they don't meet users expectations, or go off in directions that
> > proves to be in error regarding the user experience. This is not a slight
> > regarding the hard work and skill that goes into development.
>
> So a baker that doesn't make your favourite bread is making a big mistake?

If enough people want that kind of bread... Then yeah... it is a big mistake. 
They will take their patronage elsewhere (thanks for all the fish). The bread 
on the shelf will spoil go bad and the shop closes.

> > And no... you can't please all the people all the time. But us users are
> > the ones that actually use that which is developed and we should be
> > respected. That we didn't provide more feedback is our error. But on the
> > other hand, we really didn't have that much experience on which to base
> > an opinion other than the quality and skill that went into KDE 3.x.
> >
> > More than likely because of the great programming that went into KDE 3.x
> > and the hype surrounding 4.x we all were expecting the first release to
> > on par. And a lot of us were disappointed that it wasn't. And in many
> > ways still isn't. But it is definitely getting there.
>
> I think all are agreed that enthusiasm in many quarters did cause hype that
> lead to disappointment.
>
> > To paraphrase Rex in a previous post. There really isn't any point to
> > crying over spilled milk.
>
> I still do not agree that it is spilled milk.  We should agree to disagree,
> drop the subject, and get on with life.

That's what I meant.

Eli

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