DejaVu fonts - Not 108% - Feedback.

Albert Graham agraham at
Tue Jul 18 01:28:57 UTC 2006

See my comments below:

Alan M. Evans wrote:
> On Fri, 2006-07-14 at 11:41, Albert Graham wrote:
>> The bottom line for me is I cannot use this font, because it lets subtle 
>> differences slip by me, I sit about 1 arms length from my 21in CRT 
>> monitor (as I have done for the last 25 years) and I just never had a 
>> problem before now.
>> I understand that technically you  have to do things "technically 
>> correct" but, I'm a human, not a text scanner and that should be taken 
>> into consideration. It really sounds to me like this is a case of the 
>> "specifications" rather then actual real world which we all live in.
> I live in this same world, and for what it's worth, I have no trouble at
> all distinguishing zero and eight on my 19 inch LCD that I sit an
> arm-and-a-half from. My settings specify 10 pt but I also had no trouble
> with 14 pt as you use.

> I'm not trying to suggest that you don't have a problem with it. I
> really believe that you do. But that doesn't mean that the rest of us do
> or even that most of the rest of us do. So your characterization of
> "our" rationale being specification driven rather than human factors
> driven is not necessarily on the mark.

Well, if believe your own words in this case, let's just all agree to 
remove the dot from the 0 altogether! and the entire problem has gone away.

I've seen a few posts on this thread where people are are comparing 
Letter O and Number 0, well firstly, O and 0 are not usually used in the 
same context and when they are, if a mistake is made, it usually does 
not matter, for example, if I say I'm going to pay back that loan of 
$1OOO, you know what I mean, that would even stand up in Judge Judy's court.

However, 0 and 8 are used in the same context in most cases as they are 
both numbers and an error here is much more meaningful don't you agree, 
I mean, I don't want to be forced to pay $1888 do I ?, and in my case 
it's not money but IP addresses (see pics).

>> I suggest that you enable it as default in FC6 as  you plan, but I 
>> reckon it'll be complete gone by FC7, because this forum is going to be 
>> full of support requests that result in "Oh that's a typo, you idiot" 
>> responses to the unaware.
>> Apart from this one show stopper (for me), I really do like the font.
> I for one would have welcomed some sort of screen shot from your system
> that you believe to show the illegible type. Perhaps your DPI settings
> or something are messing with the rendering. Or maybe you have a fuzzy
> CRT. Or maybe you're blind as a bat...[1] In any case, there *are* other
> explainations than that we don't care about human factors.
It's very funny[1] that my DPI never bothered me until I installed this 
font ?, So, If I now have a DPI problem just imagine all those to follow?

There are two screen shots here:

Both these are in KDE (Gnome is not for me  - g-No-Me :)

I would suggest that you ask a friend or partner (a non-technical person 
if possible,) to have a look at the screen shots and see if they 
conclude the same as you, this is, after all the bottom lime).

Also, I'm not really bothered about the font myself, I only installed it 
to get a heads up as it's going into FC6, but I'm no font guru, I gave 
feedback because because it was requested (in the subject line) and I 
really do see a problem with this. I' not 20-20 vision, but I'm not too 
far off.

My solution would be to have a CTRL+NumPad 5 to toggle the dots on/off 
in the middle of the zeros :)[2]


[1] I'm not trying to be funny :)
[2] This time I am.

Here are a few pics of my Desktop PC (Dual Xeon 3.6/2M), just to break 
the monotony of this thread :)

> -Alan
> ---------
> [1]That was meant to be funny.

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