Trends - how to save Fedora ?

Reindl Harald h.reindl at
Sun Nov 13 14:58:09 UTC 2011

Am 13.11.2011 15:30, schrieb Alan Cox:
> LVM wasn't a big deal for those who knew better 
> disable it on install and your disk I/O improves, and
> its become vaguely relevant with crypto. 

yes, this should be only a option and never made as default

LVM is for most peopole not useful especially on a notebook
where you have nothing to extend with a second disk and
remember that you have lost the game if you extend a LVM o
over several disks and of them dies without RAID

> It's bloated
> It picks bad user defaults
> It ships a default desktop which burns CPU horribly

the defaults may be not so bad but way too soon often

>> And what? All the engineers at Red Hat develop new tech in Fedora. Where
>> do you propose those new technologies come from if Red Hat splits off?
> Perhaps the Red Hat engineers could QA their new technologies a bit
> more before including them ?

THIS is the point

making things more ready, delay them if they are not really ready
and stop waste the benefit of opensource which is "it will be released
if it is finished" without a hard timeline would improve things much

> I do think that as has happened a couple of times before now it's time
> Fedora spent a release or two being more conservative on new toys and
> fixing the ones it already has

i would appreciate that every second release would only stabilize and
polish existing features, fying bugs, improve things, overthink defaults

the only component which should be as near on upstream as possible is the
kernel to support current hardware and not like it happened with F14 that
it was unuseable on Sandy-Bridge hardware by not support the network-card
because the hw-identifier was unknown while the driver is the same and
the GUI heavily freezed multiple times each day with the graphics-unit

this was because F14 is hanging around with 2.6.35 and with the changes of F15
you have really no otpion as user - this problem is solved with F15 2.6.40
since months and 2.6.41 currently in the pipeline

now we have sytemd which is a real good thing - in theory, until not
all services are converted, "chkconfig | grep on" does only show sysv
units and so on - the point with "chkconfig" is that it is the wrong
way to introduce permanently new commands like systemctl you must use
because all the well known things are working bader and bader

what users need over the long is stability in commands and get new ones
for really new features but not loose everything they learned ober years

teh acceptatance of new technology will be far better if the whole
behaviour for the user is changed permanently

rant like te one from JB "Time for Fedora to decouple from RH and become
quality UNIX-like distro on its own" are naive and not helpful because most
of are realizing how much of all the things we loved was and are developed
by redhat and how near redhat works upstream (kernel, glibc, gcc..) and we
are knwoing that the fedora-users are a little bit test-toys for the
development - but this should never get too far what happened in the past

there should be a way to minimize the nagetive impact for the users
over the long, bring a little more stability in new releases with not
throwing everything out in the earliest state while not beeing too
conservative, but a little more like the last time

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