Ramblings and questions regarding Fedora, but stemming from gnome-software and desktop environments

[Stephen John Smoogen]

On 5 January 2015 at 09:09, Miloslav Trmač <mitr at redhat.com> wrote:

> Hello,
> > Am 02.01.2015 um 21:05 schrieb Miloslav Trmač:
> > > Here, GUIs _as a category_ (not necessarily the GUIs we are currently
> > > providing) should always be better than CLIs _as a category_ simply
> > > because the GUI can in the worst case just copy the CLI layout and
> > > behavior so it will not be worse than a CLI; and then there are all the
> > > graphics and mouse interactions and shadows and animation that a GUI
> can
> > > do but a CLI can’t.
> >
> > no it can't
> >
> > a gui for "grep file | grep -v x | grep -y | sort | uniq | awk... >
> > newfile" is impossible because you *never* can build a GUI that is the
> > same way flexiable and still useable
>
> 1) This is “application development” in my earlier mail, the other
> category to which the generic claim above was not intended to apply.
>
> 2) Even then, except for the un-specified awk and invalid (grep -y), I
> have just reproduced the functionality in LibreOffice Calc, in about the
> same time it took me to look up (grep -y) and make sure that this must have
> been a typo.  (Cue arguments that LibreOffice is not usable ☺ )
>
>
Cool. Can you explain to someone else how in the world they would do that
in OpenOffice? Because my brain has never figured out how to do it more
than after a couple of days of poking around.

[This can be off-list or a different thread because I would really like to
know.]



> > > So I can see a case for being vocal about “nobody
> > > should need to use a terminal” even now; but that case critically
> depends
> > > on the ability of the community to actually write the better
> non-terminal
> > > interfaces.
> >
> > but you can't and won't use the GUI the same way on remote machines over
> > slow lines
>
> Those slow lines are disappearing, and will be pretty rare by the time we
> get any UI design finished and polished.  Using web interfaces, or even a
> remote desktop connection, from computers or even tablets is nowadays very
> common outside of the Linux world; “we need to use ssh and vim because
> Internet is slow” is, AFAICT, simply no longer true.
>     Mirek
>

Here in the fourth world USA, we aren't actually seeing a decrease in slow
lines but an increase as the oligarchy in control of networks is figuring
out ways to advertise faster speeds but actually only deliver much slower
ones. You can get 200 MB in a short burst and then 4.5 MB and your upstream
is most likely 128kb->256kb. I realize that Europe has a much better
infrastructure these days.. but 60% of Fedora customers are in rural US
regions which aren't as well served.

In any case, for everyone in this conversation. Please please please don't
make the assumption that because X does or does not work great for you
because of where you live etc.. that everyone else has the same experience.
Actually assume it is probably safer to assume that outside of whatever
reality bubble you live in, it is not.

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-- 
Stephen J Smoogen.
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