PEP453 // ensurepip // pip

[Bohuslav Kabrda]

----- Original Message -----
> > I would say this one https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/1351 is important
> > for us
> > as packagers. It makes me nervous/upset and sad altogether :-).
> 
> Awesome, well that’s on the list for 1.6 so that should be the next feature
> release
> of pip.

Cool, thanks a lot!

> > 
> >> having it tied so closely to Python. Also generally about making less
> >> headache
> >> for distros where pip is involved (pip and the OS package manager stomping
> >> on
> >> each other etc).
> >> 
> >> To start off this goal I've filed https://github.com/pypa/pip/issues/1668
> >> to
> >> figure out how pip can get our defaults to the point where most users will
> >> be
> >> installing to ~/.local/ instead of the system location. If there's more
> >> things
> >> pip can do I'd love to know about them, or if ensurepip or the PEP453
> >> processes
> >> have something I can help with too :)
> > 
> > Nice, I have put my two cents in it.
> > 
> On the topic of re-wheeling (Sorry I just joined so I don’t have it in my
> history to reply to).
> 
> I’m assuming Fedora unbundles the stuff that pip bundles (sorry :/) and I’m
> guessing that
> since the Rewheeling is going to pull in the system versions that it’s going
> to pull in a
> copy of pip with those things unbundled. If that’s the case you’re going to
> need to install
> those things into the virtualenv itself.

Just yesterday, I took ownership of python-pip in Fedora and I'm quite surprised that we don't unbundle anything. I'll have to investigate this. It actually makes sense now that I think of it, since the rewheeled pip has worked for us in virtualenv - had we unbundled the bundled code, it would have failed.

> However I think that the copy of pip inside of a venv should keep stuff
> bundled if at all
> possible. One of the reasons we did this was so that when using pip inside of
> a venv
> we don’t make any assertions about what other things you can have installed.
> So for
> example we depend on requests, we don’t want someone who is using an older
> (or newer!)
> requests inside of their venv to be unable to install it because pip itself
> uses it. Also
> another reason we did that is because if you uninstall one of those things
> and it breaks
> pip you don’t really have a good way to unbreak it except destroy the venv or
> install it
> manually. This is less of a concern for the system installed pip because you
> have yum
> or whatever that can be used to fix it and y’all integrate things already to
> ensure compat :)
> 

Maybe the reasons for you to bundle are also the reasons why Fedora's pip doesn't have these libraries unbundled. As I've said, I need to investigate this.

Regards,
Slavek

> 
> -----------------
> Donald Stufft
> PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA