On Fri, Feb 02, 2024 at 12:58:27AM +0100, Kevin Kofler via devel wrote:
Daniel P. Berrangé wrote:
The approved KDE change https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Changes/KDE_Plasma_6 indicates the intent for existing Plasma X11 installs to switch to Wayland during the upgrade process.
There's no perfect answer as some users will be happy to switch to Wayland, while others will not, while perhaps more will not even be aware of anything changing.
IMHO if the KDE Sig wants the upgrade path to take users from X11 to Wayland automatically, then the criteria for allowing back in RPMs with X11 builds should include "no interference with the X11->Wayland upgrade path determined by the KDE Sig".
The BZ ticket indicates that there was some testing to show that is not causing a problem with the upgrades, so it might be a non-issue, but setting clear expectations in this respect would be a good idea anyway.
As I wrote (and confirmed by testing) in the BZ ticket, the packages as submitted already do not interfere with the X11->Wayland upgrade path determined by the KDE Sig, and I do not intend changing that. (Adding versioned self-Obsoletes could possibly theoretically achieve that, but that is a game I do not intend to play. The only thing I care about, which is why I bumped that Epoch, is that the upgrade Obsoletes is applied only ONCE on the upgrade to Fedora 40 and not on routine updates in Fedora 40 or on upgrades from Fedora 40 to later releases, because anybody who still/again has the -x11 packages on Fedora 40 has explicitly opted in and should not have to opt in repeatedly.)
While (as also stated in the BZ ticket) I disagree that it is helpful to forcefully remove the -x11 packages on the upgrade to F40, my packages do not and will not interfere with that process.
There seems to be a way for both sides to get what they want here (note: I am neither, but I hope this might be helpful)
- KDE SIG wants to obsolete X11 packages on upgrade just once - Apart from the impact of that, this is actually standard packaging practice when subpackages are no longer offered otherwise the upgrade will break - If the obsolete indicates the NEVRA of the -x11 subpackage being obsoleted, instead of floating to the current NEVRA, you can actually re-provide the missing package without having to bump epoch - KDE SIG likely also want people to test Wayland, so defaulting to the X11 packages being removed makes sense here - *However* there are quite likely cases where Wayland does not work (yet) or could not work (without hardware replacement) for some users' use cases. These should not be given short shrift - So a workaround for such cases needs to be available - There is also concern that any issue will land on the KDE SIG's laps
This might address all concerns: - Can we make the x11 packages be named explicitly as compat packages (e.g. prefixed with compat-) - Marking them as deprecated is also reasonable. This is standard practice for compat packages - KDE SIG, as part of the Change Proposal, should also document how to install these compat packages so affected users can install them - After a sufficient grace period where people get their -x11 packages removed by default on upgrade, the compat-*-x11 packages should be allowed to Provide: the old non-compat name so people who upgrade later keep their X11 experience intact - This grace period should be part of the release announcement
Does this seem workable? Any feedback appreciated - I try to keep up with this thread but I might have missed some points.
Best regards,