9:26 a.m.
Hi,
I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
this changed...
Zbyszek
9:33 a.m.
I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
this changed...
Hello Zbyszek,
I am not sure if F31 caused the problem, but as far as I know, the
transparent/translucent top bar was removed from GNOME shell 3.32. You
can download an extension [1] and install it using the
gnome-tweak-tool to get the effect back.
[1]: https://extensions.gnome.org/extension/1708/transparent-top-bar/
--
Thanks
Regards
Aniket Pradhan
Byld Member
ECE Undergrad | IIIT Delhi
http://home.iiitd.edu.in/~aniket17133/
() ascii ribbon campaign - against html e-mail
/\ www.asciiribbon.org - against proprietary attachments
10:05 a.m.
On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
Hi,
I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
this changed...
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012bf3...
--
Ernestas Kulik
Associate Software Engineer - Base Operating Systems (Core
Services/ABRT)
Red Hat Czech, s.r.o.
11:59 p.m.
On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik <ekulik(a)redhat.com> wrote:
On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek
wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
> bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
> only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
> this changed...
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012bf3...
And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to bring it back -
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
4:54 a.m.
On Sunday, September 8, 2019 9:59:03 PM MST Tomas Popela wrote:
On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik
<ekulik(a)redhat.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
> > bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
> > only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
> > this changed...
>
> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012bf39
> f3d329cf060035cf
And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to bring it back -
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
Why not just make an option somewhere in settings so the user can simply
decide for themselves?
5:07 a.m.
On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 11:56 AM John M. Harris Jr. <johnmh(a)splentity.com> wrote:
On Sunday, September 8, 2019 9:59:03 PM MST Tomas Popela wrote:
> On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik <ekulik(a)redhat.com> wrote:
> > On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
> > > bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
> > > only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though when
> > > this changed...
> >
> > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012bf39
> > f3d329cf060035cf
> And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to bring it back -
> https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
Why not just make an option somewhere in settings so the user can simply
decide for themselves?
https://ometer.com/preferences.html
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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6:26 a.m.
On Monday, September 9, 2019 3:07:54 AM MST Felipe Borges wrote:
On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 11:56 AM John M. Harris Jr.
<johnmh(a)splentity.com>
wrote:
>
>
> On Sunday, September 8, 2019 9:59:03 PM MST Tomas Popela wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik <ekulik(a)redhat.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the gnome top
> > > > bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar that would
> > > > only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure though
> > > > when
> > > > this changed...
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012
> > > bf39
> > > f3d329cf060035cf
> >
> > And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to bring it back
> > -
> > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
>
>
>
> Why not just make an option somewhere in settings so the user can simply
> decide for themselves?
https://ometer.com/preferences.html
This is precisely the issue with GNOME entirely. It assumes the user shouldn't
have a choice, that some designers know best.
6:32 a.m.
On Mon, 2019-09-09 at 04:26 -0700, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
On Monday, September 9, 2019 3:07:54 AM MST Felipe Borges wrote:
> On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 11:56 AM John M. Harris Jr. <
> johnmh(a)splentity.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > On Sunday, September 8, 2019 9:59:03 PM MST Tomas Popela wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik <
> > > ekulik(a)redhat.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-
> > > > Szmek wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi,
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the
> > > > > gnome top
> > > > > bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar
> > > > > that would
> > > > > only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not sure
> > > > > though
> > > > > when
> > > > > this changed...
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f96012
> > > > bf39
> > > > f3d329cf060035cf
> > >
> > > And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to
> > > bring it back
> > > -
> > > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
> >
> >
> > Why not just make an option somewhere in settings so the user can
> > simply
> > decide for themselves?
>
> https://ometer.com/preferences.html
This is precisely the issue with GNOME entirely. It assumes the user
shouldn't
have a choice, that some designers know best.
Yes, precisely *your* issue. I’d rather someone think for me as far as
defaults go and not give me a quest to set everything up just right
every time I install the DE.
--
Ernestas Kulik
Associate Software Engineer - Base Operating Systems (Core
Services/ABRT)
Red Hat Czech, s.r.o.
6:39 a.m.
On Monday, September 9, 2019 4:32:45 AM MST Ernestas Kulik wrote:
On Mon, 2019-09-09 at 04:26 -0700, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
> On Monday, September 9, 2019 3:07:54 AM MST Felipe Borges wrote:
>
> > On Mon, Sep 9, 2019 at 11:56 AM John M. Harris Jr. <
> > johnmh(a)splentity.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > On Sunday, September 8, 2019 9:59:03 PM MST Tomas Popela wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > On Fri, Sep 6, 2019 at 5:06 PM Ernestas Kulik <
> > > > ekulik(a)redhat.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > On Fri, 2019-09-06 at 14:26 +0000, Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-
> > > > > Szmek wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > > Hi,
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I upgraded to F31 recently, and I now I noticed that the
> > > > > > gnome top
> > > > > > bar is always black. I miss the old translucent blue bar
> > > > > > that would
> > > > > > only go black if window was moved adjacent. I'm not
sure
> > > > > > though
> > > > > > when
> > > > > > this changed...
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/commit/9cfb51c106abd1f9
> > > > > 6012
> > > > > bf39
> > > > > f3d329cf060035cf
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > And there is a MR (with improved heuristics) that tries to
> > > > bring it back
> > > > -
> > > > https://gitlab.gnome.org/GNOME/gnome-shell/merge_requests/404.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Why not just make an option somewhere in settings so the user can
> > > simply
> > > decide for themselves?
> >
> >
> > https://ometer.com/preferences.html
>
>
> This is precisely the issue with GNOME entirely. It assumes the user
> shouldn't
> have a choice, that some designers know best.
Yes, precisely *your* issue. I’d rather someone think for me as far as
defaults go and not give me a quest to set everything up just right
every time I install the DE.
--
Ernestas Kulik
Associate Software Engineer - Base Operating Systems (Core
Services/ABRT)
Red Hat Czech, s.r.o.
Decisions such as this, inspired by the idea that *somebody* knows best, and
it just works for everyone, are precisely why I won't be able to deploy RHEL 8
until KDE is available through EPEL or another repo. Heck, the only reason I
can even run RHEL 8 on my test box is because I manually compiled KDE for it.
This is incredibly common in GNOME, where people just make a decision and try
to enforce it on the users. Things everyone hates, like moving the mouse into
the top-left corner opening some weird menu, and the only way to disable it
being third party software. (Something I've had to provide a fix by default for
on my RHEL 7 deployments, where some of my users prefer GNOME), and where
users request that I install gnome-tweak-tool for them so that they can make
basic preference changes which just aren't available otherwise.
10:51 a.m.
On Mon, Sep 09, 2019 at 04:39:47AM -0700, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
> >
> > This is precisely the issue with GNOME entirely. It assumes the user
> > shouldn't
> > have a choice, that some designers know best.
>
>
> Yes, precisely *your* issue. I’d rather someone think for me as far as
> defaults go and not give me a quest to set everything up just right
> every time I install the DE.
>
Decisions such as this, inspired by the idea that *somebody* knows best, and
it just works for everyone, are precisely why I won't be able to deploy RHEL 8
until KDE is available through EPEL or another repo. Heck, the only reason I
can even run RHEL 8 on my test box is because I manually compiled KDE for it.
This is incredibly common in GNOME, where people just make a decision and try
to enforce it on the users. Things everyone hates, like moving the mouse into
the top-left corner opening some weird menu, and the only way to disable it
being third party software. (Something I've had to provide a fix by default for
on my RHEL 7 deployments, where some of my users prefer GNOME), and where
users request that I install gnome-tweak-tool for them so that they can make
basic preference changes which just aren't available otherwise.
John,
you personal opinions are not providing anything valuable in this
thread. This went offtopic too much, bordering on insults.
Please keep our mailling list productive and civilised.
--
Tomasz .. oo o. oo o. .o .o o. o. oo o. ..
Torcz .. .o .o .o .o oo oo .o .. .. oo oo
o.o.o. .o .. o. o. o. o. o. o. oo .. .. o.
11:31 p.m.
On Monday, September 9, 2019 8:51:48 AM MST Tomasz Torcz wrote:
On Mon, Sep 09, 2019 at 04:39:47AM -0700, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
> > >
> > > This is precisely the issue with GNOME entirely. It assumes the user
> > > shouldn't
> > > have a choice, that some designers know best.
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes, precisely *your* issue. I’d rather someone think for me as far as
> > defaults go and not give me a quest to set everything up just right
> > every time I install the DE.
> >
>
>
> Decisions such as this, inspired by the idea that *somebody* knows best,
> and it just works for everyone, are precisely why I won't be able to
> deploy RHEL 8 until KDE is available through EPEL or another repo. Heck,
> the only reason I can even run RHEL 8 on my test box is because I
> manually compiled KDE for it.
> This is incredibly common in GNOME, where people just make a decision and
> try to enforce it on the users. Things everyone hates, like moving the
> mouse into the top-left corner opening some weird menu, and the only way
> to disable it being third party software. (Something I've had to provide
> a fix by default for on my RHEL 7 deployments, where some of my users
> prefer GNOME), and where users request that I install gnome-tweak-tool
> for them so that they can make basic preference changes which just aren't
> available otherwise.
John,
you personal opinions are not providing anything valuable in this
thread. This went offtopic too much, bordering on insults.
Please keep our mailling list productive and civilised.
On a topic where the decision will be based entirely on opinions, I fail to
see how opinions are not relevant. Further, nothing in that email is what I
would describe as "uncivilized". I'm not asking people to necessarily agree
with me, everyone is welcome to their own opinions, I simply provided mine and
that of the users I work with.
8:35 p.m.
On Tue, Sep 10, 2019 at 12:41 AM John M. Harris Jr. <johnmh(a)splentity.com>
wrote:
Further, nothing in that email is what I
would describe as "uncivilized". I'm not asking people to necessarily
agree
with me, everyone is welcome to their own opinions, I simply provided mine
and
that of the users I work with.
I think your comments went from just being an opinion to being over the
line when they assumed that everyone (except for maybe Gnome developers?)
agreed with your opinion. When you use phrases like "it just works for
everyone" or "Things everyone hates" (to use your exact words), it
marginalizes those who share a difference of opinion. While my own
opinions on many topics don't necessarily match up with those of others in
the Fedora community, I would hope that my comments and opinions would
never make anyone else feel uncomfortable or unwelcome. There is plenty of
room in Fedora for differences of opinion, as long as we try to keep a high
level of respect and dignity for those with different views.
Please be a bit more thoughtful in the words you use to express your
opinions.
-Jared
1:18 a.m.
On Tuesday, September 10, 2019 6:35:39 PM MST Jared K. Smith wrote:
On Tue, Sep 10, 2019 at 12:41 AM John M. Harris Jr.
<johnmh(a)splentity.com>
wrote:
> Further, nothing in that email is what I
> would describe as "uncivilized". I'm not asking people to necessarily
> agree
> with me, everyone is welcome to their own opinions, I simply provided mine
> and
> that of the users I work with.
I think your comments went from just being an opinion to being over the
line when they assumed that everyone (except for maybe Gnome developers?)
agreed with your opinion. When you use phrases like "it just works for
everyone" or "Things everyone hates" (to use your exact words), it
marginalizes those who share a difference of opinion. While my own
opinions on many topics don't necessarily match up with those of others in
the Fedora community, I would hope that my comments and opinions would
never make anyone else feel uncomfortable or unwelcome. There is plenty of
room in Fedora for differences of opinion, as long as we try to keep a high
level of respect and dignity for those with different views.
Please be a bit more thoughtful in the words you use to express your
opinions.
-Jared
Feel free to ignore any such wording that you disagree with. We don't need to
agree in order to discuss such things, and it's alright if we disagree on
wording. Literally every user I talk to has asked me either how to disable the
hot corner, or asked me to do it for them. I obviously did not mean
"everybody" literally, but it's even fine if you take it literally, given
the
context.
Regardless, the suggestion that *somebody else* knows best, and that we, as
users, shouldn't have a choice is just as uncomfortable and unwelcoming to me
as I assume what I said is to you.
Please also see the context of "just works for everyone". It was in response
to another individual's claim that what *somebody* decides is best for
everyone.
- -
John Harris
2:08 a.m.
On 9/10/19 11:18 PM, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
Feel free to ignore any such wording that you disagree with. We
don't need to
agree in order to discuss such things, and it's alright if we disagree on
wording. Literally every user I talk to has asked me either how to disable the
hot corner, or asked me to do it for them. I obviously did not mean
"everybody" literally, but it's even fine if you take it literally, given
the
context.
And I have never had a user that wanted to disable that corner. Of
course, when I introduce them to Fedora, I explain that the logo key is
much easier and most of them use that.
2:45 a.m.
On Wednesday, September 11, 2019 12:08:53 AM MST Samuel Sieb wrote:
On 9/10/19 11:18 PM, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
> Feel free to ignore any such wording that you disagree with. We don't need
> to agree in order to discuss such things, and it's alright if we
> disagree on wording. Literally every user I talk to has asked me either
> how to disable the hot corner, or asked me to do it for them. I obviously
> did not mean "everybody" literally, but it's even fine if you take it
> literally, given the context.
And I have never had a user that wanted to disable that corner. Of
course, when I introduce them to Fedora, I explain that the logo key is
much easier and most of them use that.
Most of the time, I'm asked to remove that, by the users I work with that
actually use GNOME, because they've moved the mouse into that corner by
accident, and gotten annoyed when a menu popped up. I also explain what the
overview is, and tell them that the super key does that as well. That said,
the users I work with are actually mostly using RHEL or CentOS, not
necessarily Fedora.
- -
John Harris
10:57 a.m.
On 9/11/19 2:18 AM, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
Feel free to ignore any such wording that you disagree with. We
don't need to
agree in order to discuss such things, and it's alright if we disagree on
wording. Literally every user I talk to has asked me either how to disable the
hot corner, or asked me to do it for them. I obviously did not mean
"everybody" literally, but it's even fine if you take it literally, given
the
context.
Please consider the possibility of a cognitive bias. Of course everyone
you talk to agrees with your preferences: after all, they just came to
you for help. They know you are technically savvy and opinionated, so
they seeked you, and so it's possible that all y'all gerrymandered
yourselves into thinking that 'literally every user' shares your belief,
even though it's statistically rather improbable.
This is a know phenomenon in social sciences: see a good writeup here
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-02562-z
By the way, speaking for myself, I decided to stop using the term
'literally', because I don't want to be AWFUL (American Who Figuratively
Use Literally :).
3:01 p.m.
On Wednesday, September 11, 2019 8:57:37 AM MST Przemek Klosowski via devel
wrote:
On 9/11/19 2:18 AM, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
> Feel free to ignore any such wording that you disagree with. We don't need
> to agree in order to discuss such things, and it's alright if we disagree
> on wording. Literally every user I talk to has asked me either how to
> disable the hot corner, or asked me to do it for them. I obviously did
> not mean "everybody" literally, but it's even fine if you take it
> literally, given the context.
Please consider the possibility of a cognitive bias. Of course everyone
you talk to? agrees with your preferences: after all, they just came to
you for help. They know you are technically savvy and opinionated, so
they seeked you, and so it's possible that all y'all gerrymandered
yourselves into thinking that 'literally every user' shares your belief,
even though it's statistically rather improbable.
This is a know phenomenon in social sciences: see a good writeup here
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-019-02562-z
By the way, speaking for myself, I decided to stop using the term
'literally', because I don't want to be AWFUL (American Who Figuratively
Use Literally :).
See the last sentence :)
I obviously did not mean "everybody" literally, but
it's even fine if you
take it literally, given the context.
The part making that a true statment being "given the context".
Additionally, I don't tend to use the word "literally" unless it actually
applies. I agree, except for "American" being part of that.
- -
John Harris
2:07 p.m.
On 9/9/19 4:39 AM, John M. Harris Jr. wrote:
on my RHEL 7 deployments, where some of my users prefer GNOME), and
where
users request that I install gnome-tweak-tool for them so that they can make
basic preference changes which just aren't available otherwise.
Just in case you aren't aware, gnome-tweak-tool is an official Gnome
application intended for advanced users to adjust settings they didn't
want to put in the control panel. It's not some third party application
for adjusting secret settings that the Gnome developers wanted to hide.
1689
days inactive
1694
days old
17 comments
10 participants
participants (10)
-
Aniket Pradhan -
Ernestas Kulik -
Felipe Borges -
Jared K. Smith -
John M. Harris Jr. -
Przemek Klosowski -
Samuel Sieb -
Tomas Popela -
Tomasz Torcz -
Zbigniew Jędrzejewski-Szmek